H-what

[rickdesilva]

What is happening to the automobile industry in the US under this administration is a travesty.....Since this administration has taken a majority interest in GM and a sizeable chunk of Chrysler there is no doubt that his agenda is to push them to produce smaller vehicles that no one wants to buy. You can't legislate consumer demand. Has anyone looked into the makeup of the car czar and his team. The 2 people identified in the Wall Street Journal are 33 and 31 years old, no auto experience but in charge of picking GM apart. There are alot of great cars built today that just are not selling. Jon was right when he said its a matter of perception. No doubt that the big 3 are producing world class vehicles but the public does not recognize that. They produce good products but still stink in supporting the dealer in the field. The asian brands do a great job in supporting the dealer and the customer. Thats one of the reasons they are so successful. Its going to take a while for that perception to change and I think its going to take longer than expected because the public has lost its appetite for bailouts. But I will say its a great time to buy a car, so go out and write a check.

[Joe Cannarozzi]

Well I am delighted to be able to help everyone vent with this therapy session, no charge.

Gordon where does the price of gas and diesel need to be to make natural gas a viable alternative? Were gettin close to 3 bucks again. What about hydrogen, there is an abundant element that seems to make sense.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Joe,

There is a reason why we drive the kind of cars we drive and you are proving it.

You want an American made vehicle because in your mind they are more durable. Whatever size vehicle you drive was a choice you made based on a lot of factors. If gas was $3.00 when you bought your last vehicle it might have influenced you to buy a more economical, smaller foreign made product.

We are seeing some government nerds poised to make YOUR next buying decision and they have the weight of the government behind them. They will play with laws (35 MPG), taxes ($5.00 fuel), and other devices at their disposal to shove your next car down your throat.

We use gas and diesel, and not LPG or Hydrogen because it has a lot of energy per gallon and it is still the cheapest fuel. If we went totally nuclear in our electric power plants maybe we could produce inexpensive hydrogen during low power need times, but to put hydrogen or LPG in you tank we need a fuel distribution system the equivalent of what we have today.

To get electric cars to be practical we have many obstacles to overcome, including batteries and range. If you think it is expensive to replace bus batteries, replacing the batteries in an electric car or a hybrid is way more expensive.

Take good care of your current vehicles because in years to come the Smart car will look big compared to what we will be driving to meet the new 35 MPG standards.

FWIW in one of the latest car magazines a comparison between the Honda Insight hybrid and one of the original model Honda Civics was made. The Insight gets 43 MPG on the highway. The old Civic gets 48 MPG. Looks like we are going backwards.

[phorner]

In all honesty, I do believe that there is a small niche where the electric vehicle shines.

As a second vehicle, we have a GEM car (Global Electric Motorcar) which, by the way, is sold through Chrysler dealerships. It's totally electric (72 volts), has a range of some 30 miles and will cruise at 35 MPH. It is restricted by law to roads posted at 40 MPH or less.

Since nearly 90% of our local driving to the grocery store, drug store, bank, restaurants, movies, Home Depot, Wal Mart, etc is within 3 miles or so of us, this little electric car is a viable alternative to driving the Jeep. Now, it doesn't have air conditioning, heat, or even doors for that matter (although you can get them), so I don't see this as a primary vehicle.

But in an urban, or neighborhood, environment where speeds are low, and the necessary range is relatively short, it does the job nicely. I don't know how significant grades might degrade performance, but here in Florida that isn't a factor.

However, in my opinion, the GEM will never replace a "real" car anywhere. There's just no replacement for meaningful horsepower and torque.

So by using this as our "second car", I'm doing my part to offset the carbon footprint of the bus that will be hitting the highway shortly

[Pete]

WAY TO GO ROGER! I agree 100% with your statement. That is exactly why the Russians refer to Americans as SHEEPLE. We are being led to a national slaughter by this presidential genius! This country needs to wake up and face reality!

[michaeldterry]

In all honesty, I do believe that there is a small niche where the electric vehicle shines.

We just bought an electric cart from WheelsTo-Go after seeing one belonging to a fellow camper at the Tom Johnson Prevost Rally in April. While I'm sure it doesn't qualify as a "car", it will sure be nice to have under the bus to help get my fat old handicrippled ass around at our destinations!

Here's a link to thw WheelsTo-Go website: http://wheelsto-go.com/.

We got the optional ramps to load it into the bay and the cart can be plugged in to recharge while we are traveling.

The demo unit we bought shipped on Monday (hasn't arrived yet). Here are a couple of pictures:

[GDeen]

Joe,

The real problem with natural gas fuel is as Jon partly alludes to distribution. Diesel engines have been converted to natural gas use for decades now in certain applications. We had a Cummins 855 TA back in 91 that was a natural gas conversion because it powered a compressor on a natural gas well. Worked great. You have the classic chicken and egg scenario wherein no mass production of LPG vehicles will be built without distribution and vice versa.

My may gripe is this - the current administration is pressing for a transition from liquid hydrocarbons as a primary transportation fuel to solar and wind. No in between steps which is ridiculous. Of all the trillions thrown around for everything you can imagine, funding a distribution system for LPG driven vehicles would get the ball rolling. Don't want government intervention, fine, I agree, but don't disincentivize those who are willing to take the risk and do it in the name of actually making money - the horror! If we don't get a transition fuel that is cleaner and available, we are just going to be legislated out of "real" vehicles that we all crave.

As Roger points out, we are on a fast track to complete control of our lives by the government, and they would like nothing more than to outlaw the fun we have through our hobbies such as what this board caters to. The "doers" are being villified at every turn, and being a taker and therefore in need of the government is the ultimate goal. Energy policy is a big stick to use to accomodate that goal.

[Kenneth Brewer]

Before anyone runs away with that one, assuming an open mind is present, please check with respected sources such as Snopes.com. Just do a search on Obama's birth certificate. There are other organizations that research and validate or invalidate rumors, but I have not heard anyone claim Snopes as biased or inaccurate. Yet. Enough?

Thanks.

[Gary & Peggy Stevens]

Thanks Ken for bringing Snopes.com to my attention... I should have looked there for more facts before I posted..... I knew better than to bring up something about politics.

BUT I am still pissed about who was elected to run this country.

Gary S.

[Kenneth Brewer]

I (usually) don't have a problem with someone's politics; because I have mine, which tends in many if not most cases to be considerably more conservative than other people's, or most people, for that matter.

If one can get through to retirement without being royally pissed off about a presidential election, they have done way better than I have.