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Looking at a Country Coach bus with 2 aftermarket slides. The bus is a '99 but I need some hand holding about the 2 slides. Any and all input on the slides and
on electric zip Dee awnings?
The bus is clean, low miles [a plus and a negative] and I already hate the slide side bay doors. They hinge at the bottom.
Thanks from a newbee for all your input in advance.
Larry
Have you got a link?
As a general remark, if there is something that you already HATE, i'd listen to that. What slides are they?
Hmmmm.
Larry,
Welcome to the Forum, you have come to the right place for info. I'm not a slide fan, but I would really dig into the conversion and learn as much as possible. The aftermarket stuff can sometimes bite you in the butt. We do have folks here with slides and maybe they will jump in. Gary?
Larry,
Welcome to the POG forum, the opinions here are varied but the concern is genuine.
I like slides, I would not have a coach without them. That being said, I would shy away from after market slides. But that's just me. I am not mechanically inclined, and I tend to shy away from trying to repair things that I am not familiar with (like slides).
Let me say that in my opinion, Country Coach makes a fine conversion. Serveral of the POG members own CC, and they are very well satisfied. That being said, I would like to ask you a few questions.
Did Country Coach install the slides, or were they installed by an after market company? It is important to have someone solid to fall back on it you have a problem. Who built the slide rooms, HWH, Valid, or someone else? Are they hydraulic or electric? The electric slides are considered to be better than the hydraulic because in the event of a failure they can be pushed in, by hand, easier than hydraulic.
I have hydraulic slides in my Newell, and after 9 years the only repairs needed have been to change 2 hydraulic solenoids (about $460 installed). I would prefer to have electric slides, but since they were installed in later model year coaches, the cost is higher.
If you dislike the way the bay doors are hinged, then I would pass on this coach. Buy a coach that you are 100% in love with! If everything is not right, or can be made right with minimal expense (carpet, fabric, etc.), then I would just pass on it if I were you. After all, you are going to be spending a great deal of money, get what you want - no compromises! Someone said, the quality remains long after the price is forgotten, and I believe that is true.
Hope that I have been helpful to you. Please PM or email me with any other questions.
Thanks for the reply. I should have said that these slides are Rouge/HWH electric slides for Country Coach. NOW, they work fine. I didn't see any sort of slide topper to shield away debris except for two Zip Dee electric awnings that operate separately from the slides and would not do a very good job. I haven't been able to chat with the current owner [a consignment bus] and I can't find anyone that has experience with these slides.
As for the bay doors, why couldn't they be mounted hinge forward [at a cost of course].
The Zip Dee electric awning are an unknown as well. I have and like the manual ZD but have no knowledge of the performance or reliability of the electric units.
Probably should pass on the bus, but I would hate to pass if there is a chance that with some homework I would find that there is nothing wrong with the slides.
Thanks for the help, Larry
Larry, If you have not already read them, do a [search posts] for: golf bags. You are asking about a CC and we were discussing a Marathon but the concerns were similar. My $.02 there are enough buses out there that don't have to be modified to make you happy. :) JIM
DOES: maxbeer=MASCERVASA? :p
[spell check]
:( Hi Larry. The thing about slides is, if you have a Bus that was enginered to have two large openings in the side of the Bus and not have structural failure, you would be right in purchasing a Prevost with Slides.
When a manufacturer alters the skeletal structure to create two large openings, they have in effect voided the engineering .
Now if Country Coach has endorsement from Prevost , and engineering drawings or specs ,then you are on a more sure basis to evaluate the Bus.
The Slide engineering which Prevost has developed belongs to Prevost. It sounds like what the Country Coach has is not Prevost,and is not Country Coach but a third Manufacturer.
Can CC stand behind not only the work they did but also the integrity of the Prevost frame?
Finally, the value of these Buses ( retro slides)has shown to be a negative in terms of resale. Gary
Larry,
Welcome to the forum. I have a 99 Country Coach 45XL that I am very happy with. With granite tile floors and other misc inventory and tools I am at the GVWR without slides. I think a valid concern for you is the weight of that coach without your personal belongings on board. I think the after market slides add a lot of weight to a chassis that might not have been designed for the slides.
Larry,
This is a case where you need to be a doubter. Jim makes and excellent point about weight, and if you are serious about pursuing this coach have it weighed, not only front to rear, but side to side. Converters arrange the components in the bays to offset the added structure with slides. Unless this coach had slides fitted before the conversion it may have a problem, and even if the conversion was done after there still may be a problem.
I know nothing about how the slides were engineered, but I do know that since Prevost introduced their first slide about 7 years ago (or less) they have modified the design three times. A little voice in the back of my head suggests that if Prevost is struggling with the design of slides, the engineering challenge is not going to be easily addressed by a small company that doesn't have access to all of the Prevost know-how.
I believe the company that built the slides has gone through some changes, and its successor is now located in Angola, IN. I would find out what kind of support they offer.
Do you suspect the collective opinion here is to tread slowly and carefully on this? You will be taking a very big risk.
There is something rattling around in the back of my memory, which I wouldn't trust all that much on this topic.
When the first aftermarket slides were being marketed prior to the Prevost slides being installed at manufacture, the issue of whether or not the Prevost shell warranty would be violated came up. As I recall, PCC deferred the issue because they were coming out with their own slides at the time which were in fact warranteed.
As others have posted, PCC has gone through 3 iterations of slides since the introduction of the first pin-activated slide. The one they showed at the latest Tampa Super Show is very different than the first PCC-issued slide; miles apart from the various aftermarket slides.
Probably the quickest answer to your question would be to pick u the phone and call Country Coach and ask them about the coach, especially if you have the slide converter's name.
Pretty tough to beat the system here, especially with slides. If it is too good to be true, it usually is.
Larry,
You have been given several good suggestions regarding slides and I would like to give you our viewpoint. The best suggestion, in my opinion, is to go to the converter and HWH and ask a lot of questions.
This is what I can tell you first hand. We have HWH slides in our Vantare. They have been in and out at least 50-60 times since we have owned our coach and we usually store our coach in our building with at least the salon slide out. We have never had an issue with them getting "stuck" in or out. If you follow the correct extension and retraction protocol, they have always worked. The previous owner related the same experience and he and his wife traveled the country with this coach. The only slightly negative point we have seen is that if you retract the slides when they are wet they will squeak just a little until they dry. Not annoying and not for long. Other then that, no increased road noise, the coach is steady, balanced, and drives like a dream. I personally thought our H3 and our Liberty had much more road noise with the built in cabinets in the stateroom rattling :rolleyes:
It is just logical, that if you cut holes in the side of a coach, you will have to install extra bracing and support. We used to have a Featherlite Trailer dealearship that our son-in-law managed. Many times customers would ask that a side door be installed for vending, etc. When re-inforced properly, the side door was never an issue and we never had a trailer returned for that reason.
Is there a certain risk involved with a coach with slides--sure. Is it a greater risk then any other conversion issue--I don't know, all I can say is that it has not been for us.
We have also been told by a well known converter that when Prevost wanted to engineer their own slides they asked HWH to come on board with them and work on it together. For whatever reason, and likely we will never know the real reason, they parted ways and Prevost decided to do it themselves.
As with any new engineering change the only true test is time. I would ask as many folks as I could who DO HAVE PERSONAL experience with owning a slide coach what type they are and what their experience has been. Law of averages may give you an accurate idea of the positive and the negative.
Best of luck with your search and please share the news with us when you find the one that "fits":D
Larry,Quote:
Originally Posted by JIM KELLER
Jim brings up a very good point; weight. As I understand, the slides can weigh from 800 to 1000 pounds each depending on their size. As other have posted, the addition and location of this weight is important. Also, added support is necessary to reinforce the structure which can not be done after the coach is assembled. So the result would be a bus that would not be adequately reinforced to receive the slides.:eek:
To ALL that replied to my query, Thanks Very Much. All good info and just the type I was looking for, no BS , just straight forward answers---Great.
I have not joined this group for sometime, delaying because I wanted to own a bus first. And I apologize for jumping in and bringing up a subject that I'm sure has been beat to death. Glad I didn't wait. My wife and I set up a set of 'pros' & 'cons' on the bus in question. I believe the 'cons' won out. Other than the slides, there were just too many negatives, for us, that entered into the mix.
We are continuing our search.
Thanks again, Larry
MAXBEER = ?
• Largest beer distributor in the area.
• Reads Maxim while enjoying a frothy libation.
• Relates to reason for gut size.
• Originally favored MAXwell house then made the switch.
(Welcome to POG, where there are no secrets).
Mike
Bob Lee, if I remember made a total of six 99 Shells with them installing the slide rooms, all kitchen slides (not as deep as what Prevost is doing now) complete with drive locking pins. Two for each slide room located towards the top on the sidewall. I always considered these slides a prototype for what Prevost does today. Very good slides, I even believe Prevost came down to CC to look at them. Country Coach called these six coaches a 2001 model. This was just about a year before Prevost came out with theirs.
Since you are saying your looking at a 99, I believe Panterra Coach, Bob Makin of Angola, IN had a double slide room CC bus that he installed the slide-rooms, at the Prouds pre-rally in Charlotte. I remember the bays doors as you describe.
Sorry, but I know nothing of these slide-room installations. But, if they are Bob's, he would be more than happy to educate you on the process. :)
Larry, Didnt you just love Mango Mikes welcome !
Look at www.kenrobertsonrv.com on the internet. He has two great looking Prevosts for sale. One is a 99 Country Coach with a side isle which we almost bought. The other one is a Liberty previously owned by Mango Mike.
Shall I explain 'maxbeer';) or leave MangoMike in suspense?;)
Larry
Opps! Got carried away with the smiles, sorry, still checking out on this forum.
Larry
No matter what your decide Larry, apparently you and Mango have an interest in beer. Mango's interest can be seen on numerous posts showing CK.
Jim, you say you are at GVWR without slides on your CC XL45. What are the axle weights of your bus? A friend's '95 CC XL40 has a front axle wt. of 14100 which really surprised me. My current coach, a CC Affinity has a front axle wt. of 16500.
I'm a weight nut, so with the possiblilty of an over weight problem, that seems to me good enough reason to pass on aftermarket slides.
thanks for the info.
Larry
Corona: The official MAXbeer at Mango Mike's
Attachment 950
Larry, I looked at Mango Mikes official MAXbeer girl and forgot your question ! I will get back to you on those Axel Weights !
Jim, I understand!!!
Larry
Larry & Jim,
What?
Larry, our Country Coach 45XL weighs 48,460 without slides. GVWR for the coach is 48,900.Quote:
Originally Posted by maxbeer
Since we had one, I kept track of the CC coach numbers. And yes they had 2 HWH slides installed. The rooms were steel framed, weighed alot, and there was a 4 inch beam of steel welded to the driverside undercarriage from steer to driver tires to support the kitchen slide externally. We dragged it on several occasions. Also had internal underbelly bracing as well. The first salon window behind the driver was blacked out, so not to see the framing supports for the kitchen slide. Loaded with goodies, fuel and water, we weighed in at 51,860 lbs. We were over front axle. Heck, we were over everywhere!
They are:
60441 (former CC Club PreZ Ray Stevens owned this 1st, traded at Lazy Days)
60446 )Brian Wilson owned this one the last time we saw them at CC rally Las Vegas, March 2003
60447
60449 (Our 1st bus)
60450 (Bob and Terri Lee were the 1st owners)
60451
60442 (is a 2000 model year "H"3-45, no slide)( CC made around 11 "H"3's)
There were also other CC "H"3-45's, some with slides and some not
Coloradobus, You sure know your Country Coach history ! What do you think about Bob Lee being at the Helm again ? It was my understanding the Country Coach part of the company was profitable. We are very happy with our coach. The workmanship has always looked to be of a high quality no matter where I look.
99 Country Coach 45XL 60382
Hey Jim,
We are glad that Bob is at the helm again. National RV was sucking Country Coach dry, literally!!. Consequently, the R&D on the new Rhapsody showed that lack of $$$$. With Affinity in the stratosphere of pricing, where the Lexa once was, I don't see the need for another level of coach before the XLII.
We liked both our Affinity and CC XL. The Affinity was a custom order, but MPD superceded. Our CC bus had prismatic paint all over it with swirls, twists, and was a show stopper, as all CC bus paint jobs are. The prismatic paint just applified it further.
The CC bus with the "HWH" slides was h-e-a-v-y. Too h-e-a-v-y, and it drove like it. The CAFE' electric bay doors under the slideroom were problematic. They were engineered so you couldn't pry them open. Good when they worked, but...... Other drivability issues made the full disc brakes, the speed sensitive steering, the double pane windows etc., made the XLII more attractive. So, we traded the XL for the Marathon XLII. Then we decided Slides were not for us, we traded for a No-Slide "H". We have had this coach for 28 months now. The longest we have owned a coach. Its our favorite! 28 months ago, we went to Texas to see Country Coach "H"3-45, 60442. Buddy Gregg had it. Unfortunately, we decdied it had the wrong owner. Brian had a 2000 Marathon "H", and that's what we bought.
Having Bob Lee back at CC, I hope will give a boost to CC like, when he returned in 2002 for a short stay. Both He and Terry are wonderful.
We wish all the best for CC.
We usually go to the March CC rally, but not this year. We need to stay near to gut the house we close on in a week and to oversee building a new and bigger barn. Maybe, we will have room to be a multiple bus owner like Mango:D That's gonna get me in trouble. We already own 4 Airstream trailers and a B Van.;)
Jim and Chris
2000 Marathon "H3-45", Coach 0586EXV, with de-commissioned Data Storm Internet Dish
No matter how big that barn will be, you might as well recognize right now that in a very short time it will be too small.
Yes, Maybe, We are looking at 50X65 with the 14 foot doors. The Morton Building guy is coming next Wednesday to survey (eyeball) the lot.:)
Jim, the only question I have is how many horses are going to be in your new Morton barn????:D And Jon is correct, they are never big enough!Quote:
Originally Posted by Coloradobus
Guess time will tell if we go to the Palm Springs Auto auction again. 2 years ago got us a 1969 Cadillac convertible, last week yielded a 1979 3/4 t pick up with a 460 with 46,000 miles on it. It is like new, all documentation came with it. It was built in and lived in Califonria all its life. A Ford dealer in Hawthorne Ca had it on it's showroom floor. We drove it home, me in the coach towing Rover and Chris following behind in the truck, We will tow the '79 Airstream with it this summer.:D
We will have RV parking for a few coaches with full hookups, tho. (50 amp)
Yeah, we know all about "the barn is not big enough" . Currently putting up one that is 50 x 100 so as to house the bus with trailer and still be able to load- unload inside. At first it seemed too big and now that it's getting warm enough to pour concrete in sw colorado, the staked out area seems too small.
Don't forget that pit in the new barn.
Lessons learned the hard way....arrange the doors and access so every vehicle has its own door and can be moved in or out without having to move another vehicle. In addition to making it big enough, make it tall enough.
Put electric outlets everywhere. If you do not have internal posts, drop them from the ceiling. Ditto with air lines.
If you have better lighting than the average hospital has in its surgeries, you almost have enough.
For the bus and the Airstreams... nothing is as nice as having water connections nearby, RV electrical connections up to 50 amp, and sewer connections. Priceless.
Jim Kellar,
I just remembered that the "HWH" slide CC XL's must have the rooms totally removed to replace the air bladder.
The "HWH" slideroom brand in Marathon "H" sliderooms must be removed for air seal replacement. Its a costly repair.$$$$$$$$$
Maxbeer,
Jim was a valuable resource here for me about a year ago when I was looking at one of those very same CC Prevosts. In the end I passed on it, and I'm very grateful for all the info Jim was able to supply.
Michael
As is the case with any project, you find there are many things to add. If you can place one or two strategic 50 amp Pin sleeve style recepticles in the Barn, then you can buy a 100 foot cord and a 'Spider Box' which has the ability to plug in different types of recepticles and loads all in one portable Box. I use them all the time in my buisness and they are a very flexible way of providing power cheaply to a large area. Gary
Well Gentlemen, We have officially forgotten about the 2 slide CC. Don't care to buy trouble. Thanks to everyone that posted your thoughts on the subject.
I have zeroed in on a CC XL45 '99 non-slide bus. A quick question, most '99 buses I see have 470hp engines and most 2000 buses have 500hp engines. What changed? Is this a basic series 60 that has had the computer program changed to 500 hp or is something more complex going on?
Would anyone, beside MangoMike be able to notice the difference in normal operations?
Thanks for the help, Larry
Maxbeer, My 99 Country Coach has a 500 hp dd. I think some of the 98's also had that same motor.
Jim, was the 500 hp engine an option or has the engine been upgraded?
Larry