Stuck with Progressive

[Yankee802]

Because of the wonderfull reviews and recommendations of the POG members about National Interstate and Explorer RV, I thought I'd go ahead and switch from Progressive. Just talked with Jill at Explorer RV, and she said due to my coach's age (25) I'm stuck with Progressive.

So, anyone have any ideas? Is there anyone else with an older coach and a better insurance company, one they have good claim experience with?

Of course I hope and pray that I NEVER have to file any sort of claim, but it would be reassuring to know if I did, it wouldn't be a problem.

Geoff

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Those of us who do not trade or who own older coaches are all going to be confronted with this situation. I think as a group we are large enough to address this with Explorer and National Interstate.

But let's be realistic. If I was National Interstate the reason I set some arbitrary age as the cutoff is due to the increased exposure. On the new end of the scale their exposure is related to the value of the coach being insured, and to an extent the premiums can reflect that without the owner having big issues. But if you look at the old coach end of the scale the owners are not going to be happy if the insurance company raises the rates to reflect the increasing risk that they may have if the coach is poorly maintained. It probably costs the same to fix an old coach as it does a new one.

There is a certain reality regarding older coaches. They are cheap to buy, but the maintenance is as expensive or maybe more expensive than for a new coach, so I suspect often that maintenance does not get done. Going even further, a lot of our coaches may not even get inspected to verify they are safe and properly maintained. An insurance company will not put itself in the position of accepting some old coaches, while excluding others unless there is a way for them to make the exclusion black and white. Personally I have not been all that impressed with some of the maintenance on some coaches.

I would propose that everyone with a coach that is beyond the age limit for National Interstate to draft a letter to them and Explorer and propose to investigate their concerns about older coaches with the stated goal to set up a program by which their concerns would be addressed.

There is a parallel to this in aviation, not related to the plane but the pilot. Insurance companies want to verify the pilots are sound and they require recurrent training. The insurance company may only ask for commercial driver licenses and commercial inspections of the coach.

[Jim Skiff]

Jon,

I will be forwarding this to Explorer. It is my belief that they should be able to support our entire group with reasonable rates.

Jim

[Jon Wehrenberg]

I just sent an email. Great minds think alike.

[Orren Zook]

I can tell you from previous experience that Explorer's cut off is 20 years. After that age, I was never able to get anyone but Progressive to quote coverage and at more than double the premium cost.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

I would think that as a potential for opening a discussion with Explorer and National Interstate we need to get a listing of all POG members who have coaches from 1991 and older. It would also help if those owners could identify who they are currently insured by, and what the premiums are.

The only way to know if we do get into talks with the insurance people if they are heading in the right direction is if we know where we are.

To use an aviation analogy, the insurance companies that require recurrent pilot training can justify their demands with lower premiums. However, if the insurance companies that have no requirements charge $1000 more in premiums, but recurrent training costs $2000 then the cost benefit analysis must be done. It might be National Interstate may reconsider with some conditions such as coach inspection that costs far in excess of what the difference is between them and Progressive.

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

Classic, collector and antique vehicles have had a similar problem and we may be entering that realm with the Prevost of the earlier vintage.
There are specialty Insurers that may be interested in us as a group.
Older buses will end up costing more to repair as the availability of parts becomes difficult to acquire. This is not the case yet, but it surely will come into the picture.

The conversation on this topic thus far is pointing to faulty or the lack there of, of proper maintenance as an issue as to why the Ins is not available for older buses. Is there any evidence to substantiate this? Those of us with a bus that is say 10 years old and keep it up to snuff will not change when the bus becomes 20 years old, if they are still the owner.
Conversely if an owner does not keep his bus up and continually drives a bus within the age limits for insurability, that does not mean he will be a better or safer ins. risk. I think the age of the vehicle has very little to do with the insurance risk and is just some arbitrary number, similar to the age requirement that some campgrounds have, the one year expiration of prescription drugs and the "good until date on food stuffs".
I would like to see the possibility of being insured with the same company I have been with and have had a good history with, when my bus was within their age requirement, when my bus exceeds their age requirement for insurability.
I feel a bad driver can just as well drive a brand new bus and be a far worse insurance risk than a good driver of a bus with the basic up keep maintenance found on most that are in regular use. This is just my opinion.

This is a good topic for any/every POG member. You all have ideas and opinions, lets hear them. There have been comments in the past that the posts are too much about maintenance and technical topics, well now is your chance. Join in, if we all revert to LURKER STATUS there will be no reason to belong. It is every members responsibility to supply CONTENT, even if all it is, is "that's nice" or "way to go"!


JIM

[Woody]

For what it's worth we are insured with Victoria through Gilbert RV Insurance Co at a very reasonable rate. They did require an appraisal for an agreed value on our 1990 Aongola.

[phorner]

Is there any possibility that we could get enough members interested to shop for insurance as a sort of co-op? Kind of like a group insurance plan. Perhaps as a group we could get coaches covered regardless of age due to the number of members.

[ajducote]

This subject may become very important to many of us in future years. The one thing I would like to ask is, would a "safety inspection" by a state agency or some recognized inspection system suffice to show that the bus has been maintained to some degree? Thinks like air brake check, brake drum and pad thickness, tire tread depth, etc. I know commercial trucks get spot inspctions at some weigh stations. There must be some mechnism to could produce a report that the insurance companies would accept.
It would not matter if house systems were not up to "Kevin" standards, as long as "safety" related items were up to snuff.