Problem with 110V Toe Kick Heater

[dale farley]

I have two of the 110V toe heaters in my 93 Marathon. The one in the kitchen works fine, but the one in the bathroom will not turn on when I adjust the thermostat in the bedroom. I hear the thermostat click, but there is no voltage getting to the heater. I assume there is a relay somewhere that sends the 110V to the heater when I turn the thermostat. Does anyone know where the relay is located? If I am on the wrong track, I figure you will tell me that too. Thanks. Dale

[truk4u]

Dale,
I have the same set up and both heaters are on one breaker, so that kind of rules out a breaker problem since the kitchen is working. I don't think there is a relay, should be just like a house thermostat. There might be a reset button on the kick heater that trips from over temp.

Also, I'm sure you are aware the one in the kitchen is dual purpose, runs the Webasco and the kick heater from the same thermostat. Let us know how you make out.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Dale,

The toe space heaters and parts can be found in WW Grainger and they are not very expensive.

The ones I have taken apart generally have two safety devices that can fail. One is a fusible link, that if open must be replaced. The second is a thermostat (a thermodisc type) that will open if the heating elements are working but the blower fan is not. Check both of them and you may find your problem.

The third type of failure is the heating element itself.

It is not possible to be more definitive from what you told us, but if the blower fan has failed the unit may be working except the lack of a fan may be causing it to cut in and out on the safety thermostat, and no heat will be blown out. Some heaters have a thermostat for the blower fan so the heating element can warm up before the fan comes on so cold air does not blow initially If your heater has a thermostatic switch for that purpose and it is cycling on the heaters only, you can by-pass that thermostat so the blower comes on right away.

Tom is right. There is no internal relay.

[jello_jeep]

If I remember all my reading right, is there not a red light on the kick heater that comes on if its not happy with the air flow?

I don't have the books here, they are with the bus in AZ, so don't hold me to it, but seems like I remember that.

[Alan__]

My Marathon toe kicks have a small red reset button that can be seen through the grill from the front. Using a very small screwdriver or other pointed device allows them to be reset. Mine have kicked off when run for long periods of time.

[dale farley]

Thanks for all the comments, but I obviously did a bad job of explaining the problem. When I removed the heater from the wall and checked the wires coming into it, there is no 110V coming to the heater. I know the thermostat itself can't be handling the full 110V because the heater is probably drawing 10 amps or more. I am assuming that the thermostat energizes a 12V relay that transfers the 110V from its source to the rear of my heater. I am assuming it works similar to the heat and air systems in our houses. I just don't know where the relay is? I think my heater is probably fine, and I know the breaker is working. Where's the relay? Does this mean, I am the first with this particular problem? Thanks.

[dale farley]

Well, I just got my first lesson from Marathon in Oregon. The Tech told me that the relays are actually located in my breakers. I have one breaker for each toe kick heater. I guess I will do some trouble shooting to see if I can actually determine if the remote controlled breaker is the problem. I'll let you know what I find out.

[dale farley]

After talking to the Marathon Tech, I thought I would be able to find the problem pretty easy, but that didn't happen.

I don't at all see what he is talking about when he said the breaker is remote controlled, and that when I adjust the thermostat, the termostat sends a signal to the breaker that then closes the circuit and provides 110V to the heater. When I check the voltage coming out the end of the breaker, there is 110V on it regardless where the thermostat is set. I can trip the breaker and of course the 110V no longer exists at the output of the breaker. I even tried switching the breaker with another but no results.

I seem to be back where I was before. I did take out the heater again and connected it to 110V and it works fine. There is just no voltage coming to the wires that connect to the heater. Any suggestions? Thanks.

[jello_jeep]

In my 96, the panel with all the readouts/controls/breakers is forward of the long hanging closet. There are removable panels inside the closet, and TONS of electronics available for service from there.

Maybe try there ?? :confused:

[Kevin Erion]

Roadrunner, you need to ask the Marathon tech to be more specific, where is the relay located? I don't think that a breaker can be a relay also, I think the relay is some where else. On my 99 there are relays on the ceiling of the second bay back for some of the electronics.
Good Luck,
Kevin

[dale farley]

Kevin, I will ask the Tech again, but he said very specifically today, that the relay was in the breaker itself, and that I would probably need to get the special breaker from Marathon or Prevost. he said the breaker was remote controlled by the thermostat.

I don't think my breakers have relays in them. He said I would be able to hear the breaker click when I turned the thermostat, but I did not. Neither did I hear the breaker for my other heater click when I turned it on, and it works fine. I can hear a faint click in the wall when I short across the terminals on my wall thermostat, but nothing happens when it clicks.

I connected my voltmeter to the wires coming to the heater and watched while I flipped breakers, thermostats, etc. "No Voltage!! My problem is somewhere between my wall thermostat and the back of my heater. It isn't in the heater, and doesn't appear to be in the breaker.

[garyde]

Hi Dale. Many companies make relay type circuit breakers. They all are designed differently. You should have Low Voltge wire going to the circuit breaker if it has a 24 volt or 12 volt interlock. You said there was power leaving the circuit breaker which indicates one of two things. Either you breker/relay is working fine, or you do not have a relay/breaker and the interlocking relay is elsewhere in the coach. Verify one of the two 1st an move forward from that point. Gary

[truk4u]

Dale,
Isn't this fun:eek: I'm with Jeep, the hanging closet has a removable panel and all the hot stuff is in there. Mine is to the rear of the closet and all 12,24 and 110 can be accessed. I'm sure there in different places based on vintage. Sounds to me like the home run hard wiring from the breaker to the heater.

[dale farley]

I feel pretty sure that my circuit breakers are not "relay" type. There is no other wire going to them except the #14 copper wire that comes out the end of the breaker, and it has 110V on it. I will look for access in the closet tomorrow.

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

While it may seem unlikely it is possible that you have a broken wire. Check for continuity between the breaker and the heater. In an early post you said you changed the defective braker with another. Was it another of the exact special type? Try and install the known special and working braker into the circuit for the inoperative heater.

[garyde]

I feel pretty sure that my circuit breakers are not "relay" type. There is no other wire going to them except the #14 copper wire that comes out the end of the breaker, and it has 110V on it. I will look for access in the closet tomorrow.

I am suprised to hear you have #14 guage wire not # 12 guage. I would verify that with the manufacturer. Without seeing a picture of the circuit breaker panel, I could not determine if it is breaker/relay.

If you do not already have one, can you get a wiring plan for your coach. Is the wire numbered at the panel as well as at the heater. If it passes thru a relay it may have an 'r ' or other designation on the wiring at the heater. Have you located all of the relay locations for your Coach. Are all of those labeled?
Try to verify that romex line is the same line from Circuit breaker to Heater. If you can isolate the nuetral and ground at both ends you can do a continuity test. you can do the same with the hot, but it may be going thru a relay somewhere else. Gary