RV Resort site ownership

[merle&louise]

After looking at the "bargins" for sale at Bluewater RV Resort in Key West, I was wondering if RV Resort ownership is a good deal. It looks like these RV lots have appreciated in value significantly. Any thoughts good or bad?:cool:

[jello_jeep]

Tuga, I own a couple in Lake Havasu.

I am going to keep one, and sell the other after building a casita on it and doing some improvements. Hopefully be able to make enough to pay for the other one!

I like it, as I have a place to go thats not far away, and its always available, no reservations needed.

Real estate will always go up eventually, so as long as you are not "counting" on it for a short term gain you are ok.

Also search for a place where property tax is not too high, and even more importantly, a place that has low monthly fees, as they could eat you up.

There is my .02! :D

[garyde]

Hi Tuga. I have looked at the Las Vegas Luxury Resort and also the one in Palm Springs Area. Both are almost totally empty in the summer because of the heat. No Shade Trees, lots of palms, and Pools. Too expensive for what little use I would get out of it. $149000 -359000. The affluent Snow Birds like them. I would rather have $ in Propety with buildings. A safer investment. You can always rent and it,s a lot cheaper unless you are wantng to stay for 3-4 months at a time every year for many years.

[Just Plain Jeff]

Writing from Central Florida, we're seeing the swift loss of decent rental RV sites. Last year in Polk County alone, 2200 sites were lost due to condo/housing development. The good things about having your own site is that you don't have to make reservations and they continue to appreciate above the general housing market as few new parks are putting in simple pads.

The newer sites that are being put in are usually incorporated with some type of a house or super-sites as the developer's margins are higher there.

We are selling our place in Mount Olive Shores near Lakeland, FL due to a desire to be able to head west and put up a house in Maine, but only very reluctantly. Nice to have a place to call home whenever you want to go there.

A few years back we had the three house + bus thing going and it was too much of a headache keeping track of everything.

Simple is good.

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

After looking at the "bargins" for sale at Bluewater RV Resort in Key West, I was wondering if RV Resort ownership is a good deal. It looks like these RV lots have appreciated in value significantly. Any thoughts good or bad?http://www.prevostownersgroup.com/forum/

Tuga, It is my percetion that it comes down to the individual, his intent, use and personal finances.
Where is one in life; lots of free time, or none? Old with only a few active years to go? Healthy and able to travel far and wide without concern of medical facilities? Do you want to go to the same place time after time , or do your finances allow you to have it in your closet for use when you want with no detriment to your life if you don't.
I think if one looks at the RV lot as he would a painting to hang and enjoy while he has it and not to look at it as an investment, then it works.
Surely if you can wait long enough its value will increase, but you have association fees and taxes to pay.
As with ordinary realestate when the price goes up the market size goes down. Those able to make high dollar purchases have the whole world from which to choose and the choice is often whimsical or fanciful. Not nesessary. Your lot may not be in the fashionable location of the moment. If something should happen to you for instance would your wife be encumbered not only with the disposal of the bus but the lot as well? Maybe she would KEEP ON TRUCKIN, I don't know? If someone moved into the space next to you and were incompatible with you and your values it might take a very long time to sell.
To me the bus is about travel and getting there more than about being anywhere time after time. That's me. "Everything is relative". Decide for yourself. Be happy. :D :eek::o JIM

[lewpopp]

Jeff, Let me try to figure this out.

We want to sell our place in Mt Olive Shores and go west and get a place in Maine.

Either they moved Mt Olove Shores, Maine, or you would travel west and then settle in Maine. Just asking.

[Just Plain Jeff]

http://prevost-stuff.com/minipog10.jpg


Lew: Since I do not have the gift of your mellifluous magnanimity, we po' folk and want to have one 'base.' Due to family reasons, it is better to have an all-season base in Maine, and travel around. That way The Boss can supervise New England whenever she wants to, as she is now.

If we travel in the West, such as the great reports from Harry and others suggest, having a place in Florida doesn't make as much sense.

You got it now?

(Casey the Wonder Dog should explain it. She has taught Lewie circus tricks!).

[lewpopp]

Jeff,

I'm not trying to be a smart ass. The way you wrote it sounded as tho you were going west to Maine.

BTW Casey is a nutless male and when I tell him what you said he will give me the largest grin with the "Jimmy Carter" teeth ascewed.

As for me passing bucks , I should have known better to fall into a pose for anyone, especially you. Go get 'em scoop !!!!

[kmuller]

Tuga - we've had a site at Pelican Lake, Naples (pelicanlake.com) for a few years now. Great place, great location...south Naples, right before you go over the bridge to Marco Island. We bought it when we could afford to, knowing when we retire in about ten years the prices would have gone up to the point that we wouldn't want to buy in. Even with the roll back of prices in SW Florida of late, we are still up significantly since we bought. The rental income pays for the RE taxes and monthly assessments. It is hard to believe, you could have purchased all you wanted in 2001/02 for about 65k each. Now they run from 199 to 400k.

[merle&louise]

Thanks guys for all of the answers. Sorry it has taken me so long to post, but we just returned from our little trip to the FL keys.

Karen and I have decided for now not to buy anything, we just like to move and see new places. So we would prefer to just rent a site and tolerate the hassels of renting (having to move when and if the owner wants his lot, no vacancies, etc). Also, living in south Louisiana; we have fairly mild winters, so it wouldn't make sense to leave a mild winter climate to travel to another mild winter climate.

I appreciate all of the responses. Thanks:D

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Unspoken in the previous discussion is the monthly cost of maintenance associated with ownership. Personally, we like visiting different places and ownership would not work for us.

[Joe Cannarozzi]

While in St. Augistien we stayed in an ownership park and it seemed to work pretty well for the members there.It is more of a summer destination.

Being more in northern Florida it is vacent in the winter months and the members take advantage of there sights themselves by wintering there.

Occupancy rates for the other 8 or 9 months are VERY good in terms of rentals.

This, seemed to us to be a good compramise, and investment as well. Just an observation. I think The Great Outdoors, also might fit this mold, not to mention we loved it there.

[merle&louise]

When Karen and I were staying at Bluewater Key RV resort in Key West, we had to move to a different site because the owner of the site we were in was coming in unexpectedly.

Is this a common problem for RENTERS staying in an ownership park?

Has anyone else had this problem?

It seems that all of the ownership parks have this rule. Maybe that is one reason why some people BUY a site as opposed to renting.

I agree with GaryDe and Jon, I would prefer to visit different places and have the money invested in income-producing real estate.

When we visited ORA at Port St. Lucie, about 50 lots out of 259 were for sale. It looks like quite a few people are trying to flip their sites. The reasons for selling are many and varied, but it seems to me that except for being a snowbird (which we are not) buying in after the park is complelely developed would be risky. Any thoughts?

[lewpopp]

TGO is mainly for golfers. Don't get in the way of the golf carts. Rumor has it that Jody got picked off by a golf cart after she gave some one a digit.

Did anyone notice the resemblence that Bill and Casey have?

There's no shortage of Lewbucks here at ORA. Owners are grabbin' up NEW Prevosts every day. Good for them, but I'm jealous.

Lew

[garyde]

Tuga, its like you said... Baby Boomers (BB'S) are coming of age! So, those parks will be more desirable. If they keep building them and meet demand, the price will stabilize. But if demand far exceeds supply, those sites will appreciate. Depends on the Location a great deal. Gary

[Jon Wehrenberg]

To add to the uncertainty, if fuel prices skyrocket the entire RV business will collapse and owners of sites bought for big bucks will not only be upside down, but they won't be seeing many renters because a lot of RV owners won't spend the money for fuel.

[Imre]

Our prophet has spoken again :) If fuel prices skyrocket RV-ing will be the cheapest pleasure available (other than "enjoying" the virtual world like www.secondlife.com). If you could guarantee skyrocketing fuel prices, I would be building concrete pads all along the hurricane-prone coasts :cool:

[kmuller]

Every decision has it's risk/reward that needs to be individually balanced. If we took the cost of a bus, new or used, annual maintenance, insurance, storage etc and divided by days used, we all would be institutionalized. The fact that we all don't live in double-wides and drive ten year old cars says there is more to life then being rational. Own or rent, new or ten year old bus, work on it yourself or have it serviced......these are choices that drive the free market. So let's just drive what we like and park where we want and enjoy our diversity of choice.

[jonnie]

Karl,

Well said!

John

[Jon Wehrenberg]

I have to disagree with Imre. We are incapable of predicting how hard fuel prices impact the RV industry because most of us are unaffected by fuel prices. But our company is a large supplier to the campground industry (www.jamestownadvanced.com) and I can assure you when fuel prices go up, campground sites sit empty. It is irrational, but that knee jerk reaction has been shown many times over the years we have sold products to campgrounds.

[Ray Davis]

Tuga,

If you're going to Kerrville (POG3), you can see their variation on lot ownership. Buckhorn has a private area (over a bridge) to "The Club". Intead of purchasing a site, you put up $45,000, which will be returned when you decide to give up interest on your site.

On your site, however, you can build whatever you want, and when I looked in October, one family was building a 2000 square foot two-story house!

You still have to pay $475 per month to maintain the spot, but later when you decide to move on, you may sell any building etc which you put on the site. So, it's "sorta" like getting the site without buying a $100,000 site first.

There were some really nice homes there. Ask Sheryl Prather (at Buckhorn) to give you a tour of "The Club".

[Imre]

Jon,

I was not talking about a blip. If you look at Europe with $7/gal prices and a lot less income, the masses don't have second homes, they don't fly and they don't stay in hotels. They drive and camp. There are campgrounds everywhere and the industry is very strong. This, of course, doesn't mean that I agree with you about the fuel prices skyrocketing.

[Just Plain Jeff]

One of the specific problems with 'campgrounds' in Florida is that they are (with a few exceptions) dwindling. There is a $14,000 environmental impact fee/site in many counties and a ton of permitting, which was not required in the past. This has made new construction around here too costly except for 'owned' sites. And that just gets you a piece of paper. Then you develop the site, utilities and such. So for a rental-based campground with hundreds of sites, the preferred investment is privately-owned sites. Secret Garden, once an 800-site grass-full service campground was demolished (Kissimee) last year for condos and it keeps on rolling along.

And no, I don't choose the Kool-Aid; Diet Pepsi works for me, thanks.

[merle&louise]

Tuga,

If you're going to Kerrville (POG3), you can see their variation on lot ownership. Buckhorn has a private area (over a bridge) to "The Club". Intead of purchasing a site, you put up $45,000, which will be returned when you decide to give up interest on your site.

On your site, however, you can build whatever you want, and when I looked in October, one family was building a 2000 square foot two-story house!

You still have to pay $475 per month to maintain the spot, but later when you decide to move on, you may sell any building etc which you put on the site. So, it's "sorta" like getting the site without buying a $100,000 site first.

There were some really nice homes there. Ask Sheryl Prather (at Buckhorn) to give you a tour of "The Club".

Ray,

Thanks for the info, yes we are going to attend the rally @ Buckhorn in Kerrville. The Buckhorn is one of our favorite RV resorts. We saw the Club when it was first built. I agree with you, I think that it is a great deal. Ken Hammill (Big Rigs Best Bets) has a site in the Club and he loves it.

I think that for our use, it is just better to rent a site for a week. We don't ever stay in one spot for more than a week. We just love to drive and see new places and things. Variety is the spice of life.:D

[mike kerley]

We own a lot at River Ranch East of Lake Wales Florida. Formerly an Outdoor Resorts, now a HOA/dude ranch/RV park. Maintenance and taxes are acceptable and lot values have increased in the last three years as fuel prices are causing RV owners to travel shorter distances for the "long weekends" many of us working types enjoy. We have many new owners from Miami, Tampa, Orlando and West Palm buying now as we are with in a couple hours drive of their homes. Many have stated they stopped the 8 and 10 hour trips to the Carolinas or N. Georgia and now come to "the ranch", year round.

Its a great home base for us and after owning for almost 7 years, we have no regrets (other than agreeing to serve on the HOA board). We still like to visit other parks and travel to other parts of the country, but River Ranch is a great place to come home to!

Plus, were close to Lew (but not to close).