Fat Lady Sings! Mango's New H3

We need coloradobus here, he's owned both and should be able to qualify the driving questions....

Michael

Exactly. Chris and Jim, Where are you guys? Snowed in?

I think most of the differences have been addressed, but from my perspective (driven the older XL, the newer XL and the H), here is the scoop.

The H has an outstanding ride. Better than the vintage XL? Yep. $300K better? Depends. The H will win against all comers with respect to wind noise as the lack of sliding windows in the door and driver area make this a non issue. In fact, if it were practical, I would replace my entry door window with solid glass. Mine isn't "way noisy" but you can hear it. Or maybe the door just fits better. Also, the view out of the H windows is panoramic.

Yep sitting lower gives you a little different view. Is it noticeable? Not after about the first 100 miles. The H has more of a cockpit feel, where the XL is less busy. However, because of that set up, the switches are all real close. Neither Mike nor I really liked the integral gauges in the dash. The overall resolution is not as apparent and I have to stoop to see the higher ones as the glare shield blocks them (if you are 6'6").

I really like sitting on the same level as the passengers as in the XL. In the H, even the person riding shotgun sits a little taller than the driver. This coach has a nifty air extending foot rest that comes out of the dash. Way good for me, but I could see a person with short legs not being happy. Or the seat would need to adjust down real far, so I didn't explore the travel limit on it.

I would install a rear view mirror in the center pillar on the H windshield. I have one on the XL and it is convex so I can see everyone or every place in the front of the coach. It just makes conversation easier (or at least for me).

We never drove in any heavy wind, but that will have to factor into the equation because I can tell you that standing next to the H vs. the XL, it is one big honkin bus. Way tall (14.1 clearance).

I was also about to consider replacing my mirrors with the solid large piece and the convex mirror on the top. After driving with a set, I will stick to the split mirror with the larger convex mirror built in. It is more natural to look lower for cars that are in the blind spot and I am sure this made for some nervous folks when the blinker came on. My F350 has the same set up, so maybe that is what I am used to and no one else has this issue.

The H turning radius is way sweet. The 45'er turns inside the vintage XL 40'er and that took a little getting used to. I don't think I nicked any curbs, but it turns very nicely. Also, the steering wheel is smaller than the standard XL one, but I changed mine out last year and it is about the same size, so that wasn't as big a change for me as it was for Mike.

Mike was sad that neither coach had the beaver shooter window, but maybe that is an '07 option.

This coach also has a great back up camera set up (color) and you can see both the hitch ball and far down the road at the same time. A night setting would have been nice, but maybe you need to Urban Assault Vehicle version to get that option. It also has a cable to plug your iPod into the sound system with a master volume control that is way sweet.

It also has very smart systems that that played against Mike and I in that we wanted to turn things off and on where it wanted us to just set the temperature and let it decide what to do. We searched for two days looking for the Webasto controls. Seems the SMX Cruisair controls handle all the heating functions including running the heat pumps, running the electric heat and controlling the "12V Heat" (Marathon term) which is code for Webasto.

Now I know the question asked didn't anticipate me making some kind of full blown comparison between the coaches, but make no mistake; this is a VERY nice coach and more sophisticated in every since than our '92. Lots of things I mundanely do (shore power hook up, tank dumping, etc) are considerably easier on this and probably most newer coaches.

What else?

I like the way this disscussion is going. I really like our bus but everyone still always ask what year is it....pause and say its a 86. Our home on land was built in 87 and nobody ever ask. I just can't imagine trading and starting to learn all the new moods and quirks of a newer bus.

I'm really excited for others to get new or newer bus's but when we get back home and I go out in the bus barn to spend time tinkering on ours, life is good!

Dale,

That is exactly right. Almost every person I come in contact with thinks our coach is brand new. We had a guy pounce on us in the WalMart parking lot in Phoenix ask Mike if the H was brand new.

You have to remember that 99.99% of the people you run into have no knowledge of these coaches and can't tell an old one from a new one.

I even have people as if my 1969 Bonanza is new (I'm sure it is the futuristic V design and classic styling), so unless you own an old beater 210, who will know?

I'd like to add another perspective to Jerry's post to isolate the XL and H differences, because Jerry seems to be doing some measurement against his coach.

We went from a 40 foot 8V92 to a 45 foot Series 60.

I can tell you the difference made a liar out of me. I was always of the opinion the difference was just the engine, and that difference was solely related to MPG and the sound.

Well in the 10 years between 1987 and 1997 Prevost was at work. So were the converters. The first reaction was how quiet the bus had gotten. I have no idea if it was 40 versus 45 feet, or the series 60 versus the 8V92, but the sound level change was enormous. The newer bus is not a better hill climber because the added torque is offset by the added weight, but it comes off the line from a stop much better and the shifts are smoother. The mileage increase has paid huge dividends, not only in cost to drive, but I spend less time in truck stops. With an increased fuel supply and better mileage I went from about 1200 miles to empty (really, really empty) to about 2300 miles to empty. So I spend less time at truck stops, and the ones I go into are the ones with cheap fuel because I have options.

But the converters were hard at work also. The systems are so much better in terms of ease of use. If you never had to manually switch power supplies you will never appreciate how nice it is to have a bus that doesn't care if you are on batteries, shore power or generator. It just takes care of things by itself.

Jerry mentions the electric power cord reel. That is a simple thing that really is a big deal. The devil is in the details so the little things that look initially like they are glitz or unnecessary soon become conveniences that are practical.

I have no knowledge of whether Mike's new H has gone beyond his XL and if so how far, but one thing is clear and that is as the coaches get newer they are definitely improving.

Hi Guys,

I'm a little behind in my postings as we've had the hammer down trying to make Dinner in Knoxville in time for the Early Bird Specials. But some interesting comments were posted on the H vs XL and Jerry did a good job of summing things up. But here's my current views - more to follow.

I MISS THE BIG WHEEL. Of course this would also pertain to new XLII's, but the kids and I also talk about heading down the road in the Prevo with arms spread out holding that big wheel. It's a MAN"s wheel. It's an icon of the bus and I miss it. Upside is Ms. Donna will be more inclinded to drive it as it's less intimidating.

Drivers Seat: According to the H3 Pro, Jim Lane, eye level is only 8" less than the XL's. I haven't measured yet, but I believe this to be true. Same great view over all the 4 wheelers and traffic. No downside. It does seem that the drivers area is a little more cramped, but not uncomfortably so. Great visibility. And I think there's going to be a lot of times when I'm glad I'm a little secluded up front from the Mangoettes. Backup camera is full color, but don't need it and the B&W gave much better nighttime low light display. This one is almost worthless at night. If I can trade out the camera for B&W I will.

WindNoise: Much quieter than the XL. Don't know why but it is.


Co-Pilot Seat: Sits about 12" back and about 6" higher than the drivers seat. I don't like it. It's incredibly hard to get comfortable with it, even with the flip out foot rest. It's not hard to have a conversation and I don't feel like the hired help. (Only when I'm driving for Winchester).

Bays: Huge! I'm going to sublease it one at the next POG rally for housing. No entertainment bay in this model and even with BUS AIR we have 2 complete pass thru Bays.

Outside: I do MISS the stainless, but I have to tell you with the extra height (9" I believe) standing next to this dude you just go WOW, it's BIG. If you're into BIG it's cool. The downside is we headed into Memphis last night, in search of Beale St, and we're faced with multiple low railroad bridges that caused us to backtrack at least 6x. The XL would've made most, but the H was almost a convertible. You really have to pay attention. Fast Rogers Lower Level would be the kiss of death.

Salon: A huge selling point for Ms Mango was the windows. If she hadn't seen Colorado Bus at POG II, I'm not sure I could've have done the deal without a divorce and name change (Mango Donna's) at the restaurants. Some H's only come with 2 large salon windows, but this one and I believe most of the Marathons have 3 per side plus the trapazoid windows. Making the coach feel, during the day, very open and airy. It's impressive and probably the biggest selling point in purchasing an H. Although the XLII's have also done a great job on new windows portraying the same feeling of openness. It certainly helps ease the slide desire. (Side note: Colorado Bus is one of the best laid out H's I've seen).

The next discussion will be the subtle differences between Liberty and the Dark Side.

Mike

Hey Mango and Donna,

Congrats. on the new H. It looks beautiful. Janet and I wish you many happy and healthy miles!

See you at Kerrville,

Thanks Mike, its fun now to hear about these differences from Jerry and yourself.

I'm glad your having a great trip, I hope it continues. Keep adding photos, it keeps Jan and I motivated to pack and get out of here!

Hey Mango... here's your next upgrade. You can take that four windshield H3 and have it converted to the new sytle two windshield look and even get the new headlight look. If I remember right it was a 20-30K upgrade.

http://www.miracarcoach.com/eng/gallery_prevost.php

Start drooling buddy :D



Nice coach by the way.

I'm really glad you did the H3 and a Marathon so I can hear about what's different and what you think of it all.