Birdland Coach Non-Service - Pogger's Beware

[truk4u]

It's not often we slam some company for shoddy work, but the time has come for this one.

In an attempt to help Gary Stevens with new batteries, I first asked for the date codes of the current Lifelines. Gary was frustrated, since he bought the batteries new on May 29, 2008 from Birdland and they should still be in good condition.

I converted the dates over and here was the outcome:

4 8DL's Dated 8/05
1 8DL Dated 8/03
1 8DL Dated 4/03

So Gary paid for new batteries and ended up with old stuff as much as 5 years old. Birdland charged him full tilt for the aleged new batteries and sent him on his way.

I then talked to Jim Godber, owner of Lifeline and they helped verify the old battery ages and codes. They also tracked down who had stocked those batteries and were the source for Birdland purchasing them. I won't go into anymore detail on that.

Mr Godber than said the batteries have his name on them and he would provide new batteries to Gary at no cost. Now boys, that's customer service you need to remember. Lifeline had no responsibility in this deal, but stepped up anyway.

So the good news, I ordered Gary's new free batteries today and the bad news is, stay away from Birdland.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

I'm going to chime in here. A couple of years ago I had occasion to help a POG member with their new-to-them coach that they bought from another POG member. I know the seller to be an honest person and he represented the coach as having a great maintenance history which was principly done at Birdland. Other shops were involved with the care of this coach, but the issues I will relate were done (not done actually) by Birdland.

There were three serious findings all of which the seller confirmed were Birdland's responsibility. The first was a substantial number of grease fittings were hidden and covered with what appeared to be a combination of old dried grease mixed with hard caked dirt and sand. The new owner and I had to dig that crud away from grease fittings which had not been touched by a grease gun in a very long time. The Prevost requirement is lubrication at grease fittings every 6200 miles. These were clearly not greased in tens of thousands of miles.

The above finding however just affected the coach but the following 2 put the owners of the coach at risk. The first was at least 2 hub seals were leaking and had been leaking for a very long period of time judging by the amount of grease and dirt caked on the drive axle brake drums and on the brake shoes rendering the drive axle braking almost useless. A leaking hub seal for those that do not know eventually coats the brake shoes with a layer of grease. That layer of grease eliminates the friction required for stopping. In the event of a required panic stop that coach would have traveled a much greater distance than the already lengthy stopping distances.

But the ultimate example of a disregard for the customer's safety was what was found when the hub was to be pulled to replace the bad seal. Our hubs are all held in place with large nuts. These nuts not only control the tightness of the wheel bearings which must be a specified tightness, but the nuts hold the hub assembly in place. To insure that takes place there are two nuts, each having its own special washer designed to prevent the nut from rotating loose. The inner nut controls the bearing fit, and the outer nut functions as a double lock in concert with the inner locking washer and the outer locking washer which retains the outer nut.

On the coach in question the outer nut locking washer was completely missing and the only thing preventing the outer nut from loosening was the fact it was tight. Had it loosened and come off it would be followed by the inner nut and at that point the axle and brake chamber which is all part of the hub assembly would have left the coach. This was not a simple mechanical error, but an example of complete disregard for the safety of the coach. The missing washer is cheap. Installing it is as simple as putting it over the axle shaft and then bending a few ears over after the outer nut is installed to mechanically prevent the outer nut from loosening.

Unless you have the ability to supervise the work being performed please only bring your coach to service people that are not going to put you at risk or take advantage of you. There are a lot of great people out there that are trustworthy.

[BoaterAl]

Great post Tom,
Stepping up to the plate by Lifeline re; Mr Godber needs to be posted for several days so all can see when some take advantage others will do the right thing. Good detective work.
I can relate to warranty issues on parts with my NAPA parts business. Birdland might have had some defense if it had only been one battery way out of mfg date. It appears there inventory movement has no movement and were stuck with old product until Mr. Stevens came along.
My battery inventory moved pretty quick at the store but I still pulled any battery over 6 months old as not sale-able.
Jon's advice in dealing with trustworthy shops more then ever today as some shops see opportunity to take advantage.
Even on your own personal vehicles ask for the old parts in the box the new parts came in. My own personal experience was buying new tires for my son and at home found the shop had put on a lower quality tire (same Brand) in place the higher quality model paid for. hmmmmm ......so much for a big sale event

[phorner]

I'm going to chime in here...... at least 2 hub seals were leaking and had been leaking for a very long period of time judging by the amount of grease and dirt caked on the drive axle brake drums and on the brake shoes rendering the drive axle braking almost useless. A leaking hub seal for those that do not know eventually coats the brake shoes with a layer of grease. That layer of grease eliminates the friction required for stopping. In the event of a required panic stop that coach would have traveled a much greater distance than the already lengthy stopping distances.

Jon,

As we know, all braking, and especially panic braking, can generate substantial heat. Do you think that the excessive build up of greasy crud due to the leaking seal can increase the fire potential in a case like this?

If so, that only makes an already dangerous condition considerably worse....

[Gary & Peggy Stevens]

Not only did Lifeline go way above and beyond their call to duty, to rectify the problem with my batteries, but our great friend and Lifer POG Member Tom "Truk4u" stepped up and facilitated this whole process. Without his steady assistance thru this process, I would have just been out of luck.

THANKS TOM FOR ALL OF YOUR HELP.

My bus will continue to wear the "Next Coach Will be a Country Coach Badge" with honor.

Thanks again to you and Mr. Godber @ Lifeline.

Gary S.

[wmoureau]

We used to have work done at Birdland, but we now feel the same as you do.They installed new inverters for us and one of them has not been right from day one, but nothing could be done about it. We don't go there anymore.Houston really needs a good and trustworthy service facility for Prevost.

[Pete]

I will go back to Birdland after my wife does major maintenance on my coach. Been there 3 times and not 1 time was I pleased with the service. The last time was for service on my Aquahot, which I was given a price of $600.00 final cost was north of $1,300.00. I have done maintenance on it since.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Jon,

As we know, all braking, and especially panic braking, can generate substantial heat. Do you think that the excessive build up of greasy crud due to the leaking seal can increase the fire potential in a case like this?

If so, that only makes an already dangerous condition considerably worse....

Having dealt with a number of hub seal leaks on several coaches and leaks which have ranged from long term leaks to single 1300 mile trip leaks I think there is a potential for fire, but likely limited to the amount of fuel (grease) around the hub seal leak. Most of the flamable grease seems to collect in the wheel, at the end of the brake shoes (on drum brake coaches) and on the friction surface. The grease is contaminated with brake dust, sand and dirt unless it is new accumulation so that may impact the intensity of any fire. The grease I can easily envision igniting is the grease on the surface of the friction material which appears as a glaze on the drum and a semi hard glaze on the brake pad.

I still feel the loss of braking to be the most serious concern, but would not rule out the potential for a fire.

[Kenneth Brewer]

Birdland Coach has an A+ rating with the BBB. Were any complaints registered with them? BBB doesn't report any, if so. Otherwise this will probably continue.