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Been studying and pouring through all of the information I can as I get close to making my final buy decision which will be either Vantare, Marathon, or Liberty. I was curious of some of the "real world" input on the H3-45 vs XLII (setting aside price difference). I keep going back and forth on which one I like better but was curious about this groups input as I am sure you have gone through this same thought process. Thanks in advance.
Brent
Brent, I think many of the members have a prejudice against the H3 simply because it is not stainless. Go back and look at some of the posts that chide the owners or prospective purchasers of these coaches. Personally I like modernistic looks of the H3 but I own a XLII. My bro-in-law had owned several Prevost coaches and when I decided to buy one he advised me against the H3. He told me they were not as good for resale. Actually I don't think that is an issue. I do like the idea of the proven durability of stainless but the upkeep may be more time-consuming, especially with models having exposed rivets (Mine!) In the end I think it is a matter of personal preference but I am sure you will get many more responses to this question. You know the old saying, opinions are like ---holes, everybody has one! Good Luck, Darl:rolleyes:
Don't take all of our smart a$$ remarks as anti H3. Some of it is just ball breaking...except when we pick on Mango. That's real.
I am a newbe to Prevost World and the real gurus will weigh in after they wake up this morning--not to belabor the obvious:
H3-45: bigger, taller bays--probably a better choice for full timers for storing all the "stuff"
Taller coach overall--watch out for the overhanging trees. The XL's height is more in line with conventional RV's.
Not sure which has the greater CCC but this might be important to you.
Hmmm.
I don't think this is a case of what is 'better' universally.
In one form or another the H3 series has been around much longer than the XLII; originally in the H3-40 introduced in the late 1980s, then the H3-41, which basically a Canadian tour bus. In chassis year 1995, Prevost bumped the engine up to the Series 60 in a 45-foot configuration. Some technicians consider working on an H3 to be much easier as many of the components are easier to reach, more accessibility and so on. So it is a tried and true shell with a deep historic record of durability. The IFS introduction in 2000 was a bumpy (literally) conversion, but that has largely been ironed out and after the recall, these coaches should be as reliable as any prior to IFS or post-recall units.
Prevost dropped the XLV coach because it cost too much money to make. Each stainless panel was hand-riveted and (one must surmise) the technology of the H3 plastic with some stainless glued on was the compromise. Not to confuse but to provide information, some XL's were made in both the 40 and 45-foot versions after the XLII introduction, but not many. So you could see a 2000 XL/XLV and 2000 XLII.
Being mindful that the primary design considerations overall in shells is for use as a seated coach, the H3 provides much more 'viewing' area in the front from which to gawk at the sights of a tour. That translates into a taller coach when used in a motor-home application and much larger and taller bays below.
The XLII appears to be the logical and more modern extension of the 'silver sides' XL Mirage, which Prevost has been making since 1981 in various forms. So it has a more traditional look and feel to it.
As in any coach selection, it comes down to personal preference and the conversion, budget, intended use and so on when making a personal decision.
Some folks love both the XLV and H3-45 and own both.
So there you go.
Brent, I think all you need to do is buy the one you think about the most over a week period. There is a reason you are thinking of that style or bus more, you like it better! If after you run it for a few years you find your needs change then you sell it or trade it in for the other. No one here can sell you on which one would be a better choice, good luck and trust your gut! ;)
As a newbie Prevost owner myself, I'm not sure that I have a wealth of kowledge to pass on to you.
Personally, I just happen to like the more "classic bus" look of the XL stainless....
It was difficult enough trying to decide between 2 XLV's !!!
Anyway, we did look at a couple of H3-45's and, although they were beautiful busses, the ones we happend to see appeared to have less interior storage space than the XL's that we looked at. Probably not representative of all, since they're custom built.
Also, the height was someting that I personally didn't want to deal with, although I'm sure the actual difference is probably not a big deal. I've been told that the H's actually drive better in a cross wind than an XL, but that was second hand, I don't know that from personal experience.
Bottom line is, we never did find a bus we didn't like, so I'm sur you'll be happy no matter which modelyou choose.
Hope you enjoy your new bus no matter what you might choose!!
Thanks everyone for your input. so many choices...hard enough getting down to a particular manufacturer (down to 3 for me)...and then you throw in floorplan and colors, etc. (dizzying). Clearance is certianly an issue as we like to hit the state parks, etc. with our young children (where we can fit of course).
Finding a place to store this thing is as hard or harder than picking style, floor plan, etc. not much to work with here in Austin, Texas.
Brent
Now now Brent, thats an easy one....You just buy a ranch in west TX. and put up a building. ;)
Brent,
This is the best part of Prevost ownership - the hunt for the "perfect for you bus". You're making the very important first step in ownership, letting this group know your intentions and pumping there knowledge base. Of course everyone thinks there bus is the best and it probably is based on their use, preference and personal style. (Except of course mine which really is the best bus out there (either one)).
Having spent 30k miles in a '97 Liberty XLV, 12k miles in '00 Marathon H3-45, and 1,200 miles in JDUB's XLII Marathon here are some observations.
• The H3 is just plain massive with a clearance of 13' (13' 10" with cb antenna). It just dwarfs you standing next to it - the Binford 10,000 in Tool Time Tim units. If you need bay storage this is the answer. Even with Bus Air you still have two full bays for storage or to import illegal aliens for your burgeoing jerk chicken chain. Many Harley guys like the H3 as with low handlebars they can roll the HOG right into the bay without modification.
Height is an issue you have to be aware of. On the Taco Tour I trip from San Diego to DC, we decided to stop in Memphis and tour Beale Street. I can attest that the city is ringed with numerous railroad bridges all at 12'6".
We must have diverted traffic at least 8x as we backed away from one of these low bridges before finding the single high route into town. Low hanging branches are a constant threat and you have to be aware.
Note: This is one of my favorite low bridge Bus stories. Names have been withheld to protect the parties involved.
http://www.prevost-stuff.com/coaches/bad-airport.htm
There are more steps and a 90 degree turn involved in entering the H3, loading does take more an effort, so make sure your wife takes an extra turn on the stepmaster at the gym so she's ready when it comes to provision for a trip.
The set-apart drivers seat is a mixed bag. If you want to get away from the family (especially if your family is populated by teenage girls) then this can be a blessing. You're down in your cockpit in your own little world - not a bad place if you enjoy driving alone. However if you're the type of driver that enjoys a lot of company this may not be the bus for you. With JDUB at the wheel I spent some time in the co-pilot seat. Compared to the XL it's very uncomfortable as your feet dangle. There is a dash mounted air powered pop out foot rest, but I've found it not very useful. A portable step would be the answer. When traveling in the H3 hardly any family member uses the co-pilots seat (although it maybe they don't want to hear dad ramble on).
With no opening windows in the front (except a small electric toll window) the bus is very quiet. My wife says she can sleep on the bed while traveling.
Huge windows. Although you have to aware that not all H3's have the same number of large windows on the side. Some, including a lot of Liberty's, are one short per side.
'97 Liberty XLV
Since it was the first bus, it was the families favorite.
The first comment from the girls upon viewing the H3 was "Dad, where's the shiny metal". Now I would never admit this in public but I do miss the stainless myself. A lot of non-Prevo people would complain about the hassel of keeping all that stainless clean but as my favorite Texan explains "there's no price on envy" and in a campground cleaning that stainless was never a chore.
Best co-pilot seat in the business, even the XLII has about a 4" step down to the floor, which causes some feet dangle. If you want to be part of the action the XLV and XLII is the way to go.
In my opinion the series 60 XL's up to 2000 is one of the best buys in todays market. (disclaimer - I have one for sale ;) )
XLII
A great marriage between the two. If you're not obsessed with bay storage or need the Binford 10,000 13' height. The large windows emulate the H3 and surprisingly the H3 is about 1 1/2" higher in interior height at 82".
You have the clean exterior look of the H3 with frameless windows and you have the coveted stainless, which to the untrained eye says bus conversion.
As for interior layout JDUB's 2001 Marathon and my 2000 H3 Marathon they are identical. No advantage for either model, you just have decide which drivers layout you prefer.
Brent, I would also add the Millennium to your list.
And no matter what you finally choose at some point you'll be changing. According to Broker Phil Cooper the average Prevost owner keeps the bus for only 18 months, so you'll likely be joining the TBC as some point down the road. Right Ray?
Mango Mike
Very good write up Mike, I'm glad you step in with this, you know first hand and not trying to side either way.
Additional points:
There's been a lot of talk about the ride differences H3 vs XLII. Unless someone has a more tuned butt then me (step right in here Jon as you have the most tuned butt I know), I could not tell any ride difference between the two.
Now you have to take in account that during my 1200 mile test ride in JDUB's new XLII we had massive amounts of ballast on board that may have affected ride quality (insert your own interpretation of ballast here).
Thanks Dale and nice Avatar!
Mike
What idiot would pull a stunt like that?Quote:
Originally Posted by MangoMike
The whole idea is planning, going through the checklist. Make sure you know where you are headed before you're there, right?
thanks agian everyone...not to get off topic I am wondering what impact the economy slipping a couple of gears will have on the new coach sales and if it is something I should wait out for a while. I am probably pushing my luck with everyone but does anyone recall any of the other economic soft spots and how it impacted new coach pricing...if at all?
Brent
brent@fxfn.com
Mike, great post! Your observations regarding the differences between the XL, XLII and the H3-45 sound right on target.
Thanks for all the insight....
Not too much more to add. I coveted the stainless on my wish list when looking for a Prevost. The H3's are quite beautiful and striking as well. The floor plans on the H3 are different because of the drivers seat being low in front. I believe the H3s have a more defined living rm and galley.
My XLII is 12' 7" with the satelite dome so not much difference in height.
I would say storage down below is the advantage on the H3 .
When looking back, I did not know much about Prevost nor the difference between H3 and XL Coaches. But I had owned several Plastic Custom Paint Coaches and really fell hard for the look of the XLII. Still feel that way although Liberty has some beautiful H3-45's on their Web site.
At Prevost in Mira Loma, I spoke with a Bus driver of entertainment buses. I asked him what he prefered to drive. He said the XL was preferable to drive but the H3 was better when Parked. So there you go.
Mike makes the relevant points. Here is the seat of your pants one.
When you meet an H3 on the Interstate, at 1/2 mile it looks like all the other plastic coaches.
When you meet an XL or XLII at 1/2 mile, it looks like Prevost, no mistaking it for a Winnebago. Unless you saw a hole in the side for a plastic vent and put some roof airs on it........
I'm like Gary. I loved the classic look of the stainless and unless I needed to haul a gaggle of pygmies, I am a happy camper with the XLII. Oh, and the XL that I own as well.........