1997 Marathon - Purchase Jitters

[truk4u]

Hi Gang,
I'm about to schedule a PDI in Dallas and jump on a plane to purchase a Marathon and wondered if anyone can shed any light on this coach. It's being sold by Mr Olivers and also listed on e-bay. The site for Mr Olivers
is: http://www.mrolivers.com/website_slot_09_1desc

I see the same Coach on Phil Coopers site, dos-97, with a sold notice, but this may be a real old Ad. Mileage then was 66K and now 88K.

Got the new buyers jitters and looking for info.:confused:

[ken&ellen]

Good luck. I hope it is all you wished for. Ken & Ellen

[Jon Wehrenberg]

That is a nice looking coach, and Marathon makes good conversions.

You can tell a lot about the care the coach has had even if the service records are not available. Some of the places I have learned people ignore are as follows:

Two year coolant changes. (look for evidence the coolant conditioning filter has been changed at the very least)

Oil level in hubs. (It should be at the line on the plastic cover. You may need to pull the rubber plug to actually see the level)

Differential oil level. (This and the previous one are serious as was seen by Lew's axle problems.)

AC filters. (An owner that is detailed in his maintenance will routinely clean the AC filters. If not, it is a fair question about what else was ignored.)

Check to make sure the odometer is recording. If it has a Detroit Diesel Pro Driver compare miles. That vintage odometer was notorious for failures. The Pro Driver is accurate.

Don't let high mileage worry you, however. Even if the actual mileage is higher it will have to be very high before it adversely impacts the coach. I would rather see high mileage indicating routine use than low mileage indicating the coach has been parked. That is what usually affects seals.

Good luck.

[reelentless]

Hello, I was wondering if you purchased the coach from paul @ Mr. Olivers, and if so what did you think about the experience. I am going out to purchase a 1997 liberty that needs some tlc but i am in the truck repair buss. and it will not be a problem for me, just wondering about the people i am buying from

[truk4u]

Relentless,

My experience with Mr. Oliver was good, no complaints. I only met Paul when I was leaving, Dan handled everything with me and did a really good job, (he's a Prevost owner). They had already fixed some minor things themselves and agreed to put 2 new steer tires on before I got there. They took the Bus to Prevost in Dallas for my PDI and I really didn't have any surprises. The Bus was pretty much as they described when I got there. Any issues that I had were attended to.

The most important thing, I was able to talk to all the previous owners before I flew to Dallas and had a real good understanding of the bus history. Mr. Oliver only had my bus for about 2 weeks, so I pretty much knew what was needed. I also do my own work, but the PDI at Prevost was worth the money. It really helped to have an independent source checking all the systems.

Hopefully Jon will jump in here, he has a 97 Liberty and can really help you look for the things that will eat your lunch. Keep us posted of your progress and welcome to the cure for MPD.;)

[Jon Wehrenberg]

reelentless,

Good luck on your purchase. While you may think that your truck experience will serve you well on this purchase (it will be a major help) there are things that will be best dealt with before you buy the coach.

I would urge you to operate every single device and system in the coach, and take the time to run them long enough to insure they do work as required. Start with the AC units. Make certain they blow cold and continue to blow cold. If one is low on gas it will blow cold, but it also may ice up quickly. You can see the freon level in the sight glasses. Spend the time to look at each one. The SMX control pads for the cruise airs may not work right, but they can be easily and quickly calibrated and I would make sure they reflect the correct temperatures because that determines your set points. All the books should be available to you and if not you need to get them.

Verify the inverters are working, and refer to the manuals for those as well. They also can be set for your preferences and you will need the manuals to do that. If you do not have experience with them, take the time to insure they both function properly.

You do not say if the coach is a "classic" or "Elegant lady", a 12 volt or 24 volt respectively. A 24 volt coach will have more features and more complexity. No amount of truck repair experience will relate to the 24 volt coach, so make sure every switch and device controlled by the switch functions properly. If not the problem is likely a small relay issue, but regardless, make certain everything works before accepting the coach.

Operate all of the stuff in the entertainment systems. That includes the radios, CD players, the regular antenna (which is a pain because it is of questionable reliability), the satellite antenna (ditto if it is a KVH), the VCRs and the DVD players, etc. You will notice these devices are bult in, and you don't want to have to start repairing or finding replacements.

Make sure the refrigerator works, the microwave works, and then fire up the generator and make sure it works. While it is running, check the stove and if equipped the outside Jenn Air. If you can verify the generator "watch dog" works.

Operate the Webasto while the engine is cold. Make sure it fires up, burns cleanly and heats up the engine and you run it until its heating cycle is complete. As long as it is on the pump will run, but the burner unit will cycle through all of its tasks. The control for a Webasto is expensive and repairs to the pump, nozzles and igniters are not something you want to deal with as a new owner. Make sure you have the Webasto manuals.

You should have the Liberty owner's manuals. A really good way to inspect your coach is with the manual in hand and operating everything.

Check the date on tires and batteries. Tires are not worth running if they are six years old, and batteries have a useful life of five years. I also check the AC filters, both the house and bus air. Dirty filters are a good indication previous owners were sloppy in maintenance.

After you have inspected the house, start on the coach. I will assume you will not get under it until you get it to Prevost. Verify the bus AC works. Let it run on high idle and make sure the gauges read where they need to as far as oil pressure, voltage on the house and bus circuits, air, etc. Then do the standard ICC air systems and brake checks. Pull the tag and steer hub caps ad verify the oil levels for the hubs are OK. This is another area of sloppy maintenance and if they are down it is another clue.

Check the lights, and then start opening things up. The various bays and compartments should be clean and orderly on that vintage of coach. Shut the bus down, and listen. You should not hear any air escaping. If you hear air, with the parking brake on it is coming from your aux. system, most likely. That is a nightmare so you really want that system right. If not you will end up with a coach that does not maintain level and that will drive you nuts to trouble shoot.

When you drive the bus, as a trucker you know what to look for. I don't need to go into that. When Prevost checks it ,make sure they get it up in the air. Again, listen for leaks, look for wet spots, and look for fluid levels being where they belong. Download the engine and transmission computers and look at the history. You will be able to tell how hard and fast it has been run. You will know if there are any codes that will require attention.

I did what I am suggesting when I bought my coach. It has proven to be a no surprise trouble free coach. One thing you can count on is Liberty will be there to help you should you have any questions or problems. Be prepared to call them as you do the inspection because they know the coach and can tell you whatever you need to know.

Don't hesitate to ask questions here because there are at least three 1997 Liberty owners on this forum and we've all been through the process.

[reelentless]

Thank you so much for the very detailed message. It's a '97 Liberty Classic, 24 volt. I went out and looked at it this past week, I found the bus air low on freon, the cruise air working well, the general maintanance on the coach was up to date, but that's about where it ends. I am not familiar with the specialty systems like the "watch dog" inverters and water systems. With my mechanical background I have checked the bus over and found a few small items that need attention, but nothing major. The coach needs some paint work, tag axle tires and several body panels from curb damage. My wife thinks we should buy a diesel pusher and trade up to a bus conversion later. I feel we can buy this coach $100,000 under current market, put some sweat equity into it and be ahead. You can see this coach at MR Olivers.com Once again thanks. David

[Jerry Winchester]

I think you have a workable plan. We did nearly the same thing. Bought the coach considerable under the market values and then started the fix up / rebuild / clean up campaign. I would add that this work has caused us to become more knowledgable with respect to the various parts of the coach (AquaHot, inverters, batteries, awnings, air system, water system) and I think this knowledge will serve us well in the future.

Even though we had rented lots of coaches, the only coach we have ever owned is the Prevost, so we went swimming in the deep end of the pool straight away and have not regretted our decision.

And the '97 Liberty is a first class coach. I have been in both Jon and MangoMike's coaches (same year and converter) and the systems are very solid.

[Just Plain Jeff]

If you think that you are paying that much below 'market,' and the condition is as you believe that it is, you have a lot of room to bring it up to snuff.

My concern is that coaches have enough miles on them, rather than too many.

If you can, get to a DD dealer and get a readout on the computer; that's where you get the good stuff.

[MangoMike]

Relentless,

I'm very excited for you. Liberty is one of many great converters. If the bus is a Classic, which mine is, it's probably 12v (house systems) the Elegant Lady, which my rich friend Jon has, is 24v and has the fancy light controller system and just a hair more Bling than the Classic.

Please feel free to post any questions you may have.

If you're having any Webasto problems - there is a great primer here.
www.prevoman.com.

Good luck

Mike

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Reelentless,

Nice coach. I don't see anything in the pictures that would scare me, and I see a lot of things in the pictures that were encouraging.

I would not give the mileage a second though. I am sure the mileage has a huge impact on the price, but it is just an indication that the coach was used frequently which is the best thing for them.

It is a 12 volt coach and that is not a bad thing. It has a lot of good stuff on it and it does not look like it was trashed. The bent sheet metal is not a big deal and the panels are readily available either through Prevost or International Bus. Hang onto your shorts because the rivets are $1.00 each.

Negotiate your best price and verify everything you can so you will have no surprises. Definitely read the codes.

I think that layout is a twin to Mango's.

[reelentless]

I saw that the coach had a 24 volt and a 12 volt gauge, I was thinking that the 12 volt was for the engine system and the 24 was the coach. paul said he was making head way with the repairs they were going to do ie; tires, generator cooling fans, belts, bus air and such. The computer print out was no big deal, he ran it over a lot of curbs but never ran it over 70 mph the fuel economy was impressive compared to my last 8V92T/A. I was a little disapointed with the 8.5% fin. rate when I have a 750 credit score an plunking over 20% or $:confused: 50,000.00 on a down payment!! Why does a buss. owner get all the hassles? If it was one of my employees all they would need is a letter from me or a canceled check, oh well, mama has seen it and I guess I have no choice, well I kinda like it too! I wiil let ya"ll know the out come. Thanks for all the help

[Jon Wehrenberg]

The bus is 24 volt, and the house is 12 on the coach you linked to.

Except for the lights on the bus which are 12 volt, and the LED crowd will soon be on top of you to replace all the lights with LEDs.

Ignore them. Spend your Mango bucks with your bride on neat things for your new coach, like spinners for the wheels.;)

[MangoMike]

Reelentless,

Regardless of the road Jon tries to send you down - you need a set of these on your new bus. Join the bling age.

http://www.prevoman.com/Pages/Pictures/page2.html

http://www.prevoman.com/Pages/Pictures/IMG_1475.jpg

Good Luck,

Mike

[Just Plain Jeff]

Leica Camera company used to have the following slogan: The Quality Remains Long After The Price Is Forgotten.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Everybody that charges too much for their product says the same thing.

[Ray Davis]

Anyone bringing a set of those LED lights to POG II for sale?

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Ray, Ray, Ray, we need to talk.:(

[reelentless]

I am going out to get the bus on Friday, I will let everyone know what i think next week, I have a aircard in my laptop, so if I need any over the road advise I will be calling, once again, thanks:)

[Jon Wehrenberg]

We are ready to serve, We will answer your questions, and as I have said before, if we don't know the answer we will make something up.

[ken&ellen]

8 months ago Ellen & I were going to purchase our Liberty in Minot, ND. With the help and advise of this zany group it was an experience I will never forget. Enjoy. Ken & Ellen

[reelentless]

The coach is home and going through a complete drive train inspection and repair. I am very pleased with the coach, I have a lot of work to do, Brakes, shocks, transmission seal and pinion seal, oil pan gasket, engine speed sensor, tires all the way around, insulator panels, mud flaps and all the air diverters on the bottom of the coach that are bent and some flat. I will complete this phase by friday and take a little trip to orlando and stop by I.B.P on Monday to spend several thousand dollors on panels and Bling lights. I will keep you posted. I need some help on a Liberty manual, the coach was missing this very important piece. It sure makes it easy when you have a hetra lift and can walk under the bus!! I will send a picture,

Thanks all, David

[Jerry Winchester]

Bring the Bling

Get those LED marker lights at IBP and send the old ones to Jon. He prays over a collection of old vintage parts every evening when he emerges from the grease pit.

Sounds like you have some work ahead of you, but it would appear that you will have a solid coach when finished.

Post photos when you get a chance but don't ask Lew how to do it. He's a cranky old fart who connects to the Internet with a tin can and a string. But he has a hardware collection second to none. On his coach no less. :cool:

[Just Plain Jeff]

Congratulations on your purchase. May you enjoy many happy miles of pleasure in your new coach!

Don't listen to those guys about LEDs. Our coach, of course, came with them stock. Hard to catch up to a really great coach. I am thinking of taking off the old-fashioned LED's and putting something really cool in their place.

Since I have recused myself from participating in the Bling Contest at POG II, the modifications won't be done until POG III. In the meantime, we'll just go stock and enjoy the many attempts to Bling Up.

Kids.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

David,

When we bought our first Liberty it lacked some books and they provided one immediately. I suggest you advise them of your need, give them the coach number and get on their mailing list, and with your proximity to them visit with them when you need an understanding of your coach. Also I recommend advising Prevost you own the bus, and by providing them with the serial number and your contact information you will get notices and other information from Prevost.

If you want any information don't forget we might be able to help you here. My policy is if I don't know the answer to a question, I make something up.:D

[rmboies]

Congratulations on your purchase. May you enjoy many happy miles of pleasure in your new coach!
, the modifications won't be done until POG III. Kids.

Yes, congratulations David on your new coach! Our last coach, Vantare conversion (quit wincing Jon, I can see you:D ) did not have the owners manual with it. We simply called Featherlite in Sanford, Fl. and the folks there very kindly sent us the appropriate copy for our model/year.

Jeff, would you please ask Helen where she would like the POGIII rally to be held? I like to plan ahead and want to make sure I have her favorite song with me--LOL

Debi (minus Bob who has a real job right now; so much for retirement:rolleyes: )

[Just Plain Jeff]

I promise to ask The Boss where POG III will be. But if we leave it up to her, we will all be parked on some beach, near Slovak restaurants, Thrift Stores and she has to have cell service to boss around the kids. (Just in case the 40-year old daughter needs to have some immediate guidance.)

Debi: Careful about bringing up stuff on the POG board: Remember, the first person who brings up a topic owns it.

So now that you are in charge of POG III, where are we headed?

[Joe Cannarozzi]

Reelentless, congradulations, If your anything like us Im sure you will enjoy making repairs and improvments, but I couldnt help notice thats quite a punch list to cover by Friday! A DEEP breath, and some adult beverages are in order!

[rfoster]

Jeff:
Helen with cell phone in communication with the grown children, sounds like home - Micki is the same way - we have three grown and they still get orders daily. Give her cell service - something to eat and an outlet store - she's ok for a while.

Yea and everybody knows - you really wanted a Liberty;)

[rmboies]

<<Debi: Careful about bringing up stuff on the POG board: Remember, the first person who brings up a topic owns it.
So now that you are in charge of POG III, where are we headed?[/QUOTE]

Aha, but Jeff my friend, YOU were the first person to bring it up--does the post below sound familiar?

&quot;Originally Posted by Just Plain Jeff
Congratulations on your purchase. May you enjoy many happy miles of pleasure in your new coach!
, the modifications won't be done until POG III. Kids.&quot;

I was simply replying and asking you to ask Helen because we both know that she is in charge--LOL I have not traveled enough to give an informed opinion about where POG III should be held. I think JW, Mango, Jon, Roger That or Tom may be the enlightened traveled ones. Maybe you can get them to pretend that they brought it up first? :p

Debi and Bob back home from picking up 208 bales of hay in 97 degree heat!

[Just Plain Jeff]

Yeah, I was trying to come up with a good location for POG III. There was another thread in, I think, Rallies where the topic was brought up last week or so about a place in the Keys in Florida.

&quot;Pretend?&quot; Moi?

I have a friend who believes that the reason for the International Space Station is to repair all the satellites women have melted with their cell phones. But then Ol Bob has a lot of other ideas as well...

As to buying a Liberty, it wasn't as if we didn't try. We made a run on the Randy Travis coach, but Liberty wouldn't sell it to us. I had a crazy idea (imagine that) about modifying it to our needs. They said another band guy should buy it; and at 495K miles it would be too risky for an individual to get into. They also had a 06 Mandalay to die for, but too many Lew Bucks for a bus that someone had punched holes into. Our Vogue is a &quot;Harvey Coach,&quot; that he made for himself and has a lot of Liberty stuff on it, but with the granite flex floor and stainless tanks, etc. The Boss likes it, so I like it too.

[rfoster]

JPJ:

All is well!! Life is good. .

[lewpopp]

As for POG III, what did happen to the KOA (closed) at Fiesta Key ( I guess) someone said thay had troubles getting permits. Anything new on that?

[Just Plain Jeff]

No Lew, but on the Rallies and Get Togethers section there was some discussion about options at the Keys. The Boss would like to go there, so maybe it would be a good option?

[reelentless]

I bought the coach, and have purchased all the LEDs on the planet! All is going well, I will be finished soon, well maybe a year or two!!!!

[MangoMike]

Relent,

Congratulations. If it brings half as much to you as ours has done you'll be one happy guy. The LED's are definetly the right move, regardless what JOn and other say. Let us know how things are going. Start posting some photos of that great new bus.

MIke

[Just Plain Jeff]

I bought the coach, and have purchased all the LEDs on the planet! All is going well, I will be finished soon, well maybe a year or two!!!!

Don't worry so much about the 'bling thing,' so far, lots of talk and very little evidence of any activity. Talk is cheap.

There is nothing so sweet as the smell of diesel exhaust first thing in the morning as you are pulling out to explore new horizons in this wonderful country of ours.

May you have many years of enjoyment in your new coach!

[reelentless]

Hey guys thanks for all the responses about the new addition to the Stringfield family> We love it so far, I made the dead line and went to Fort Wilderness on that Friday, stopped back by and saw Rich @ IBP in Apopka and purchased all the LEDs including tail lights for the coach! It is back in my shop and we have disassembled the engine room and are replacing all the hoses, alternators, pullies,tensioners and any possible brake down parts, painting and detailing and are now going back together. I need some advise AGAIN! I need someone to paint the coach from the Aluminum down, all the way around the bus. I stopped and saw Greg In Lakeland, he said to strip and paint all the paint on the bus and to paint the entire front is $13,000.00. Is this high? It is only about a 24 inch strip around the coach! And he is selling and moving north, so I wonder about warranty in the future. The bus has ceramic flooring in the bath and carpet everywhere else. I want to put granite or marble throughout. Any advise? Last but not least, I was cleaning out the coach and found the complete owners manual and Prevost manuals!!!! The Kohler gen set starts and shuts off. I have checked all the obvious stuff. I guess I will have to order a complete manual so I can trouble shoot and repair!

Thanks David

[Jon Wehrenberg]

I'm afraid you will have to return the coach. It sounds like you are having way too much fun.

When my old coach was being repaired, Prevost in JAX sent it down to a paint shop in the Orlando area. The work was superb. I understand it was very expensive, but the work was flawless. You might check with them to find out who they recommend.

You have me concerned because you allude to real bling. I'm not worried about your Christmas lights, but when you talk about detailing your engine I start to get concerned.

I'm sure the LED nuts on this forum will have some remarks.

[Just Plain Jeff]

I need someone to paint the coach from the Aluminum down, all the way around the bus. I stopped and saw Greg In Lakeland, he said to strip and paint all the paint on the bus and to paint the entire front is $13,000.00. Is this high? It is only about a 24 inch strip around the coach! And he is selling and moving north, so I wonder about warranty in the future.

It sounds like you are talking about Glenn Franklin? Glenn's work is usually about half the price of most other bids. The quickest way to figure a good price is to get a quote from Creative Coach (the highest price) in Lakeland, across from Ken Robertson's Service facility. Glenn used to work there before he went solo.

He's a friend of Lester's, so there you go.

[win42]

Relentless: I don't have the complete answer on the Granite floors, just a caution. We had ours done in Granite a couple of years ago by a house installer. He had no knowledge of the flexing our coaches take. Hence some hairline cracks in the bathroom. I know now it takes a flexible underlaymet to make it work. Check around until you find the right proceedure. We love the way it turned out other than that flex problem. Granite is a lot more scratch resistant than Marble and a better choice. Good Luck on the new Coach and welcome the Asylum of POGers.

Harry

[reelentless]

Thanks I will call Mike @ Jax., Prevost tomorrow, My company repairs trucks and my mechanics enjoy something new to play with and what the hell, they are getting paid!!::

[Just Plain Jeff]

Asylum of POGers?

Hey, we aren't locked in.

Wait a minute, maybe we are!

We've got the granite, 98 Vogue XLV, 163K miles, no cracks. I think they put a flex substrate down before laying the granite. Best we've ever had, better than carpet, ceramic, etc.

NOW will they let us out?

[lewpopp]

Relentless,

Before you install your Led taillights, if they are like mine, check to see if the lights and lens are attached to the housing with double faced tape. Do any of them rattle now? They will loosen as time goes by.

Also, when I installed mine I did it with stainless screws because on the port side there is no axcess to the back of the assembly after you install it. Some later coaches could be different.

Lew

[timebum]

Don't! They are very soft and scratch with the smallest grain of sand.

[reelentless]

Lew , man you got to stay up with the forum a little better!! I have installed them and no there is no tape on the lights, they all seem loose and that was a great idea on the drivers side with screws! I asked the shop foreman and he gave the job to a helper that has no clue about anything and he just looked at me when I asked him why didn't he advise someone that they were loose? Well, he said, I was told to install them and so I did!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I hope they will last, if not I will pull them back out!!!

[MangoMike]

Reelentless,

Come on. Real men do their own Prevo work. Let the Neophites work on customer vehicles.

MM

[reelentless]

Mango, I have the bus in pieces all over the shop! I can never seem to find my slow gear. I was going to take a year or so and get this coach up to speed however I have lost sight of my goal and when I get the exterior panels on and the couchs and bed coverings back I will take the coach to Orlando to have some paint work done. The good news is the engine detailing is done and all the old panels polished up as a perfect match to the new ones. I have been working my a-- off on this coach I just want it done yesterday!! I still think I have patience, don't you?

[MangoMike]

Reelentless,

Just stay focused and make sure your in Sante Fe, lookin' good.

MM

[Jerry Winchester]

Mike,

Is it me or does your Avatar look like mine?

[rfoster]

Mango and JDUB: Y'all look like brothers! Who's your daddy?