The leans

[Dany]

Our H345 has Prevost leveling manual operatoried left side goes down over knight have canged out norgen valved checked all air lines and air bags need advice where too look thanks Dany

[garyde]

Hi Dan. Some others may chime in regarding this as well but the drivers seat, the generator air bags, the fan belt air bag, bed lift, etc. Anything associated with air will effect the air system. There is a Norgren valve mounted on the bulk head by the drive axle as well.
If you have exercised your manual air lift switches and they all work , then it may not be a solenoid but sometimes they go bad as well.

[Dany]

Mine dose not have to have secondary air to stay level it is manually operaterede in the past it has always lost secondary air in a couple of hours but it would stay level a mounth or soo thanks Dany

[Joe Camper]

Hey Dany Did U change out both valves or just the 3 position 5 way? Your problem is definatly at the LR U R on the right track. I rebuilt a 2000 Vantare suspension on an emergency service call in Ft Lauderdale a year or so ago it was an H like yours that's why im mentioning it because it had different valves on the rear. The 2 position 3-way spool valve that is between the 2 rear axles on that H was a different manufacturer NOT a Norgren. If its going down overnight its a big leak and will be easier to find U may or may not see that comment amusing. Im going to be in Oklahoma an hr or so SW of OK City First week of November. Ill find it and stop it.

[Dany]

let me know when you are in Oklahoma I have it in a nice shop lots of tools and light would love to have help thanks Dan

[Joe Camper]

OK Dan sounds like a plan here is my # if U call we can figure out the details 708 243 7871 We will turn the repair into another thread.

[Dany]

I talked to Joe Camper and watched him work on a x Vogue changing out valves air bags shocks and air fittings looks like he knows his busnisce thanks Mine is next on list to fix the LEANS Dany

[jbchevy3]

Dany,
How did the repair turn out?

[Joe Camper]

It didn't turn out well. I made the mistake of not having all the brass fittings (as I constantly preach) I needed to switch out a 2 position norgren we put on on the drivers rear corner. He had replaced the other norgren the 3 position already and all the other components look original. The only thing I saw leaking was the exhaust port on the 2 position norgren. The size and frequency of the bubbles at that norgren port was in relation to the rate of the lean, not right. What I was seeing told me it was not all of the lean. So I kept looking and looking soaped everything down extensively. Nothing. On a side note I found a pinhole on a bag tank a week or so later on an H in Michigan and the body of the 3 bag tanks on that corner of Dans I did not soap, just their fittings, my bad but he knows I called him. Getting on we pulled and replaced the 2 position norgren with the bubbles at its exhaust port and going back in a old original fitting was leaking. A branch T that I did not bring. In fact I left my entire fitting assortment about 75 miles away in Chickasha where I started from. On the way back to get that box we stopped at a few places and found fittings at an Ace Hardware. They turned out to be junk. The inserts on fittings, the little tube that goes inside the plastic line, is normally steel. These were copper like the rings and I did notice that when I bought them but thought nothing more of it. Well I could not get them tight enough and had small bubbles very small I couldn't get stopped. After I got back home I sent him the right fittings but I am still not entirely convinced that it will completly stop his lean. It was dropping overnight. Something bigger is amiss here. It turned into a social call. Dan is a good mechanic I showed him as much as I could, left him a nice pair of body support jacks im sure he will put to good use. They bought me catfish for lunch I had a nice drive. I hope to go back soon.

[Joe Camper]

I have been so dying to resurrect this thread. Another mistake on my trip out was only having a quart of leak detector that got all used up (always learning now I buy the gallon). So along with the fittings I sent him a quart of that too.

This was not going to be the first bus I could not get to stand there without going down and I never worked harder putting more work together in OK to be able to get back and make it right.

Well I did. Dan decided he would buy those 3 air bags on that corner and have me pull ALL the push ins on the suspension on the rear on both sides while out.

When I got there he told me after he got the leak detector I sent he found another leak at a drain cock on a football. I immediately was overwhelmed with emotion and was compelled to give him a great big hug almost kissed him but his wife was there . IMPO that and the fittings was representative to the severity of this particular lean.

The leans r gone.


Grease monkey tip of the day.

When the wheels r off and doing suspension work with the bus on the 4 body support points on stands do this laddys.

Construct yourselves another set of stands for the rear 2 axles. The drive axle requires a 12in stand to put it where with the bottom of the tires r 1 in off the ground. The tag axle needs a stand 151/2 in tall to get its tire 1 in off the ground.

This does 2 things first it makes putting the tires on and off easier way easier. BIG BIG advantage of these additional stands under the axles is when replacing suspension components and looking for air leaks u can air the bus up with the wheels off. THIS IS HUGE. Air it up until U raise the body off ITS support stands. Don't pull the support stands out now U can use the gap u create to easily gauge if its dropping.

Also after confirming no leaky leaky u can then slide the body support stands completely out put the level low into drive mod and set the ride height with the wheels off too. Being able to SAFELY check your work before putting the tires and rims back on will prove to be something any good mechanic will immediately appreciate.

Another suggestion I Have not seen anywhere else but I happily share with U.

I also would like to thank Dan for having me back to finish it right. Does my heart good to know a guy that's 2&1/2 hr from prevo dallas has a dago grease monkey out of Chicago come 900 miles instead.

Thank U again and all of U who give me the opportunity to hone my skills by working on these beautifully complicated campers.

[Dany]

Chicago Jo did a good timely job fixing leak and other preventive problems changed all push in fitting to compression fitting put new shocks brake caliper slide pins Brake pads driver Five Days later it is still setting Level Level Thanks Dany

[Gil_J]

Joe, you da man! Some other self professed air system experts can't hold a candle to you. Your insight on the small ping tanks and their unnecessary draincocks is probably news to most.

[jbchevy3]

Joe, what kind of valve do you recommend using in place of original drain cock on football tanks? OR, do you suggest just plugging them?

[Dany]

Chicago Joe came down fixed leak did preventive mantiance changed push in lines to compression installed shocks air bags.caliper slide pins and the boots brake pads on drivers in a timely and professional manner after Five Days Bus still Level Thanks Dany

[dale farley]

Dan,

Sounds like you've accomplished something that most never do. Way to go Joe!

[Joe Camper]

Jerry I am putting 1/2 in plugs in the drain holes. If U want to check for water pull the plug. In all the footballs I have opened I have yet to see a spit of moisture out of any of them.

Im really going to be disappointed if I get no response out of my IFS suspension test and survey because Im quite confident that most will see a significant rise in height up front

In short

Get in level low idling. Pump the brakes till the air pressure drops enough to get the air compressor running. Then remaining in LOW IDLE (this is the key) keep your finger on the up button for the front till the air pressure goes all the way up and air dryer sneezes then go see if the front end is higher than it has ever got.

If U want to do something under the front of bus safely using jack stands this is the easiest way most with IFS will get high enough to get the stands under it.

[gmcbuffalo]

Joe I read your other post and thought I learned something, but this one really turned the light on. As the compressor is filling the system with air and you are hold down on the up button, this links the front air bags with the aux tank, and the compressor thinks you have a big aux tank and fill the air bags to the max.
thanks,
GregM

[jbchevy3]

There was no water in mine either, thanks

[lbriant]

Joe,
My bus has a passenger side lean and I have changed every fitting I can get to without woking under the bus as I have stated in other threads I did discover the back passenger side football tank is leaking like a sieve at the push in fitting and the water drain, I may try to get that fixed if possible down here and I may not, But the first part of May we will be headed back to Iowa where we live in another resort in our Bus, I would like to possibly get together with you wherever would be best and go through the bottom side of my bus and do some preventative maintenance and fix any air leaks,

PS. Do you still work for catfish ? My freezer is full of Crappie and Walleye right now but I am right on the water right here I could pull out a few Catfish if necessary :rolleyes:

[Joe Camper]

Larry where R U now? Im in Fla. will be here a month. I will be in Tampa at the show on Monday. Didn't see a # in your profile.

Call me anytime 708 243 7871

I came down with enough fittings to refit 3 chassis

[Joe Camper]

Greg low idle is also a key on heavier front ends and this applies to driving mode and the ride height valve too.

I had lots of help discovering all this. First time I was in Huntsville Tenn under Pam and Lloyds CC in Eric and Debbie's pit. We had just put new bags on the front and it would not get to ride height. I was under the bus with a tape and noticed the bus just start to move up about 1/8 of an in just before the air dryer sneezed the compressor stopped and it quit going up.

Then Lloyd swore every morning first start the bus was low in the front and later in the day it would be normal. That's the first bus I turned up the pressure on and it solved the problem. I have gone on to discover the low idle trick to solve many others without turning up pressures but not all.

Im not dreaming these things im finding them on YOUR buses.

If full pressure is achieved at the brake tanks before max height (what happens in high idle). After the compressor stops and U R still on the up button the aux air will drop some, down to the front bag pressure and it will not be enough to drag the brake tank pressures down enough to start the compressor again. There U sit with your finger on the up button in a stall if it could be described like that.

Any coach that fires up with a front end below ride height that is forced through a air compressor cycle at low idle will be a happy bus for sure every time. ESPECIALLY if U have a heavier front end.

1 last thing the response time on our suspensions in both drive mode and level low is allover the board those of U who have had multiple prevo conversions I'm sure can attest to this. Some R quicker than others. If your friends is way quicker does not mean something is wrong with yours.

[Dany]

Chicago Joe found and fixed leaks did other preventive maintenance still level 12 days later thanks Joe good job and I had money left for fuel Dany

[Joe Camper]

This is becoming a common seen in POGers Garages.

just finished refitting an 08 Liberty XLIIDS with a good set of fittings.

12891

nother bus left smiling

[Joe Camper]

Something occoured to me today.

With IFS each front bag is fed thru its own 2 position norgren when u turn the key off they close.

SO...that means if any 1 component begins to leak on the front it can make u lean.

Unlike straight axles that both front bags R connected key off and only a rear leak can make you lean..

[Wilbur]

Mr Joe, do you change out regular fittings with compression fittings for a fee, and if so what do you charge

[jack14r]

Joe spent 2 days replacing the push in fittings for the compression type,he also adjusted the ride height on the front which was out of spec.We went for a drive today and it does drive better because the front is now at the correct height,it was an inch too high which meant that the airpressure in the front bags was greater than it should have been and it did ride very stiff,I also noticed that the noise over pot holes and expansion joints is much lower.I did not have any leans or problems,I just wanted to be pro active in the suspension area as I had started to loose more air pressure over night.Joe did a great job and his knowledge is very good on Prevost,he will be back to do some more work for me in the spring or summer,I recomend Joe to anyone that wants their bus (as he says) to be happy.

[truxton]

Jack,

Are you running Monroes or Koni's?

Later
bv

[jack14r]

I have the red Konis that are adjustable.

[truxton]

We were talking about shocks about a year ago and I said I was going to put on those Road Kings but never did. I put the Konis on and have them set medium. I think next time I'll just go with the reg Prevost shock, I think there Monroes. How big of a difference in feel on the Konis with 3 settings from soft to firm? Have you tried that?

[jack14r]

I have only tried the firm setting.

[truxton]

Ok, thanks