Time to get lifeline Batteries changed ?

[lbriant]

Need to get 8 New batteries installed ?
Leaving Iowa 2nd week of October , headed to Lake Havasu City,
Is there anywhere I could trust to take on this job anywhere in that direction,
I definitely would not even think of trying it, it's seems to be a very tight fit and I don't want someone screwing something up and running one of my 4000 watt inverters or worse ?
I think this is going to hurt the wallet,,,,
Anyone bought any of those batteries lately ?
Any tips welcome

[Gil_J]

Larry,

I can't personally recommend anyone on your route. Frankly, changing house batteries is more of a physical demanding job than a wiring job. As long as the cables are labelled this is a simple change. If the the negative connection is the first taken off and last reconnected there shouldn't be any concerns. The AC breakers need to be off and the inverters need to be turned off during the change.

Depending on your DC demands while driving and your dry camping requirements you likely don't need 8 batteries. Unless you dry camp, I bet you won't see any negative consequences of going to 6 batteries and likely can get by with 4.

Any facility that services the entertainers should have the experience needed. Entertainers may have fewer batteries, but still have equalizer connections and a series/parallel wiring configuration.

The biggest problem you will likely have is battey access. If your batteries are buried, you might be challenged getting the work done.

[jack14r]

I have done it twice and at 162 lbs.for a 8D it is a physical event.I have a buddy that is very strong and works for me that helped me do it both times.The wiring is simple,just mark it and as you remove it wrap each one so that it cannot arc.

[Alek&Lucia]

In cases like this I also take many photos with my camera or phone before I start taking anything a part.

[travelite]

I would definitely wrap my tools with electrical tape all but to the very end. I'd also tape as much cardboard or other insulating barriers into place as needed to prevent accidental shorts to the chassis. You can't be too careful. Here's a good article on electrical safety:

[JIM KELLER]

My Tip. Each time you remove the connection from each battery slip a wire tie through the hole of all cables on that post and cinch them up. This eliminates the wonder if a wire is on the correct post upon reassembly.

[Gil_J]

Electricity certainly commands our respect. However, the there's no fear of electrocution at 24 volts. There are still some dangers. The house bank, even the chassis bank for that matter, houses a lot of current. If your wrench made contact with the chassis from the main positive terminal you might be surprised how big of an arc that would create. It could easily melt away most of the wrench, be temporarily blinding, and generate flying hot metal. These events can lead to burns, spark related fires, and explosion of one or more batteries. This is why I always say that all power sources should have circuit protection as near as possible to the power source. This is not just my opinion but is a requirement in the electrical standards of any industry I've ever seen. The only exception I've ever seen is the cable from the battery to starter. Obviously, the starter cable needs to be well protected. You might be surprised how many direct connections to a battery bank aren't circuit protected near the power source or not protected at all.

When working with a battery bank ALWAYS disconnected the main negative terminal first and put it back on last. If you have an equalizer, remove it's zero volt and 12V connections should be removed next, in that order. If you at least remove the main negative connection first it's impossible to have a battery to chassis arc. The only arc possibility that then exists is between positive and negative terminals of the batteries.

[BenC]

Your Vantare XL has only 2 cables to each battery. Each needs to be taped off when removed individually, and then strapped up out of the way for the physical removal of the batteries. Make note of and take a few pictures before you start removing cables, and refer back to what color goes to which terminal on the battery when you go to reassemble. If you have questions, you are free to give me a call when you get to doing the task.

[lbriant]

Yes I am pretty familiar with electrical wiring,
Just no room to work for me,I have more plates in my back than the batteries have .)
You can weld With 2 12 volt batteries wired in line,

[dale farley]

Has anyone tried another brand of AGM battery?. I know most everyone uses Lifelines, but are they the only 8D AGM that provide what we need for the bus? I see there are other AGMs like Trojan and Interstate that cost significantly less than Lifelines. Some as low as $315 each. Can there be that much difference in the quality and durability? Just wondering!!!

[jack14r]

I had Deka Dominator gel batteries in my coach when it was purchased and 1 vented within the first year so I replaced them with Lifelines,they are superior IMHO.

[travelite]

Rolls seems to get better performance in terms of cycles at a specific depth of discharge level; for instance, 50% DOD Rolls: 1250, Lifeline: 1000. I'd look at something like the Rolls/Surrette S12-230 AGM battery. You won't find Lifelines in my bus. :)

http://rollsbattery.com/catalog/

[dale farley]

As a general rule, aren't AGMs supposed to be better than gel batteries? This is not a rhetorical question; I don't know the answer.

[JIM KELLER]

Very Interesting.

[travelite]

The Rolls s12-230AGM would be the replacement for the Lifeline GPL-4DL. 1250 cycles at 50% DOD versus Lifelines "nearly 1000" as they say in their documentation. So, potentially 25% more cycles so I'd expect the price to be correspondingly higher, and it is. It's a bigger, heavier battery; you get more.

http://www.wholesalesolar.com/9949457/rolls-surrette/batteries/rolls-surrette-s12-230-agm-battery

(http://www.wholesalesolar.com/9949457/rolls-surrette/batteries/rolls-surrette-s12-230-agm-battery)You'll notice Rolls has a superior warranty to Lifeline. Rolls: (first 24 months free replacement, next 36 months prorated). Lifeline: (first 12 months free replacement, next 48 months prorated).

[dale farley]

David,

Are you using the Rolls AGMs or wet cells? They really do have some heavy duty batteries. One distributor told me they specialize in locomotive batteries.

[travelite]

I'm sold on AGMs over FLAs. I'd like to go Li-Ion, but there are some obstacles in the way, specifically a high amperage 24V to 12V DC-to-DC converter, but that's another conversation! :)

I updated my previous post, don't know if you noticed: they have a better warranty than Lifeline.

[Dick in Wisconsin]

I changed out my chassis batteries last year, house batteries should have a similar process ... just must heavier. My four Interstate batteries were new in May 2014. I couldn't start the bus a few weeks ago.

#1 thing to do first! Remove all jewelry and rings. The injuries you can receive after shorting a ring or watch or belt buckle are horrific. That said, with the proper precautions this is a relatively safe procedure to do.
Liberty originally installed a 24volt, 35amp (boat anchor) dumb charger. Flipped the switch for that and after two hours we had nothing. Consulted with Jeff Rowe, we concluded the charger was toast. The batteries were new. I unhooked that charger, removed it from the bus. Obtained a Guest Mariner 2611A and installed that. Ran that for 38 hours, still nothing. Removed the batteries from the bus and took them to the Interstate distributor. They said if they are only six months old, they should be fine ... must be your chargers.

Interstate charged and load tested them ... one battery was bad, it was replaced under warranty, I reinstalled the batteries, bus fired right up.
I'm not an expert on this, the other guys should feel free to second guess what I'm going to say.

First thing. If you do this right and don't do anything wrong, this process is pretty much a non-event. But if you drop a wrench across a positive and
negative terminal or hook the batteries up wrong or accidently touch the ratchet to the bus frame when working on the positive terminal you are in for quite an exciting and hair raising experience. I'm not going to bore you with stories of batteries exploding and acid being tossed all over. Take your time, take precautions, be careful, have something around who can help if the process goes south on you.

If you're handy, remove the batteries from the coach. Number the batteries. I took a Brother label machine and marked every wire and cable as to where it went (#1-P, #2N, etc.). Duct tape up your ratchet, 6" extension, and socket. Have a roll of duct tape, bag of tie wraps and twine/light rope/or heavy string handy. Turn off the two switches next to the batteries (the 12 volt and the 24 volt).

Make a diagram of the batteries and all the wire and cables. I started with the battery closest to me (my #3). As you remove the wires
and cables from each post tie wrap that posts bundle together, duct tape the bundle so there is NO bare metal showing, and duct tape the battery post. You might have tie the bundles up to something above to get them off the battery cluster. Get the positive and negative unhooked for the first battery, pull the battery.

Do the same for the rest. Now you can test the individual batteries, maybe find a bad one. You can also try to charge them with a 12 volt charger, you might be able to find a bad one.

My Interstates came with little labels on the end of the battery (hidden from view when in the coach) with the month/year. Some batteries are marked on the top with a code that you can decipher from the manufacturers web site as to their manufacture date and sometimes first charge date (I found that in Interstate's website).

PS: Final suggestion. If you buy new batteries, hang onto the red and black covers that come with new batteries. They are probably better insulators for safely removing and replacing the batteries than duct tape.

[lbriant]

Well we stay allot while traveling just pulling in somewhere and also at Nascar races so we do use our batteries,
I have had the bus for 5 years and they had been in for at least three year when we bought the bus,
So there over 8 yrs old they are still working just don't have quite the longevity, one bank is starting to go down faster than the other and I just as soon be pro active and change them before they go out and ends up biting me when it's a bad time,
I'm sure it will run around $5,000 to change them all out with Labor,

[Gil_J]

Larry,

Eight years is good. Although you may enjoy another year from them, given you dry camp its probably a good time to plan replacement. The longest battery life I've heard of is 10 years, so your time is coming.

[lbriant]

Thanks Gil,
I am just starting the planning stage, I rethought it and figured I would be on land line for the next 7 months after the trip down south ,
I think I will get them next spring,