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Joe Cannarozzi
10-20-2006, 07:36 PM
We have no information as to the size of our tanks. There are two identical tanks, staggered in the rear bay and I havent been able to find any information either on the tanks or in the books.

Does anybody know the formula to figure how much a square tank holds?

Or-How many cubic inches does a gallon of water displace?:confused:

MangoMike
10-20-2006, 08:06 PM
Joe,

231 cubic inches = 1 gallon.

Get 'em.

Mango

Jon Wehrenberg
10-20-2006, 08:40 PM
Joe, Don't forget to measure the height the water or waste will reach and not the height of the tank.

Whatever number you calculate it to be it will never be enough.

Joe Cannarozzi
10-21-2006, 02:08 PM
How true LOL:D

lewpopp
10-21-2006, 10:34 PM
And try not to lick your fingers. Jerry did and that's why he acts the way he does.

Are Mango Mike and Jerry still going steady? Have they advanced to kissing yet?

Remember...No PDA at POG meets.

Joe Cannarozzi
10-22-2006, 07:54 AM
Outdoor World here we come. If you-all dont decide to take POGIII to Lews local it would be a HUGE disservice to those of us who havent met him yet!

merle&louise
10-22-2006, 08:48 AM
Does Prevost or the converter determine the size of the water & waste water tanks?

Do most Prevosts have one tank for gray & one tank for black water, or one tank for both?

Is the waste water tank 5 gallons larger to prevent the possibility of overflows?

I like the one tank for both gray & black (with a by-pass valve to re-route the gray water).

Joe Cannarozzi
10-22-2006, 09:15 AM
I think Prevo kinda decides by the size of the bay, the converter puts as BIG a set as can fit. Ours measured out to be 120 or 125 Gal. We dont have a seperate gray tank, first motorhome we had without. Accept for flushing the hose after dumping, it really hasent affected much.

We also do not have a gray water by-pass. I am curious as to the correct use of this option. This is convienent if boon-docking but in a campground with sewer hook-up, and an electric dump switch I cant see a huge advantage? Am I overlooking something?

Jon Wehrenberg
10-22-2006, 09:22 AM
Dear Newell owner:

Prevost has nothing to do with the holding tanks on motor home conversions. Their responsibility ends with the shell the converter uses to convert.

The converter undoubtedly sizes the tanks according to the following, a.) available space in the bay, b.) how much screaming the owners do about the lack of water or holding capacity.

I can't begin to answer the question about two separate waste tanks. On our first coach black and gray were separated, even down to having two separate connections for the sewer hoses. I usually would drain the black water, and then flush the hose by reconnecting the hose and draining the gray water. Kind of a pain, but it worked. Now both go into one tank, but with a gray water bypass.

I like the concept of additional waste capacity, but as you have learned by hanging with this group special efforts are made to make the tanks overflow. We even know of one POGGER who intentionally used his tank to sham-poo (was that a bad pun or what?) his carpets.

Signed,

Ann Landers and Dear Abby

win42
10-22-2006, 11:24 AM
Be careful Jon. What goes around comes around. Dump switch? Us po folk have to put on our Harbor Freight blue rubber gloves and actually go outside and hook up the icky hose, open the black tank valve, then close it and open up the grey water valve to help flush out the heavies. Close the GW valve, disconnect the icky hose, make sure no one is watching and flush out the hose with clear water before depositing it into it's proper storage place.

The PP's only have to call park assistance and their little plastic bags are removed. Thats how come their stuff does'nt stink it comes out in little plastic bags.
h

Joe Cannarozzi
10-22-2006, 12:52 PM
Here in Chicago we lovingly refer to the dump switch as

"The Dave Mathews Switch";)

merle&louise
10-22-2006, 05:04 PM
Dear Ann & Abbey:

Thanks for the reply; but I would still like to know if the fresh water tank and the waste water tank are different sizes? It seems to me that the waste water tank should be about 5 gallons larger. That way it would be impossible to overflow the waste tank when dry camping; assuming that the owner used only the full fresh water tank capacity to start out with.

Liberty has answered regarding the single tank(thanks Abbey), but how about the other converters? Does Marathon, Country Coach, Millenium, Thompson, Royale, etc. have 2 separate tanks for gray and black? Please indicate the year of the coach as well as the converter.

Water & waste capacity is important to me because we tailgate a lot(similar to dry camping, but a lot more drinking!). My daughter and son-in-law share in the tailgating duties and they never check anything as insignificant as waste water levels. They just party on! THAT IS WHY I AM CONCERNED ABOUT HAVING MORE WASTE TANKAGE THAN FRESH WATER TANKAGE.:eek:


Thanks in advance for the information.

lewpopp
10-22-2006, 11:05 PM
Jon

What on earth is a grey water bypass used for if you have only one waste water tank. I'm trying to picture this.

As you know, I have 2 tanks and don't need to reconnect the hose for grey. Please explain the bypass bit.

truk4u
10-22-2006, 11:12 PM
Tuga & Karen,
It's hard to get a straight answer from this bunch, I'm not even sure I can do it, but here goes...:p

My Marathon has 2 tanks, the grey is 88, the black is 61 and the fresh water around 120 if I remember. Mine are plain manual dump valves, just the way I like it, no motors or electric valves to go bad. The sewer hose hook up is also up in the plumbing bay with a removable panel below to hook up your hose, unlike the Liberty's that hang down and get knocked off.:eek:

When things get bad with your party animals, turn off the pump, tell them the tank is full and head for the fresh smelling porta poties. Then when your inside all alone, hit the pump laugh.:D Hey, your the Captain, remember....

merle&louise
10-23-2006, 08:07 AM
Tom:

Thanks for the explanation. That's the answer that I was looking for; with 88gals of grey water and 61 gallons of black water - there is no way to overflow starting out with 120 gallons of fresh water.

I may be the captain, but I am an absentee captain! My kids use the coach with their buddies, and Karen & I stay home and let them tailgate.

Lew:

The grey water by-pass valve is used on a coach with one waste tank when you are dry camping out in an open grassland (Auburn University RV parking lot). There is a manifold that allows you to let the gray water drain on the ground as it is being used. The manifold re-routes the grey water away from the tank and thru the sewer hose hook-up connection.

If you attend POG III, I show you on my coach. It's easier to show you than it is to explain it. Maybe Jon or someone else can explain it better than I have.

Thanks for the response.

Jon Wehrenberg
10-23-2006, 08:50 AM
Dear Newell Owner,

As Tom's answer illustrates there is no standard. His coach has two tanks and a total waste volume greater than the fresh water volume.

But, he actually may only represent a small percentage of conversions. Or his may be typical. You need to hear from all other owners, and you also need to hear from converters. Since we had two different tanks on coach #1 and a single tank on #2 there does not appear to even be a standard with a converter.

As far as capacity, I would have to say that you can control the potential for having a Kevin episode by monitoring your tank status. We have display panels in two places and audible alarms. We can also limit stored fresh water to never exceed the holding tank capacity. On our coach the auto fill limits capacity of fresh water to 80%, but we also can manually fill it until it overflows.

All of my comments are related to my Liberty, and may have no relevence to any other Liberty or converter.

Signed,

Ann Landers and Dear Abby.

Coloradobus
10-23-2006, 07:24 PM
Mr. Newell Owner,

We have a 2000 Marathon "H"3-45. Our tank capacities are as follows.
Fresh tank=186 gallons plus 21 in the hot water heaters
Grey tank=86 gallons
Black tank=68 gallons
We have 2 separate dump vavles, one for grey and one for black. These valves join a central exit where the sewer hose attaches.

Another coach we know, a 2002 Marathon "H"3-45 has the same system as ours, but also has a macerator that diverts grey/black water thru a chopper/blender and sends the fluid out a separate port where a garden hose may attach. This macerator pumps the mess thru the hose and into where ever you put the hose.;)

Kevin Erion
10-23-2006, 11:06 PM
I found that the Black tank is unlimited, just let it go and go and go and......

Coloradobus
10-24-2006, 12:44 AM
So, Kevin,

Did you get the coach mess cleaned up? You left so quickly, we didn't know you were gone until someone mentioned it at dinner.
See you at Barrett/Jackson???

Kevin Erion
10-24-2006, 08:39 AM
Sorry I took off so quick, kinda had a few things I wanted to get home and take care of. My friend called for an RV spot and we are number 200 or something on the waiting list. last year we showed up on Friday of the last weekend and there where a lot of spots empty. I guess some people spent there Lewbucks early and left. If you hear of a spot open up, let me know, we may still try the weekend thing again. I would like to hook up and BS about the Marathons and vintage Airstream stuff.
Kevin
kevin@erionracing.com

mike kerley
10-24-2006, 02:37 PM
Tuga and Karen,

Our 93 Country Coach has a 64 gallon black tank, 112 gallon grey tank and holds 134 gallon of fresh water.

Seperate manual dump valves for black and grey tanks.

I've never run our of "black tankage", but have filled the grey to the top. We frequently go five nights boon-docking with out a problem. I'm thinking about plumbing the grey to the black with a pump system to allow me to transfer some of the grey water to the black tank for capacity and to better clean the black tank.

Jon's right, they all seem to be different.

Mike K.

Jerry Winchester
10-24-2006, 11:05 PM
Brother Newell Owner,

I think MangoMike can tell you from experience that when someone parks an anaconda in your crapper, you have to start considering TDF, turd displacement factor, in your calculations.

And since Lew is on about a bale of Metamucil a day, he surely must be careful of plopping a couple of whoppers into the black tank and still having enough water to over run the tank volume. And the fact that he rarely showers gives reason to question the size of his grey water tank :o

Sting
10-24-2006, 11:34 PM
JW...I cant stop laughing:) :D

merle&louise
10-25-2006, 08:02 AM
Lew:

Are you going to let this guy get away with that Metamusil crack?

Jerry Winchester
10-25-2006, 08:06 AM
You can't use the words "Lew" and "crack" in the same sentence.

merle&louise
10-25-2006, 08:08 AM
Thanks to everyone for replying to my post about waste water tankage.
They have been very helpful. This forum is the greatest!

Kevin's answer was the best!

lewpopp
10-25-2006, 09:49 AM
Tuga,

Jerry must be snooping around my area, (looking down my fan opening in the bathroom, spying on my s**t shoot, etc.) with the Metamucil bit. Didn't know he knew I was east coast distributor of the stuff. It keeps things moving.

He should use some to rid himself of some of the bull.

As for the "crack" remark. The big fellow has the largest crack in the POG according to Jon.

I use to have 3 iH Scouts I did snowplowing with years ago. What ughly (sp) unit they were. I became famous at the time with the logo on my equipment "YOUR NOBIL MOBIL DEALER". Take a run at that you peons.

Lew, YOUR NOBIL MOBIL DEALER.

rfoster
10-25-2006, 10:11 AM
JDUB: I like many others can't stop laughing. That's more entertainment than Oprah. I want my money back from Trac Star. Live is better. You and Nobil Mobil Metamucil Dealer are on your game this am. :D

Jon Wehrenberg
10-25-2006, 02:08 PM
Is that a crack on Lew, or is Lew on crack?

I'm not sure I get it.

Lew, how many seasons before the IH noise machines rotted out on the rust belt salted roads? My dad had several and he never seemed able to trade faster than the rust appeared.

merle&louise
10-25-2006, 06:43 PM
WHAT A FORUM!

Where can you go and get this kind of entertainment for $100 a year!:D

lewpopp
10-25-2006, 09:56 PM
I only kept the scouts for 2 and 3 years. I would get better service out of CJ Jeeps. I tried a Ford Bronco for a couple years and went bak to Jeeps. We could pull the clutches faster because we had more experience with Jeeps and a friend was the Jeep dealer.

Ben
10-25-2006, 11:32 PM
I can't believe so many convertors are doing separate black and gray tanks. That is mainly to conform to RVIA or something like it. A single tank allows you the choice to dump your gray water overboard (which I do 99% of the time) and then turn your combo tank (ala Liberty) into a huge black tank, which allows me to be free of hookups for 9-14 days. I wish a could go longer, but I can't imagine living with seperate tanks... I simple don't get the logic.

Jon Wehrenberg
10-26-2006, 08:25 AM
If you have separate tanks, you can still dump your gray water. When the black tank gets full it will flow into the gray tank, at which point you want to stop dumping gray.

Joe Cannarozzi
10-26-2006, 06:23 PM
Hickox, our converter built ours WRONG.

We have a 1 waste tank the exact same size as the fresh.

They obviously didnt consider TDF

Ben
11-04-2006, 04:12 PM
If you have separate tanks, you can still dump your gray water. When the black tank gets full it will flow into the gray tank, at which point you want to stop dumping gray.


The problem with that idea is that the gray water dump pipe is usually much smaller than the black, which has the potential of causing clogging problems. I'd hate to stop by my converter for work and have to explain to them why I allowed my gray tank to fill with black water and to figure out exactly how they were going to get the clogged contents out of the tank.

http://www.philcooper.com/albums/sog-99/DSC05402.jpg

dalej
11-04-2006, 06:13 PM
Ben I would really like to get that towel holder for my coach, can you put it in the stuff for sale? or would it be easier to tell me where to get one, or where to put one! also the soap and the faucet.

Ben
11-04-2006, 07:22 PM
That is a shot of a Marathon. I don't know the sources for any of the stuff since it's not my coach.

The faucet looks like a standard ones that are used in commercial kitchens and are placed above the stove so they can fill large soup pots.

You might want to consider contacting Marathon to figure things out. I think they also sometimes have a dispensor for disposable rubber gloves.

lewpopp
11-04-2006, 09:57 PM
Dale

I have the same setup of faucet and towel dispenser as Ben's picture.

When I first saw the picture I wondered if Ben's Liberty had the same set up as mine and now I know he was sneaking around a Marathon

I know the faucet is a Chicago Faucet. I think there is (was) a company out there who makes them. I would guess that the converters still install them cuz they're neat.

I you really are desparate for those parts, I would be very happy to take mine off (they are in perfect shape) and the $$$ I raise from the sale will help fund a newer coach. You must pay me in Lewbucks only. That's all the converters want these days.

I would be afraid to peddle my coach because I have had and am having very good luck with it.

Lew

garyde
11-04-2006, 10:13 PM
Hi Dale. I know my Plumbing supply store sales these items. Try a Plumbing supply store which sales Sinks, tubs, medicine cabs, etc. Gary

truk4u
11-05-2006, 08:46 AM
Gee Ben, I thought your Liberty looked exactly like my Marathon for a minute!:D

Hey Jon, how can the black tank back up into the grey tank when there are two knife valves separating the two?:confused:

MangoMike
11-05-2006, 11:02 AM
Dale,

In the restaurant we try to use T&S brand where ever possible. Their stuff is bullet proof.

Mike

gmcbuffalo
11-07-2006, 11:19 PM
Ben what do you mean by 99% dump overboard? How are you enjoying the Oregon rain?
GregM

ken&ellen
11-08-2006, 08:04 AM
MM, I think you would recommend the vandal proof Excel or World hand dryer in chrome of course!:D Less restroom mess with all those paper towels every where. The models activated with the motion sensing devices prevents the spred of germs. I am sure the Winchester model would be oil fired with a 5' flame to dry the immediate area of the campground. :eek: Ken

Ben
11-08-2006, 07:44 PM
I mean that I rarely store my graywater on board because it will cause my tank to fill faster than letting it drain onto the ground. So, when I turn on a sink or take a shower, you can see the water/soap coming out the underside of the bus. I'm doing it right now here in Oregon even though I'm parked at an RV park.

So, I turn on the graywater baypass switch, which causes all the sink and shower waste to be drained directly to the ground and my single waste tank is then used exclusively for black water, which allows me to last for 1.5-2 weeks before having to dump the tank.

So, I meant that 99% of the time I let me graywater be drained to the ground intead of being stored in my waste tank.

truk4u
11-08-2006, 09:16 PM
Be careful Ben, it's a big "no, no" in lots of places to dump grey water. Don't ask me why, it's just water and soap, but there are some real funky smelling grey tanks out there.;)

lewpopp
11-08-2006, 09:35 PM
Ben,

You mean to say that you are in an RV park and you don't drain your grey water out prior to leaving or every 5-6 days. What, no sewer hose?

Lew

Jerry Winchester
11-08-2006, 11:23 PM
Ken,

We have very few of those hand dryers in Houston. You generally spend about two minutes trying to dry them in the 99% humidity then you just wipe your hands on your pants and go on.

And what's the problem with a little flame action when required? Mike wouldn't let me bring my charcoal starter to POG 2, so it was pretty benign.

win42
11-09-2006, 09:21 AM
Grey water coming from my grey water tank smells worse than the black tank. "Theres fungus among us"
Jons tip given a couple of us @ POG2 of dumping a jug of dishwashing detergent in you tanks with a little water to slosh around while traveling, does wonders to the odor, cleans the tank and probably kills the bacteria. Jons presciption was handed out as a means of internally cleaning the probes on the side of the tanks that feed info to your panel showing tank levels.

Yeah I know the grey water gets a lot of soap from sink and shower, but it still stinks.

Lee Bornstein
11-09-2006, 10:29 AM
Ben:
Be careful... when your tank gets to 65% full the black will start to flow out the grey bypass.

Lee
97 Liberty XL 40 Classic

Ben
11-09-2006, 01:02 PM
I have no graywater tank and when I use the graywater bypass in my coach it does directly from the sink or shower to the ground completely bypassing the tank. I'm sure graywater smells if you store it in a tank for a while, but the water I'm talking about mainly contains... water... and a bit of soap. How does it stink so bad?... plug the drain in your shower at home and let it fill the tub as your shower and then learn over and smell it. That's what's going onto the ground in my case (it never goes into any kind of storage tank).

I know to close up that graywater bypass when my black tank is getting full... but in my experience I can get it up to about 75%, unless I'll be driving on very tristy roads. I usually close it when underway and then run some water before turning it back on just in case any black water splashed into the bypass valve area.

So, Lew... I have a sewer hose and I use it when I need to dump my tank. I have only one tank though and it can hold both black and graywater. If I use the graywater bypass, then I can use it as a black water tank and let the graywater go onto the ground (never being stored in a waste tank).

I turn off the graywater whenever there is a sign or when it would be objectionable (where in Oregon, I could dump my entire fresh water tank and nobody would notice that it happened since it's soooooo wet and rainy to begin with).

I'm not saying that everyone should use graywater bypass. But I'm not usually parked at an RV park and am often in areas where nobody could tell it's being used. It allows me to not have to dump my tanks for weeks instead of days and that's why I do it.

lewpopp
11-09-2006, 10:24 PM
JW has plugged up his shower and then took a whiff of it and forgot he peed in the shower. He's forgetful. Good thing you didn't tell him anything else or he would have done a job in the shower. WHAT A GUY !!!!

Lew