Appears that about 60 production people were let go and that Camping World has acquired the service facilities of the company.
Unverified at this point, but thought y'all ought to know for what it is worth.
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Appears that about 60 production people were let go and that Camping World has acquired the service facilities of the company.
Unverified at this point, but thought y'all ought to know for what it is worth.
Vantare/Featherlite did let go a number of people around 3 months ago. I was just at their service center in Sanford, and Camping World HAS NOT taken over.
I left there 3 days ago, and the same people were still working under the same management. I do not know anything about their other facilities.
Good 'nough.
Like I said, it was just scuttlebutt.
Thanks.
OK Bum Dope nock off the skuttle butt and get back to chipp[ng.
Jeff this is not Scuttlebutt. It is a fact according to some legal friends of mine. Soon you will be able to buy sewer hoses and RV supplies right there in Sanford Florida at the Featherlite site, soon to be Camping World. Camping World is in an acquisition mode across the country and it appears Featherlite is letting go of an asset in return for some cash that they really need. I know one poster said he was just their for service but some of the service guys are being relieved of their duties as we speak. All of this from sources that would know.
Sorry everyone if I mislead you in an earlier post. When I was there I asked the service people if there were going to be any changes. I was told no, and none appeared to be happening last week. However, the post from Five-O sounds like he is in the know.
Does this mean that Camping World is going to now do service for Featherlite? That is a scary proposition given my luck with them in the past on a stick and staple motorhome.
"We are excited to have this new relationship with FreedomRoads/Camping World and to be able to take Featherlite and the bus conversion industry to the next level of customer service,"
You have got to love how the press releases spin things. I bet all you Liberty owners are worried that Featherlite is going to put Liberty out of business now that they have Camping World handling their service.
Does this mean we maybe able to get 315's tires from Camping World?
Camping World, you gotta be shi----- me!:eek: Having had the pleasure of a one time Camping World experience with a plastic CC, I can tell you to run the other way. When I inquired about the need for the pink boiler antifreeze for the Aqua Hot, the tech told me just use the pink stuff in the store that they use for winterizing RV's, it's the same stuff!:(
Can't wait to hear about the first POG experience with a Featherlite at Camping World... They wouldn't know a 315 from a trailer tire. Can you imagine a PP at a Camping World service center.:D
Quote:
Originally Posted by truk4u
What you don't buy this statement?:confused: "As we roll out this new relationship, the first Camping World stores to receive training for its sales personnel and qualified service technicians from Featherlite Coaches"
It is an odd marriage to say the least. The only advantage I see is ; A. Once they have trained personel, they will have more service centers than others, B. They will have more locations to display and possibly sale their product. But, It still sounds like Walmarting to me.
Come on Jon, let's hear about Liberty and how they are shaking in their boots.
I think this is the 5th Prevost conversion co. they have taken under their wing and screwed all of them over.
Like I said...'just scuttlebutt....'
Since I am not on the "inside" I have no clue what is going on. But as an outsider watching the developments over the past year or two I see a company imploding.
When Featherlite was sold recently it was alleged the new owners of Featherlite paid to get rid of Vantare. Then recently it was reported Vantare was dumping inventory. That sure seemed true when they were advertising new conversions for less than $1,000,000. Imagine how that affected customers that had just purchased a new coach.
Now it appears they are dumping real estate, and painting that as a wonderful expansion of customer service. I'll just bet Liberty is quaking in their boots.
As Vantare is one of the larger converters there will be a ripple effect. Current owners will see their coach values depreciate even more than coaches normally do. I would presume service will suffer because I can't envision Camping World ever developing the expertise to tackle some of the more complex problems, and I would guess the survival of Vantare for the long term would be questionable.
This has got to be a tough business, and over the years I have seen a lot of converters go away. Among them just from memory are Executive, Angola, American, Pacific, Legendary, Thompson(?), Vogue (Featherlite owned), and Royale. It wasn't that these converters made a bad product, it is a difficult thing to make a good product, sell that product and then support that product as the customers have come to expect. The Marathons and Libertys of the conversion business work hard to succeed and for anybody to stand alongside of them they really have to have their act together. It is my guess that the formula Marathon and Liberty use, which is to have a well engineered, standardized product that is supported to the highest degree possible makes survival in this business a very tough challenge.
These are only my opinions so I will just sit back and watch.
FYI, I spoke with Steve Bennett regarding Thompson this weekend (you mentioned Thompson as a possible going out out business).
According to Steve he had spoken with Rick Thompson, and he is still very much in business. I understand, however, that he will no longer be building "spec" coaches, but only coaches to order.
Ray
Well, here's the press release...read at your own peril:
SANFORD, Fla. November 27, 2007; FreedomRoads/Camping World and Featherlite Coaches, Inc. today announced a new exclusive sales and marketing relationship that appoints FreedomRoads/Camping World, the nation's largest RV retailer, as the exclusive nationwide retailer of Featherlite Luxury Coaches. The parties expect sales and service operations to begin at certain FreedomRoads/Camping World sales and service centers in mid-December.
"We are very excited to announce this new relationship with FreedomRoads/Camping World because it gives current and prospective customers of Featherlite Coaches' luxury motor coaches access to sales and service centers throughout the United States," said Conrad Clement, CEO of Featherlite Coaches, Inc. "As we roll out this new relationship, the first Camping World stores to receive training for its sales personnel and qualified service technicians from Featherlite Coaches' personnel, and to have Featherlite Luxury Coaches in stock, will be San Diego, CA, Statesville, NC, Mesa (Phoenix), AZ, Indianapolis, IN, Stewartville (Rochester), MN and Sanford, FL," added Mr. Clement.
In the later part of 2008 and beyond, it is anticipated that Featherlite Coaches' sales and service will be available through FreedomRoads/Camping World stores in Las Vegas, NV, Chicago, IL, Portland, OR, Denver, CO and Salt Lake City, UT, as well as other strategic stores throughout the United States. "This exclusive sales and marketing relationship with Featherlite Coaches presents a great opportunity for FreedomRoads & Camping World, as we now offer our customers access to recreational vehicles at every price point in the market," said Marcus Lemonis, Chairman and CEO of FreeomRoads & Camping World. "We are excited to have this opportunity to sell luxury motor coaches manufactured by the undisputed market leader in the premium luxury motor coach segment," added Mr. Lemonis.
Featherlite Coaches, Inc. will continue to manufacture the highest quality state of the art Prevost® coaches in the industry at its manufacturing facility in Sanford, FL. "We are excited to have this new relationship with FreedomRoads/Camping World and to be able to take Featherlite and the bus conversion industry to the next level of customer service," said Jim Wooley, President and COO of Featherlite Coaches, Inc. "Both Featherlite Coaches, Inc. and FreedomRoads/Camping World hope that all of Featherlite Coaches' sales and marketing personnel will be able to join the sales and marketing staff at FreedomRoads/Camping World to continue their wonderful effort in marketing and selling our great luxury motor coaches," added Mr. Wooley.
“Our commitment to this venture is to have Featherlite Coaches secure and hold a clear position as the market share leader in the bus conversion market. We will in short order look to double the annual volume through a trade up program or the capture of customers by creating a unique value proposition unavailable from anyone else,” said Mr. Lemonis.
About FreedomRoads & Camping World
FreedomRoads & Camping World is America's largest RV and outdoor retailer serving a brisk and growing demand for the RV lifestyle. After having successfully co-located for several years at selected locations, FreedomRoads, a dynamic national network of well-established local and regional RV dealerships and Camping World, America's largest direct marketer and specialty retailer of RV and outdoor camping accessories, service and RV sales, joined together to provide consumers with greater choice, convenience and value. Today, with revenues exceeding $1.7 billion, the company serves RV enthusiasts with more than 130 retail locations.
In addition to the sale, finance and service of recreational vehicles and specialty retail, FreedomRoads & Camping World also provides expanded products and services to enhance and protect the RV lifestyle. This includes: the President's Club customer loyalty program; in-store Performance Centers featuring RV and Car Insurance and Roadside Assistance Service; Camping World RV Institute technical certification/training program; Goodwill Ambassador Program; and the new campground discount program, Camp Club USA.
About Featherlite Coaches, Inc.
Featherlite Coaches, Inc. is the premier manufacturer of luxury motor coaches in the United States. It manufactures two distinct luxury coaches, the Featherlite Vantaré® H3-45 and Vantaré® XLII, both Prevost® bus shell conversions that offer travelers the utmost in luxurious living accommodations, interior choices and leading-edge technological features. Featherlite customers are encouraged to participate from the earliest stages of design and production of their luxury motor coach, choosing from more than 200 amenities and state of the art options. Featherlite manufactures its luxury coaches at its facilities in Sanford, Florida, and it is the "Official Luxury Coach of NASCAR" with many of the NASCAR Officials, top drivers, owners and sponsors using Featherlite luxury coaches.
In a quick comparison, that appears to be identical to the link posted earlier in this thread http://www.fthrc.com/news_detail.cfm?news_id=139, although the date is different.
Ray
Cynic that I am each time I read this I get a sense of what was not said.
Does Vantare have unsold inventory? If the six locations listed are all going to have inventory was this deal structured to get that unsold inventory off the Vantare books and onto the CW books?
It reads like this business plan is going to spread the sales outlets for conversions across the country. What is silent is that even without all these new sales outlets I suspect anyone anywhere that wants a coach is somehow able to buy one and get it serviced. Since it is unlikely the size of the market for conversions is going to be changed by this business model, exactly whose customers are going to migrate to the CW outlets?
Will Vantare coaches sold at CW get equipped with the ever popular chinese awning lanterns? I wish I could watch this unfold as an insider. Somehow I cannot see a triple slide H3 sharing the same sales lot with a 26 foot Jayco. And how will it work when the customers are torn between the pop-up with the Coleman AC roof air and the XLII with granite floors. Something doesn't seem right.
Jon,
This reminds me of my stay at Beaudry's in Tucson. I booked a space there for a couple of days and they ask me what kind of coach I have. Then a couple of days later, a really nice lady calls to confirm my reservation and mentions that they are a Prevost conversion dealer and would I be interested in viewing their coaches while we were there.
I said, "Sure" as I was as curious to see the new coaches as I was to hear the sales pitch.
And of course, they call me the day before we are due to arrive to make sure we will be there and ask me when I would like them to come by in the golf cart and pick me up.
The guy shows up in the cart at the appointed time, picks Rae and me up and heads for the showroom.
He then asks, "Well what kind of RV are you interested in?"
I say, "Well you just picked us up in front of our Prevost, so I don't think we are interested in trading down and your people called me about looking at your Prevost inventory, so why don't we do that."
He hems and haws then pulls in in front of the showroom and heads inside. We cool our jets.
After about 5 minutes (it's only 110 outside), he saunders out of the place with his long face on and announces, "Well, you know it is Sunday and they don't let us have the keys to the Prevosts, so they are locked up and we can't get to them and can't get anyone down here to unlock them for us."
Now this guy told me he was a former CEO of some company and had retired to Tucson and in looking for something to kill the boredom, took up RV sales as a hobby and had been the top salesman at Beaudry's this last year.
Now, I don't think this guy knew crap from fat bacon about a Prevost and I figure a trip to Camping World to buy one will produce a story not too many versions removed from the one I just told.
This will end up as a booger CW won't be able to fling off their finger.....
Jerry. Juxtaposed from your story is the visit the California POG group had while parked at Beaudry in Tucson for the night on the way to (POG III) Keerville. A white table cloth Filet mignon & Salmon dinner accompanied by a selection of wines, followed by a Chocolate desert . Preceeded by a tour of 4 new Prevost XLII Country Coaches (2006,2007) and a new Prevost XLII shell. The finale was the offer to let one of those babies go for 900k.
I would be interested in hearing what the Vantare/Featherlite customers are thinking and saying about this. This new arrangement for sales and service is being spun as a great thing, but as a customer another entire level has been inserted between the buyer and the manufacturer. It is difficult to communicate, so when you insert someone in between the customer and the manufacturer how do you address design issues, quality issues, customer response, feedback, and especially how do you protect customer loyalty?
If you ever want to see how easy it is for a sales agent to misrepresent a product review the ads for Prevost Coaches on sites such as RV online or RV trader. I have seen Prevost Conversions listed there with Spartan chassis and I have seen them listed with Cat engines. I am certain the salesmen are equally ill informed about the rest of the coach.
It is a rare Prevost Conversion buyer that has no knowledge of RVs. So at the very least the new sellers of these coaches need to learn them and not just expect to BS their way to a sale. And how are they going to handle trades, repairs, and issues relating to the chassis. I know that if I buy a new coach there is a dividing line between the chassis and the house, but I also know that the converter has the clout with Prevost and acts as my agent in being sure I am satisfied. Are these various sales locations going to get the Prevost training and also be able to interface with Prevost to satisfy the customer?
In every business I was in the momentum of the business was created by customer loyalty. The repeat business and the long term relationships drove the business. We worked very hard to maintain that loyalty and we never used sales agents to talk to long term customers. We spoke directly to the customer and put a lot of effort into the relationship, because if we lost that customer the work required to get a new customer was overwhelming. I think this is a dumb move for both companies and they can spin it any way they want.
Look how many Legendary Coaches are still listed for sale, and how long they have been shading the blacktop at dealers. I think the buyers of conversions take all this into consideration and then vote with their feet.
Jon, I think your comments hit the mark. I am also interested in hearing the comments from current Vantare owners, who stand to gain or lose the most with this deal.
I would also like to hear comments from someone considering the purchase of a Vantare and how this is being factored into their decision.
Here's another article from RV Business today about the joint venture of Vantare/Freedom Roads.
FreedomRoads Aligns with Featherlite Coaches
RV Business
Friday, November 30, 2007
FreedomRoads/Camping World recently announced a partnership with Featherlite Luxury Coaches Inc., designating the national dealer network as the conversion bus builder’s exclusive sales and service outlet.
According to a press release, the parties expect sales and service operations to begin at certain FreedomRoads/Camping World sales and service centers in mid-December. Featherlite’s line includes the Vantare H3-45 and Vantare XLII, both Prevost bus shell conversions, which were previously marketed and sold through factory direct outlets.
Featherlite Luxury Coaches was formed in October of 2006 following the merger of Cresco, Iowa-based specialty trailer builder Featherlite Inc. with Universal Trailer Holdings Inc., Cincinnati, Ohio. Former Featherlite Inc. President and CEO Conrad Clement remained in control of the luxury coach division and runs the operation with his son, Tracy.
"We are very excited to announce this new relationship with FreedomRoads/Camping World because it gives current and prospective customers of Featherlite Coaches' luxury motor coaches access to sales and service centers throughout the United States," said Clement, CEO of Sanford, Fla.-based Featherlite Luxury Coaches.
Clement said his company is sending sales and service personnel to selected FreedomRoads/Camping World locations. Initially, stores in San Diego, Calif., Statesville, N.C., Mesa, Ariz., Indianapolis, Stewartville, Minn. And Sanford will stock the product. In the later part of 2008 and beyond, it is anticipated that Featherlite Coaches' sales and service will be available through outlets in Las Vegas, Chicago, Portland, Ore., Denver, Colo., and Salt Lake City.
"This exclusive sales and marketing relationship with Featherlite Coaches presents a great opportunity for FreedomRoads/Camping World, as we now offer our customers access to recreational vehicles at every price point in the market," said Marcus Lemonis, chairman and CEO of FreedomRoads and Camping World. "We are excited to have this opportunity to sell luxury motor coaches manufactured by the undisputed market leader in the premium luxury motor coach segment.
Whos next?
The question you asked Joe is a significant one.
There is a ripple effect and when a product is devalued as legendary has done and which has supposedly happened with some recent Vantare sales, and before that some American 40 foot convesrions it slops all over all the products in the market.
If anybody is on the edge right now, its going to get tougher.
I agree with Jon, I saw a couple of very nice 2006 XLII with two slides and excellent equipment that were sold by Legendary at the $650,000 level.
Every time I look at a new coach I think about the Legendary price and work from there. That and how happy we are with our Royale will make it hard to trade. Dee told me if I sell the Royale for a 45' coach I better get use to a 22.5' bus. She said that half of everything would be missing.
I wonder what she meant?
If you look back at the last 30 years in the RV buisness & the Bus Conversion buisness you will notice there are not many of the same companies around as in 1977. If there is anything to be understood about this industry is that it is a natural progression for these companies to change , consolidate, morph, & evaporate.
The other side of the coin is to look to the new & progressive buisnesses who are introducing new and innovative products.
The premium for the purchase price on a Liberty and Marathon, new or used, for a buyer that considers long term converter support important, continues to become more and more justified as time goes on. Their market share has also just been improved, again.
I believe that the lions share of potential buyers would fit this description.
The asking price for a new or used bus by any other make should not compare and with good reason.
Not to say that all the other buses out there are bad choices. Quite the contrary. For mechanicly minded folks, who tend to keep things a while, and do not view the issue important it offers tons of value when looking there.
I think if potential buyers of any bus that is not Liberty or Marathon make sure that the purchase price reflects this fact they can be confident of a good decision.
That and the quality of components and construction combined with a decent level of owner mechanical ability, or support from POG:rolleyes:, makes a great combination too.
Are there any other converters out there who could jusifiaby be compared, or is it just, THE BIG TWO?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Cannarozzi
Joe, you and others make some excellent points. Having said that, will Liberty and Marathon, The Big Two as you refer to them, keep raising their prices again and again? Liberty, IMO, already asks inflated prices for their coaches vying on the fact that the service end and support are there to help you forever and ever amen. For folks that feel they have to have this, that is an excellent choice for them. For others who work on their own coach, have a good team of support businesses locally, how important is spending that extra 100K?
Personally, I am waiting to see what becomes of all this with Featherlite/Vantare. If they take their service and sales people from across the country and set them up and train the new folks then who's to say this will be a big negative factor? It may open up more convenient service and support across the country. (I can see Jon groaning and calling me a pollyana:-) As far as lowering the value, maybe the new coaches are already over valued? As with any market, sometimes a big change needs to happen to bring pricing back into reality. It happens in the horse industry all the time. If anyone remembers what happened with the syndicated Arabian horses in the 80's they will know what I mean.
We have owned two Vantare conversions and have enjoyed both of them. One was an H3 the other that is for sale is an XLI. Both were very well constructed, have nice floor plans and design, and any support we ever needed from Vantare we received prompty and effectively. I am just waiting to see how it all plays out before claiming the sky is falling. It may very well fall, who knows? It also may end up not being that big of a deal.......
Debi
Deb
You ever heard of or seen another Hickox other than ours?
Me neither.
We resemble my remarks quite a bit.
Our converter along with a long list of others including Angola and Royal just to name a couple put together a great product and now because of that have greater value in the hands of someone who has the ability to own and service one without that extra support.
As for there price differences who's to say? I think the market will dictate that. Hasn't it been posted here before that it should be a 10 or 15% discount for a bus from a defunct converter?
Combine that with the premium for a purchase of one from the big 2 and that could reflect as much as a 25% difference between the two products. Many of the off brand converters used ALL the same components and the quality of construction was also very comparable.
IMO ours, now 22yrs old, will be around just as long as any current new, non-Prevost camper as well as many Liberty and Marathons of the same vintage.
I'm knocking none, just trying to add to the discussion. For us if money were not so much a factor I'd be looking at Thompsons and Marathons, polar opposites:confused:
As for Vantari/Featherlite I do not think they should be placed in the defunct catigory when they are still in buisness and there are a whole bunch of new Featherlight owners that just took advantage of some really great prices.
Scuttlebutt Update:
It seems that the culmination of the Featherlite deal with Camping World was to have happened on January 15, with a kick-out date of January 17, 2008. From the grapevine only--it seems that Camping World has had a change of heart and has decided not to proceed with the arrangement.
You'll have to make 2 stops; one for a coach and another for the Japanese awning lanterns.
Let's look for updates as they occur.
Paulette and I were at Featherlite/Vantare in Sanford last week and talked to a salesman for about an hour. He made a coulpe points about recent developments. He said Featherlite/Vantare had sold several new coaches for less than $1m, because they had an abundance in inventory and having an "Inventory Reduction Sale" made good business sense.
He made a point of the fact that although scuttlebutt was that Featherlite would now be selling million dollar coaches on the same lot with horse trailers, this was not a fact. They would be completely separate divisions. I will admit that I didn't see any horse trailers on the lot.
When I mentioned the fact that many customers prefer Liberty and Marathon because of the level of "Customer Service" and trained technicians, he indicated that they are fully aware of this issue. He said they had just hired two of Liberty's best technicians, and one of their top priorities will be to train and staff all locations with professional technicians and sales personnel.
Of course, I agree that he would have been a nut to say negative things, but I'm just passing on what I was told. Time will tell.
As a side note, I was at Marathon in Florida also, and I made a genereal statement about the beautiful paint jobs on the Country Coaches. The salesman said they realized that CC had some of the best paint schemes, and they have recently hired CC's lady paint designer to head Marathon's paint division.
I am on my way to Sanford, FL right now (actually in Brunswick, GA right now). I have a service appointment at Featherlite Monday morning. I guess i will get the scope then. When i talked to the service manager in early January to schedule the appointment he had no clue what to expect by the end of the month as far as any changes with the management of the Sanford facility.
There were two Marathons (1-H3-45, 1-XLII), and two Featherlites (1-H3-45, 1-XLII) at Barett-Jackson. I toured all 4 Buses and spoke to the salesman for both. Marathon salesman was very cordial and eager to sale me a Coach. The Featherlite Sales people were vertically challenged and incapable of putting a handful of words together. Both had sales prices of around 1.6 mil. posted.
Any news on Featherlite and the deal with Camping World?
I just got back from FL on Saturday. We had a weeks worth of work done on the coach. The service was excellent and they took care of a couple items that should have worked when we bought the coach at no cost even though it was an as is sale. I did ask my service rep what was going on with Camping World and he said he unfortunately had no idea which he did not think was a good thing. He said they are all set up to become Freedom RV employees but as of now they are still getting paid by Featherlite. He said the switch was to be Jan 1st then got moved to Jan 15th and still nothing yet. The service bays were all full and there were about 10 coaches camping at the dealership on there way back from the Tampa show.
On RVONLINE a new Featherlite H3 is now $999,000.Does this mean that there is a change in their marketing plan?
That coach has been on their lot for a long time. What I dont understand is that Featherlite has Robin McCracken listing these but appartently cant keep up with what has been listed. For example the bus on RVonline right now that says SOLD for 975K has been listed and relisted and relisted and after awhile marked SOLD. Then as we roll by we would see the coach for sale on the lot. Remember the 2.5 million dollar bus? I saw many times over the internet that the bus sold but it could be found on their lot still for sale. Now I am not speaking as of right now, but I can say within the last year they plastered over the internet a bus was SOLD when it was not. I think the strategy is to get people talking and show that they are moving units when they may not be. Again I cant say for a fact about anything current but I can speak of what I saw in the last 12 months. I think they think people will forget what is listed but I have found the RV world of buyers to have good memories.