40' or 45' Question

[m stuller]

Niles: I drove a 40 foot Bluebird for years and have recently moved on up to a Liberty 45. My personal experiences is that there is very little difference in mileage, manaoverbility and parking between the two lenghts. My perspective on size is bigger the better. You never have enough storage while traveling, if you plan to live in it a while the extra space is worth the trade offs that have been mentioned by others.

Ideally, you dont want to buy a few coaches to get what you want. The cost of buying and selling, taxes and fixing items you will break in learning how to operate the coach is expensive. Do your homework, fine a coach you love, then look at others to insure its the right one. All coaches have a heart and soul. If a previous owner loved her, took care of her and treated her well, in all probablity the coach will serve you well. However, buyer beware, if your prespective coach was rode hard, abused and neglected you will be in for a real heart ache. There are to many complicated mechanical items that you dont want to be replaceing.

I also always say, pray over it, He wont misguide you!

Matt

[Jeff Bayley]

Gary-

Currently I'm punch drunk from little sleep which is a good think becuase the Grey Goose I bought (for Martinis) got wasted on Vodka and Cran Cherry (Ocean Spray, got it try it) so I'm all out except for Jack Daniels, Crown Royal, Captain Morgan and Seagrams and for some reason I don't have the pallet for anything but Vodka (The Cran Cherry spoiled me) so I guess I just have to stay awake if I want to keep the buzz going.

Thanks for correcting me, It is in fact a 1994 not a 2004. That was a typo.

I'll sell me 1997 Royal and go back to the 1994 Angola becasue I like that coach better all the way around. Back to floor plan talk. I like the kitchen better in the Angola, both couches lay down instead of one in the Royal, there is twice the storage with no apparent loss of space. It's got a nifty hideaway toaster and built in coffee maker, (neither on this coach). It's got Granite tile instead of some ceramic stuff in the Royal. It's got automatic pocket doors instead of manual pocket doors and as silly as that sounds I really like that feature. It's got 4 roof airs instead of 3 like this coach (and most others I think all have 3 airs instead of 4). It's got a 20kw gen instead of 17.5k on this one. It's got a 42" TV which I was able to make fit nicely due to the N/S layout of the bed instead of the cross queen. It's got better lighting. The list goes on. I should just list them both for sale and keep which ever one is left over.

Anyway, the above is not just a shamless plug on the Angola which I love but also to point out to Niles how many little things can make a difference. In my case, I knew a lot more about what I liked and didn't like after I got into my second Prevost and I'm not sure if all the neck rubbing and hand wringing in the world can prevent you from seeing other coaches and saying "Oh, I wish I had that or this". There is something neat on almost every coach I've been in that I would put into a "dream coach" if I were to have one built. Example: The Angola has a trash compactor and this coach doesn't so empty a small kitchen garbage bag twice a day usually. I walked onto an Entertainer coach yesterday at Prevost in NJ and they had a nifty trash shoot which appeared as a little door in the kitchen counter but went into a 40 gallon bag down in part of one of the bays. I thought that was cool and it would get rid of the garbage can in my kitchen.

The features and workmanship on most of the enterainters I've been on is every bit as nice as the main stream converters. If I were ever to have a coach bulit there is no question I would get an entertainer company like Senators to build one for me. It would be several hundred thousand dollars cheaper than the "name brand" converters and you know what else ? They make those coaches more durable to take the abuse of the knuckle head bands they carry around but they still look just as nice inside. I might think about buying an Entertainer and leaving one row of 3 bunks in place and ripping the other bunks out and remodeling half the coach. The company that builit it would be the obvioius place to have it remodeld. The Enterainters have smaller galley's and bathroom/shower combinations (to make room for all the bunks) but I like the size of the small bath and kitchens in favor of extra room elsewhere. The prices of the used Entertainers is lower than the "Star Coaches" which is what they call our floor plans and sufficientley lower that I think it would offset the cost off the remodeling. I think the supply and demand is on our side if buying an Entertainer.

Ooops. All that talk kind of watered down my stuff I guess. Anybody got a compelling reason against this idea ? I'll tell you another thing. I don't think those buses get neglected when it comes to maintainence because when I've met the drivers at the Prevost shops they are completely benign to the service cost. They don't pay it. They just pull in and say "fix this and fix that and make sure it's all perfect". I think this is one of the reasons the rest of us private owners take it up the short hairs with the Prevost service bill. Those drivers just sign and drive and they outnumber us 20 to 1.

[garyde]

Hi Jeff. At the last POG. There was a round table discussion with 3 Converters. They all said the entertainer buses were stripped down versions of a Private Conversion. They did not have the same Generators, Tanks, Wiring, Plumbing, Heating, etc. as the Private Conversions.

[Jeff Bayley]

Hey Gary-

I guess I would say.......consider the source. Did you say that the information came from the converters ?

Next time your at a Prevost location getting parts or service just find some of the Entertainer buses either inside the shop or in the parking lot. Drivers are often with them and are friendly and will let you look inside. I don't think you'll find them as described. They all have 5 roof airs and 20kw generators for one thing. The ones I've been in have all had fine wood work and counter tops and nice lighting and they all have kick ass sound systems and video and top notch sattalite and jacks for plugging in computers to use the buses on board Wi-Fi and stuff like this. I don't know how many major players there on in the Entertainer industry but I know there are a butt load of them in Nashville and I think that is the Meca for the Entertainer business which is one reason you'll find one of the 5 Prevost service centers there. It is the only service center I've never visited. Entertainer companies don't go after building coaches for private owners as that is not their niche but I'm pretty sure they would make one for someone if you just brought them your own floor plan or told them what you wanted. Personally, I'd like a bus with one set of bunks in it. The bunks convert to either sleep two high comfortably or three high with a bit tighter space as you would expect. When you consider that these things sleep up to 12 people you can imagine how the floor plans are laid out for maximum efficiency and not an ounce of space is wasted. The last one I saw was made by Senator which is a big player.

Just look inside a few of them.

[Joe Cannarozzi]

Gary

I would agree with Jeff.

Ours started life as a VIP charter and it has exactly all the same components as all the big motorhome converters install.

[Ray Davis]

Actually, I think at the round table, at least one of the guys was just a service facility, not a converter. He had experience working on all types of units, both entertainer and motorhome alike.

I believe the comments were that although they put in much of the same stuff, the workmanship is not up to par with the converters. They sited the fact that the entertainer units are pumped out in a matter of a few weeks.

I believe much of their comments were directed to onboard electronics and wiring of the bus.

I don't know if it's true, by any means, but it was the consensus of all three on the panel that the entertainer busses are not built up to the same quality as the main line converters.

Ray

[garyde]

I should clarify a little. LibertyCoach Sales Rep, Parlament Coach Service Rep, and l believe a Zimmerman Rep or Prevost Rep were at the Round Table meeting. We were discussing the differences in length with the Entertainment buses as well as the Conversions which are used at NASCAR for the VIP drivers, etc. The comments were many of these buses are not built for Continuous use. They are designed to be driven from event to event and parked and opened up. So, they re not engineered like the Private Conversions which can be lived in full time. I am sure many of the entertainment buses are ok for private use, if they were originally designed for such a purpose.

[Ben]

I don't think the Zimmerman guy was there... instead it was someone from excaliber coach... he used to work for Prevost and now does coach modifications... I don't think he actually does any actual conversions... more like after market slides, etc.

[Ben]

If someone were to buy my Prevost today, I'd be in one of these tomorrow:



After reading "The 4-hour Workweek", I figured out how I could live on something that small. You can check out the details at EarthRoamer.com. Now I just have a plan a bit more before I put the bus up for sale.

[garyde]

Hi Ben. That looks like a Dingy to me. Who says you can't have your cake and eat it too!