POG II - The Aftermath

[Jerry Winchester]

Well since the governor called and I got a stay of execution (didn't have to fly to Libya today), I thought we needed to start the post rally thread and let the lying begin.

I will start by saying what a great time Rae and I had driving from Oklahoma with Chris, Debbie and MangoMike. I had never traveled in mass with other coaches, so that just added to the fun. I can only imagine what the California guys went thru.

Tom (truk4u) really helped us out at the Balloon Fiesta and that was worth the two days spent there. Plus, AP bought a coach cleaning company in the process, so I feel better about the meager amount of money I contributed.

As we have always said, people make this work and without the folks in attendance, it would not have been as good a time. It was good to meet the new folks (except Dale) and A1 and Mike both gave very nice presentations. Harry's dent repair was exceptional (except the part where Dale helped)

Changes from POG I

Sante Fe Skies was pretty nice (thanks ColoradoBus) and the folks were very helpful.

The meeting room was great, but almost too small for the 50+ that we ended up having. This is a nice problem, but the projector and screen helped a bunch.

The food was good (if you like spicy Mexican food), so good thing Lew and his weak stomach were in Florida. And I appreciated the hot breakfast.

The Bling Contest was a hit, but I can't do it more than once a year. MM is a bling monster, so I don't want to invest thousands of dollars in R&D to compete with him :rolleyes: If Roger or A-1 put anything else on their coach, it will start looking like an Art Car (Google-Art Car Houston)

The name tags were good, but why did everyone of them have Jon A-1 on the back?

Chicks at the spa? We need to hold POGIII far from retail shopping and spa territory. This cost us some LewBucks. :(

I know there is more, but I also missed Helen Raymond, "The Sled Dog" and I will never forget Nancy's name again :o

Jan - You are a saint. (Dale's wife) :D

Changes for POGIII

The Newbies from POGII to handle arranging the technical sessions for POGIII

Kevin Erion to clean everyone's coach as they arrive at the rally.

Dale to photograph each couple with their coach for Christmas Card quality prints

Ken Z will hold a sautee and camp cooking workshop (complete with coordinated chef's hat and apron)

Ray Davis' seminar will include "Multiple Uses for Your Sat Dish" including Controlling the Mars Lander From Your Coach, ICBM Interdiction, Staging Laser Light Shows and my favorite, "Fuel Mileage Improvement - Using Your Dish as a Sail"

Also, Chris "AP" Yates will handle the seminar, "Random Buttons in Your Coach - Push them Wisely" followed by "CB Etiquette - When to just turn it off.."

[MangoMike]

JW,

Good suggestions, as always.

I'm thinking Ken-a-Zitter (now know as KAZ or Kazoo if he's excited) should hold the "Sautee those vegetables w/ your Webasto" Seminar.

Tuga and Karen can hold the "How to Disguise your Newell and Have a Great Time at a Prevo Rally"

Karl can hold the "Bring the Best Toy to the Rally - but Never Unload It"

Kevin E - is such an easy target at this point, but since I'm feeling so bad for him I won't mention his seminar. However, I'll make sure Corona Kelly sends him a get well card.

Truk4U - "Watch Your Back" seminar.

MM

[Chris and Debbie Yates]

One more suggestion for a subject for a seminar at POG111.
Formerly Fast Roger can talk in great detail on almost any subject.
He was able to demonstrate this ability when he explained where he got the empty Viagra bottle to stick on top of the Anal Award. "Oh no it's not mine, you see we stopped at a Wallmart pharmacy and there was a nice young lady pharmacist and we told her that we needed a bottle of Viagra (empty of course because I don't need that stuff) and it was for a practical joke. So you do see don't you that it is not mine, and it was empty when I got it. And I did mention didn't I that it's definitely not mine.
Methinks he protesteth too much:D

[Kevin Erion]

Thanks or the concern, all is doing better now, lifted the bedroom carpet and bed, placed a fan in the room and will have the carpet installer back in the morning to reinstall. Never let your gaurd down when flushing the "black" tank.
I had a great time in Santa Fe and the group is awesome, hope to make POGIII with Amy. I will volunteer for the Clean Up seminar at POGIII.
Kevin(Flood Victim)

[dalej]

This is our story of our trip home… Lets see where to start.

I was visiting with Brian E the day before we were to leave home from POGII, I wanted to see his coach when he was telling me about his 8V92 giving out on him going up a hill, it apparently got to hot and was ruined. He was telling me all the details about it when I said it better not ever happen to me. I was always told you can run those 8V’s as hard as you want.

Well Jan and I had just gotten out of the RV park and was headed up the first hill when I looked back and it looked like a freight train going through the mountains chugging away. My exhaust was bellowing black smoke just like a train. :eek: Brian’s story raced across my mind so I quickly looked at the temp gauge, fine. I then looked at the rpm gauge, then the rest of the gauges. I thought what’s going on, I know, Jdub and Mango put some sort of potion in the tanks of all the newbees, sort of a initiation. Jan said that would be pretty bad if that’s what it is. Anyway being Sunday and nowhere to go, I puffed black smoke 500 miles, mainly pulling up hills.

We got to a Detroit Allison in Colby KS. Monday morning, I drove a lot in the dark :cool: so people couldn’t see all the smoke. They told me it was an injector, one must have gone bad. I had just had the engine serviced in Omaha back in April. They had put a new set in, so they were still under warranty.

Now the bad news…:( I had left the engine doors open after the service mgr. and I looked it over. He told me where to unhook and leave the trailer while they worked on the injector. So while backing the trailer in its spot I seen the left door pop off the hinges when it hit the trailer, oh my! What else…:confused: they didn’t have the right injector so we had to leave the bus for a few days and drive the remaining 185 miles home in the car.

I can say though, we are so much looking forward to POGIII.

PS. I printed all the service centers out so just in case something like this happens again.

http://www.detroitdiesel.com/Service_Locator/Locator/details.asp

[Chris and Debbie Yates]

Dale and Jan,
We are truly sorry to hear of your misfortune, Debbie and I enjoyed meeting you both and hope that the repairs are swift and don't cost too many Lewbucks.

See you at POG111

Chris (AP)

[truk4u]

Dale and Jan,
Hang in there, it will all work out in the end.;)

Good suggestions for POG111, here are a few more:

Activities for the Lady's
A wine tasting
POG roster with names, addresses, phone, e-mail, etc. (prior to the Rally)
Cater the whole Rally (relieve poggers from any cooking)
Make breakfest at 9:00 and dinner at 7:00

What day is it? Yikes, I gotta make smoke and get home...:eek:

[MangoMike]

PhotoBoy & Jan,

JDUB and I would NEVER mess with your engine. Finger Paint your coach - maybe.

Sorry to hear about your tribulations. Hope to see you at POG III.

MM

[marchant]

We had a great time with all of ya'll. Mango, I had such a great time I forgot to unload yellow. Denise and I are planning on being at the next one.
Tom and Ray left us Monday at Amarillo while we decided to stay another night.
Tuesday we made it to Oklahoma City, fueled up and noticed oil on tow vehicle. The inspection showed transmission leak(where is Jon). Universal Engines scheduled us for Wed am and looks as if its just a seal and filler tube leak.
Kevin I won't complain (it could be worse.) Will post the results tomorrow.

[Kevin Erion]

Dale & Carl,
I am not complaining, it's just hard when it is self inflicted. I am learning with all things dealing with the bus to just take it as a learning experiance. I have yet to make the same mistake twice, I just hope the school leasons slow down.
Kevin

[Jim Skiff]

A link is posted on the Information Sharing page where you can link to a higher resolution image of the POG II group photo from Dale and Jan Juranek.

Once the image comes up, right click and save it for printing and viewing in a larger size.

Thanks Jan and Dale for the great group shot!

[rfoster]

Well for those still on the road here is the benefit of my experiences after leaving POG2.
Check engine light on- check water level, I checked a number of coaches at the rally except mine! Added fluid and corrected it.
Snow and blowing wind gusts of 44mph at Williams Az - bus starts but would not move. TPS failure low. No fast idle. Turns out had to make a run to Flagstaff in the toad to get a Throttle Position Sensor (screws onto the fuel pedal) sends an electronic signal to the engine to control the throttle. $95.00 and 60 miles round trip, back in action- On to Phoenix visiting relatives that haven't been seen in 35 years. Spent the night in Tucson Az (78 degrees) came in the cover of darkness, will slip on down the road tonite to somewhere in West Texas.
Kevin: glad to hear you are dry. (education costs)
Karl: Next Pog you win Bling Prize for your Toad!!
Mango: Jon says you are speeding!
AP: Was that your bottle?
Truk4U: Did you see any UFO's ( I got a cousin in Phoenix with pictures!)
JDUB: I'll let you rest this post
MikeSimmons: Any more tranny shift mysteries?
over and out

[Petervs]

Hi all, we had a great time at POG 2 and have officially joined. I had emailed Jim with a couple of ideas about future POGS and will put them here too. If you agree or not, I would enjoy hearing from you on it.

POG 1 and 2 and 3 are all going to be 6 months apart , October and April. If we keep this up it will lead to:

1. All POGs will be in southern areas where the weather is decent in April and October

2. POGs will never be in places like Yellowstone, Maine, Upper Michigan, Glacier National Park Montana, etc.

3.Some of us who live in northern latitudes will always have to drive a long ways.

4. People who live in warmer latitudes will never have the opportunity to head north to cool off in the hot time of year.

5. We will soon tire of going to the same places over and over.

6. People with children in school will always have to find a way to deal with that to attend a POG.

I think a schedule of a POG every 8 months will automatically rotate the POGs through the calendar and provide more variety and solve all the problems above.

Also, I think Santa Fe Skies Park was perfectly adequate. The meeting room was fine, the food was fine, the company was excellent, the opportunity to do some fun things in the area ( Santa Fe and the Balloon Fiesta) was great, and the technical discussions were fantastic. If we evolve the POGs into fancy deluxe resorts like Outdoor Resorts, and have all catered meals, and add live music, etc; well then I think we are starting to act a lot like FMCA or the Marathon Club. Personally, not my style. I certainly do not mind a deluxe resort once in a while, but I do not think it is a necessity. I think fun things to do in the area are a must.

OK, now you know my opinion, I hope to hear yours too.

Future POGs might include an award for the greatest distance traveled to attend?

[rmboies]

Does anybody who attended POGII have photos of Roger's bling:eek: Bob-00 is dying to see what he missed! Roger That(previously known as Fast Roger) and his lovely wife Mickie are not home yet so hopefully one of you will take pity on those of us who were unable to attend and share?? Then again, maybe I should just ask Lew he always has the inside scoop:D

Thanks,
Debi and Bob-00

[Jon Wehrenberg]

I seem to be following Peter's comments today, but that is OK because unlike some of us he makes sense.

To Peter and all, April and October are not cast in stone. In fact nothing is cast in stone. This is not a club or organization so as soon as someone thinks of a neat place or date for a rally or event they can make it happen. A case in point was OSH. It seemed like a neat idea so several of us did it.

If after the rally in April someone thinks a rally in Maine should take place in July, and there is sufficient support in the form of folks willing to do a little to make it happen it is a done deal. Personally I do not want to see POG evolve into something that has formal annual rally dates or seasons, but is just a bunch or Prevost lovers (not necessarily owners) that make rallies happen.

As the number of POG members grows it must be recognized that a lot of advance planning is necessary to reserve sufficient campground sites or to gain access to some events.

POG II was a special event. It's timing was dictated by the balloon festival, its location (thanks Jim and Chris) was dictated by avaialbility of sites suitable for our coaches, and the western location was meant to expose the west side of the country to the type of rally we had in FL. As the membership grows it is probable there will tend to be regional rallies and they will likely occur throughout the year allowing members to choose dates and places that work best.

The key to addressing concerns such as Peter's is to increase the number of members so there is always something in the works Until we get big enough we have to continue to get ideas out in the open.

But one thing....no structure, no fancy stuff, just fun relaxed rallies where everybody is a participant and nobody feels the group is just a bunch of cliques.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

As ole Bob pictured below illustrates, a POG rally without Jeff and Helen sucks.

[marchant]

Well, it's 5:00pm and we are leaving Oklahoma City with a replaced transmission seal.

United Engines was great to work with.

Headed to Memphis, then Nashville, then Georgia !"home"

[truk4u]

Good new Carl, just follow the bread crums I left for you!:D

[truk4u]

For those of you that weren't present, the following pictures go above and beyond the normal Rally maintenance seminar. Our own A-1 pulls an axle on his Liberty so poggers can understand the process needed in the event of being towed.:eek:

Were else could you find a more dedicated member.
Thanks Jon.......;)

310

311

[merle&louise]

Kevin:

I can sympathize with you buddy, the same thing happened to me in Zion RV Resort in Utah.

I was talking to the guy next door while I hooked up the sewer hose and I failed to open the valve. As we used water the tank filled up. Before leaving to go horseback riding we started a load of clothes washing. My friend, who stayed behind with the coach noticed the liquid gold coming up thru the shower drain( lowest point on the coach). He quickly realized what had happened, ran outside and opened the valve. Fortunately, the marble floor was the only area that received any water.

Don't feel bad; we've all done stupid things. I'll bet there are some other stories out there if some of the POGgers want to fess up. I'll bet the wives can enlighten us with some funny stories that the guys would rather not hear about it. How about it gals!

[MangoMike]

Debi & BOB-00,
Formerly Fast Roger was over the top with Stainless Steel. Covering every inch of his engine compartment and other areas of the bus. Combined w/ high intensity LED's

312

313

314

[MangoMike]

More Rog Bling

315

316

317

Honestly Pixs don't do it Justice. Roger and Jon both worked real hard to bling up their machines.

MM

[rmboies]

Thanks Mango, very impressive with all the added stainless and LED's. Sorry to have missed you and Donna this time but maybe the next one?? I appreciate the pictures;)

Debi and Bob-00

[Jon Wehrenberg]

I will admit to being a little over the top by polishing the air supply pipe to the turbo and stringing the (non LED) lights, but I tried to limit my "bling" to practical, but showy.

I do have to relate that on the way home a truck with more LED lights than I ever saw in one place went by. I told him I was impressed with his bling. He made JDUB's bus look like understatement.

He did not have a surface that wasn't covered with lights and when he turned on his signals the ones lined up like an arrow flashed and blinded anyone looking at his truck. He was from Memphis.

[Just Plain Jeff]

I will admit to being a little over the top by polishing the air supply pipe to the turbo and stringing the (non LED) lights, but I tried to limit my "bling" to practical, but showy.

I do have to relate that on the way home a truck with more LED lights than I ever saw in one place went by. I told him I was impressed with his bling. He made JDUB's bus look like understatement.

He did not have a surface that wasn't covered with lights and when he turned on his signals the ones lined up like an arrow flashed and blinded anyone looking at his truck. He was from Memphis.


http://www.orgsites.com/ca/johnwaynepizzapubclub/HAPPY70thBIRTHDAYelvis.jpg

[MangoMike]

Roger,
How did you know you needed a Throttle Position Sensor? Is this a part we should carry in our Ace Hardware bay? $95 and 60 miles isn't a huge price to pay, but still a pain in the bling.

Forum-ly I want to thank you from all the POG I' ers for taking the time and initiative in producing our own personal Anal awards.

Note to self in Truck Stop Overnite parking - Avoid sleeping next to Reefer trucks.

Peter - Well thought out comments - please keep the contributions coming.

MM

[garyde]

Well, I don't know what was more fun, the trip out ( Caravaning with 6 other Prevosts), The Prevost Rally (Meeting a really wonderful group of fellow Bus Nuts), or getting up at 4:00 AM to willingly FREEZE , and watch the Balloon Fiesta. Lise, Conner and I had such a great time. No problems (Thank the Bus Gods!) traveling home. (2 days)

Peter had some very good observations. I would only add, it would be nice to have an 'Open House' day where we could tour everyone's Bus. It was hard to get to everyone's Bus with so much going on.

Don't change the informal Dynamic, if it aint broken, don't fix it.

Kevin, my biggest faux paus, was attempting to go off roading in my Monaco several years ago and sinking the front end up to the front axles in mud. That cost me 14 k. We've all had our moments, just ask our wives!:o

[dalej]

Gary I like your idea of a open house. One of the things that Jan and I thought we could get at POGII was ideas on how to decorate our coach on the inside, we are starting to plan the redo of some parts i.e. captians chairs, dash, shades. We feel bad asking to see others coaches since they are really their homes.

I would also like to see at least one new coach from a convertor, would really like to see at least three. Just to see all the latest technical stuff.

[lewpopp]

Dale, Re: Open House.

Many years ago I belonged to a very large group of MH owners and our coaches were discontinued as far as production was concerned. ( GMC )

At each rally we listed on a large card what we were willing to show and put it in the front window. Certain times were set aside for tours and we all picked up some super ideas.

I would like to show a couple things I have done (not including the dash laminates) at some POG rally if it's not too far off. That's super fun. I had a wine and cheese party while showing my coach (GMC) when I did a major remodel. (hint: no wine allowed into the coach) .

Lew

[BrianE]

Wow! A lot has happened since we pulled out of SF Skies. We've been in the woods for almost a week and mucho has happened. Dale, thank goodness it wasn't a blown engine. Sounds like the door damage was worse than the injector problem, ouch.:( Kevin, I too had a tank incident, luckily it just gave me a bath and didn't ruin the inside of the coach. Others had their tribulations also. Hope everyone made it home safely and didn't break the lewbank. Tuga's right, we need an "I learned about Bussin' From That" forum. Our wives could definately make it look bad for many of us. Beverly and I had a great time and would like to thank all who made it happen. The POG I folks especially that took the time and made the effort to head west were the glue that stuck us together. We'd also like to echo Peter's and Jon's comments about future gatherings. This is a great bunch of folks and being flexible, having fun and sometimes going "off the wall" can separate us from other groups.

BrianE
94 Liberty XL

[BUSTER]

Hi to all my new POG ll friends,

Jean and I are back in Laguna Hills. We had a gremlin in our transmission in the hills of New Mexico when we were running with Ken Z and Roger. No power going up some of the hills...seems to have gone away...no doubt it was some form of operator error....the grelim showed up a day later when it would not go into D...but did after I pressed the mode and diagnostic arrows...all went well as far as the tranny goes after that.
We stopped one night in Outdoor Resorts in Las Vegas....seems they might want to sell me a concrete pad for a large sum of money ( not going to happen). They arranged for a free night stay to check out the place. All went well until we decided to leave. I went to dump the black water and the sewer was blocked and brown smelly fluid appeared around the hose....you can imagine what happened after that...although not as bad as the scene in the RV movie....picture this...an unhappy Mike holding a black water hose with the drain open of a full tank of black water and the drain blocked...it was not a pretty sight !!!
Jean and I could not have had a more enjoyable time in Santa Fe meeting all the POG ll folks...thank you to all.

As far as POG lll , I am keeping track of all the fine suggestions and Ray is at the site as I write this. We will keep you posted.

Mike & Jean Simmons

simmonsmj@aol.com
j1simmons@aol.com

[Jon Wehrenberg]

I've got a few suggestions:

Don't confess anything, especially about the nasty stuff. Now that Mango, Kevin and you have all publicly admitted to having issues with that stuff, there may be an award at POG III.

Gremlins don't go away. Even self inflicted ones. I suggest you try to figure out what is going on, because transmission problems are expensive, and very expensive when a tow truck is involved.

I also suggest you keep stirring the pot with respect to the POG III. Whipping up the excitement (ala bling contest) makes for a great party atmosphere.

[Jerry Winchester]

Yep Jon, I see an award for POG III here....."Royal Order of the Mango....With AP Cluster" for anyone who has endured self inflicted bio hazard contamination of the first order.

And it would count;

If your dog hit the dump switch
If your wife hit the dump switch
If you hit the switch then looked up the outlet to see why there was no honey flowing
If the switch inadvertantly moved itself and you got a little nectar on you
Or if you tried to wash the crapper tank out and caused Old Faithful to rise up in your coach.

See a trend here?

Mike
AP
Mike
AP
Kevin

[dalej]

Well I brought the baby home afrer the injector fouled, the Doc said to have a couple of Michlelob Ultra's and call if any thing changes. Jan and I are headed to Phoenix nest month to our nephews wedding so we can see how it really preforms.

[MangoMike]

JW,

You're way too gracious, as I feel that there is plenty of Mango Awards already floating around the POG.

I'm thinking the Annual Kevinator Award. Kinda like stirring the tanks on Apollo 13.

MM

Not to break thread, but since we are talking about KE, that Corona Kelly pixs are appearing soon.

JW - Is that a flying Prarie Dog? (or gerbil if AP is watching).

[win42]

Jim: What information sharing page? Where is it found?
Thanks
Harry

[Lee Bornstein]

Mike:

Gee - Outdoor Resorts maintenance crew had a big Vacuum Pumper out on Monday to remove debris from the sewer line in the new lot section.

Guess I'd better have words with our maintenance supervisor and see to it that this kinda sh## doesn't happen again.

Just want to say thank you for driving us down to Dawn Patrol - glad you stayed awake for the trip.

Good to meet you and your wife - hope to see you again.

Lee

[MangoMike]

Could've swear I saw Ray Davis in Big Red over the horizon with the Sails flying.

320


MM

[Jerry Winchester]

Mike,

That's what happens to a prairie dog at 300 yards when he intercepts a 22-250 round at 4300 feet per second.....

Yes they do fly. Generally into pieces.

Harry,

The information page is on the "Home Page" of the POG site.

Word is that Ray is looking to install one of these on his way home from Texas.

http://www.nrao.edu/imagegallery/images/VLA729_lo.jpg

[bluevost]

Hey POGers,

Janet and I wanted to thank everyone for a great few days in Santa Fe. We had a wonderful time and enjoyed meeting all of you. The food and fellowship were outstanding. Tom truk4u with my generator, Mango and JDub on my Webasto, and Jon A-1 for basic bus chit-chat, thanks guys.

The California Contingent is going to put on a good ralley next spring!!!

Ken Zittrer
"bluevost"

[Ray Davis]

Hello All,

I've waited to get on and post, waiting until I got to Kerrville TX. We arrived just this afternoon, after spending a couple of days with Kathy's uncle in San Angelo, and then a couple more days at Medina Lake (1000 Trails).

The Buckhorn Lake RV Park here is absolutely gorgeous. I'll try to post some pictures a bit later this evening. There is plenty of place to handle our size rally (35-45 coaches). They are hosting 3 rallys this week, with the Datastorm rally having 109 coaches at this count!

The park is gorgeous. Everything is paved, and the sites are concrete. It is unbelievably clean. I'm told that April looks good for a rally, with only one other rally scheduled the week of the 15th. I'll try to speak more with them this week.

Right now weather is in the 70's during the day, but I'm told that things get a bit chilly.

If you are interested, the following link shows the Datastorm users as they arrive and log in at the park.

http://map.datastormusers.com/buckhorn.cfm

Had a wonderful time in Santa Fe with the POGGERS. I'll try to post some pictures from Kerrville a bit later this evening.

Till later,
Ray

[rfoster]

Mano: You asked how did I know? The following clues assited me:
Jons phone number
Prevost phone number
Detroit Diesel 800 number off the side of the engine
1st : I started the engine after two nites in the cold weather, and hit the fast idle button-nothing happened,

2nd then the DD display read" Alert TPS failure low"
3rd: Knowing that TPS was throttle position sensor I tried the gas pedal and nothing happened.
4th I called Jon and wined to him,
5th - he said been there, done that, check for loose wires, could not find any
6 called prevost- they wanted 48.00 to start a break down case, using by diplomatic techniques I explained I was already broke down and with a little info I could fix it myself. He wanted to call a tow truck, I was out on that,
6. Then I call Detroit Diesel Highway number off the engine, this guy was helpful, I explained the check engine(now on) lite was on, TPS System Failure low (Iasked him were the high one was?) He said that the check engine lite on, no fast idle, and no throttle response, he would bet that it was TPS and then gave me a phone number to a truck place in Flagstaff, I called them and they could NOT cross reference the part #, but you go ahead and bring that puppy in here and maybe we can find one that will work. I had no other shot at this time so that is what I did and he had one.
So the moral of all this "Jon was right on"!:cool:
And no I wouldn't carry a spare, too expensive, maybe next time we can borrow on from Lew

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Since this thread is the "Aftermath", and since we were spanked for not sticking to the topic by a grumpy old man I will reveal my thoughts on what led up to this aftermath.

When I thought of adding the lights I approached Roger and another POGGER (you know who you are) with the intent to blow the dynamic duo away. All of my posts were trash talk, and leading up to Santa Fe I could see we were going to have fun.

When Roger finally got his lights, I had already installed mine (including the engine) and showed them to him and Micki. I made all the mistakes putting mine in, and when Roger and I put them on Roger's coach we were both laughing and acting like kids and we managed to get the bulk of the work done in one day.

On the trip out it seemed like every night Roger sprung another "bling" on Di and I. We added the scrolling license plate message frame (thanks to Roger), we hung the disco ball (thanks to Roger), we had the scrolling message belts (thanks to Roger) and as it turned out the right man won the Bling Contest. Money can't buy the fun we had. We had our lights on in campgrounds and in one, with the lights under the coaches flashing the other RVers called us flashers. If only they knew.

My only concern now is how are Mike, Ken and Ray going to whip this group into shape enought for us to populate an unscale resort. We are sewage spilling, joke playing, out of control idiots who will end up messing up other people's otherwise boring, serious, and dull lives.

[truk4u]

C'mon Dodger, you know the TPS problem was caused by a lack of voltage due to the Bling lights and your Bling partner is covering for you!:p

[MangoMike]

Fast Roger,

Thanks for taking the time to detail your issue. Your pit-bull approach paid off.

truk4u - you may be on to something here.

MM

[rfoster]

Truk4U: You and Mango may have guessed something, but the TPS failure low, meant low voltage to the Prevost guy, the Detroit Diesel guy said to replace the sensor. The Bling lights were not on when this occurred- so the Bling cannot be blamed for this. The exKing of Bling said if I could not find a loose connection, then replace sensor.

As I reflect back trying to recall any signs of the failure coming, when I cranked up at Santa Fe the only unusual thing was the engine sputtered a few times and sounded like it was on about 2 cylinders for a couple of seconds, and then cleared up and ran normal. I thought that may have been because of the cold nites, high altitude, or like me, getting old and slow to start.
PS Mango, if Lew had one in his Ace Store, it is so small you probably couldn't find it. If you get a hold of one those Lew translators whatyoumacallits let me know.

[dalej]

Ray, I like how datastorm details there map which shows where everyone attending the rally is located in the park. Maybe we can use some of their ideas. Was wondering also when we register for POG3 or any rally, when we fill our our registration form online or otherwise can't all the information go to the park to avoid pulling up to the office. We could have our site already assigned to us, so pull into our site and walk to the office and tell them were here or better yet the rally master could over see people pulling in and take care of the office business. Also keep everyone together, at SF seemed there were three different locations.

Just some of the cornhuskers thoughts!

[MangoMike]

Fast Roger,

Interestingly my engine sputtered slightly the same way when started in Sante Fe, so I'm assuming it was the altitude.

Dale,
I like the locator idea. Especially if we could strap some sort of GPS transmitter to Jon's butt so we always know where that dude is lurking ;)

MIke

[Navigator]

"we were both laughing and acting like kids"

We have only been POG members for a short time and don't yet have bus. Although we do have a couple buses in our scope now thanks to lots of help from many of you POGGING renegades. I have learned that the forum action, jokes, jabs and teasing, moves from category to category regardless of topic. On with the post!

About 4 or 5 weeks ago we noticed some unseal atmospheric conditions resulting in a change of winter bird migration patterns, an unusual number of Homeland Security jets flying overhead and changes in our local weather patterns. Finally, we have discovered the reasons for this activity after reading many of your posts and viewing the pictures from POG II. Most of these changes occurring from our west seemed to be caused by Jon (A-1) and Roger (Formerly Fast) trying to out BLING not only each other but everyone else. From the east it was caused by Mike Mango's experimentations. Being trapped in the middle only 2 or 3 hours from each of these sources has been quit an experience. Some of you have seen the Northern Lights. We have seen the even brighter and more fantastic Lights of Bling!

Jon's comments in his above post, "we were both laughing and acting like kids" hit the nail on the head and is exactly what drew us to POG in the first place. Looking at all the pictures from POG I on Mango's site and seeing how much fun everyone was having, plus all the jokes, jabs and teasing that goes on here in the forum made it hard to resist becoming a POG member. I think we made the right decision??

You folks who have participated in POG I & II have certainly made Patty and I very envious of your exploits and of all the fun you have shared together! Most of all thanks for letting us here at home share in your fun and good times thru your emails and pictures! Fantastic!!! And that's what its all about HAVING FUN TOGETHER!

Forum note: It's like riding down the interstate, one minute your having a serious conversation and the next minute you see this stupid billboard. What were we talking about, oh well it must not have been important anyway! We return now to our orginal programming.

[dalej]

Chris, we agree with you on post pogII blues (on CK thread) Jan and I think we should have a POGIIand1/2 or pre POGIII at Kerrville? just to check it out! OK....we just want to get back out of here and travel full time and do fun stuff. This working for a living gets old.

[truk4u]

Your sputtering was probably due to the cold. I on the other hand being a displaced Yankee, hit the engine heat button in the morning while the Webasco heated the bus and hot water and when I turned the key it was a nice 100 degrees.:cool: Sprang to life with narry a stumble.;)

[lewpopp]

Meanwhile... Back to the subject of TPS.

Youse guys kid about Lew having one in his Ace Hardware.

Doesn't everyone carry an assortment of potentiometers? Be careful who you throw stones at gentlemen, I'll challenge you to a potentiometer throwing contest. Oh, I forgot, youse guys are already out of ammunition. I win!!

Lew

[Chris and Debbie Yates]

Hey Dale and Jan,
Being the badass bikers that you are, you should check out koyote ranch at koyoteranch.com, it is just down the road from Kerrville and caters to buses and bikers. We spent a few days there over the Labor day weekend, nice facilities and biker friendly.

Just say when:D

AP

PS Jim I am sorry if I should have entered this post under Buses and Bikers

[win42]

Lew:
No potentiometrs on board, but I have pitot tubes, incline manometers and magnahelic gauges. These items are used to measure pressure drop across filters and determine air velocity.
Go easy on us with those Chanel 9 words.
We missed you @ POG 2. The next one will be closer to your home. Plan on being there in April. I had a hard time operating without my third baseman.
Harry

[rfoster]

Tom: I have continued to question the sputtering issue because I did not use the Webasto (being the True Southern boy that I am), I set the thermostat on the cruise airs and continued to relax comfortably while at SF. However after having the TPS issue, I made it a point to fire up the Webasto a couple of hours before cranking the engine and the coach was also nice and toasty on the cold mornings. Engine immediately purred. It likes to be warm too! I just don't care for all the noise from the inside fans.

[MangoMike]

Fast Roger,

Like me, you probably have squeeky Webasto blower fans inside the bus. I think Jon was going to get us a suggested Grainger part #. I found I like the heat better as it rises from the bottom, unlike the cruise airs where the heat just hangs around the ceiling.

MM

[truk4u]

Fan noise?:eek: My Marathon has two fan speed settings on the 12V heat side and you can barely hear the low speed, it's much quieter than the Cruiseairs. Is it possible the all mighty Liberty's don't have this option?:confused:

You lucky dog, wish I was still out there instead of being back to the grind. Great pic of the Grand Canyon....

[dalej]

Well now the rest of the story....

Remember me blowing black smoke? When I took the bus in for that bad injector, I had mentioned to the Detroit guy the transmission hose that had rubbed a hole in it and I had fixed it with a hose nipple and four clamps, (remember the thread, Check your hoses?) I said if you have time you can put a new hose on, but re-route it so it won't happen again.

When I went back Thursday the bill was $900 and change. Remember that the injector is under warranty. He said he found a hole in the exaust manifold and had it welded, found a small water leak, replaced the hose, the KN filter was plugged from the bad injector blowing smoke. Anyway paid it and went on my way.

After sleeping on it, I started thinking man! that's was expensive for no more then what was done. So I called down and asked for the store manager and visited with him for a few minutes. He thought it sounded high and asked if he was to credit me back $400 would that be fair, I said yes.

I'm writing this to see if this is an isolated incendent or should we as "rich bus owners", beware. I would just think that they would call to see if you want these little things (that I enjoy fixing) done.

Any thoughts?

[merle&louise]

Dale:

I don't think that it was an isolated incident. I think that anybody will take advantage of anybody else at any time. You have to be constantly on guard.

During Jon's air brake talk he told us not to have our coaches towed in case of an air brake failure on one wheel; just have the mechanic "cage the brake" and then drive the coach to the truck stop repair center. If the guy tells you it has to be towed, at lease we will know enough to say "no". That little bit of knowledge paid for my trip to SF.

Knowledge is power! If you know how long a repair job should take you can argue your position more favorably.

I have questioned repair bills in the past and have had the same results that you did. They knocked a few hundred dollars off. Please keep in mind that I don't do this everytime I have my coach worked on; only when I feel that I have been overcharged. Once the repair center knows that you are checking, they seem to be a little more careful with the pencil.:D

[MangoMike]

Dale & Tuga,

Thanks for taking the time to share. I think it's vital that everytime anyone does anything to their bus that it should be posted here. It may be a trivial item to you, but to a NOOB it may be a first time revelation. Postings like this is what makes POG really work. Harassing Lew is just icing on the cake.

Peace & Bus Love - Mango

[Coloradobus]

Our trip to Marathon last month was a big deal $$$$$$. They inititally wanted to charge 14.43 hours at $85/hour to replace the 2 upper front windshields on the "H", among other issues we needed corrected They wanted to charge $378/window. I had to go in and remind them that we had already discussed the price: 4 1/2 hours labor to replace with new windows that had blackout film on them for $250/window each.
The extra labour rate, I think, they were trying for was the fact the clearance between the new glass/film was so tight they had to adjust, sand some wood behind the shades, and then steam clean our shades(they got them dirty while changing the windows out) In the end we got the glass for the for 250 and they shaved 10 hours off the install and agreed the intitial charge seemed excxessive.
Chris and I have discussed that there are some coach owners, "The A Crowd" as wee call them, who have an open check book, just hand the converter a blank signed check and say FIT IT!. Welll, the first question out of our mouths is, "how much?" I know it drives Pat Sprenger crazy!:D
Yes, you need to stay on your toes.

[rfoster]

Thanks to Tuga, Dale, and CoBus, for filling us in on their experiences with extraordinary repair cost and the improved results. This is what POG is all about.

Then we have fun experiences on top of it.

Remember this:
337
After about 4500 miles and I did this:
339
Then this happened:
341
I spent all my money on fuel

[lewpopp]

Harry,

Your memory is going. I moved to 2nd base.

Lew

[garyde]

When my Bedroom Slide Seal Broke one week before POG ll, I made an appointment and took the Coach down to Prevost in Orange County by the hwy 15. It took 6.5 hours to do the R & R. I had told them when I first got there, Liberty said it was a new Seal and it should be under Warrenty. The deal I made with Prevost was , they would pick up the cost of the Seal and I would pay the Labor ( since they did not do the original replacement I guess).
Anyway, I recieved the Bill this week : $2900.00. They had forgot to credit the $2300.00 Seal. I got it squared away but that is one expensive inner tube!

[merle&louise]

Gary:

Did the bedroom slide have to be removed from the coach to install the new inner tube? 6.5 hours of labor seems excessive, unless the slide has to be removed from the coach.

When my bedroom slide gasket was knicked by a painter's grinding wheel, it took about 2 hours to remove and install the new inner tube. The bedroom slide did not have to be removed, the slide was retracted into the coach by removing the STOP bolt, thus allowing the slide room to slide in enough for the tech to change the inner tube. The cost of the inner tube was $1100, which I thought was high, but hey, supply & demand!

I am going to try to find a source that will sell me an inner tube directly. If I am able to contact a vendor, I will pass the info on to you and the rest of the POGGERS. I watched the tech change my inner tube, it is so easy I think that I could do it. I have a picture of the process, but I don't know how to post it on this website.

One more question, what caused the inner tube to fail? Did it roll when you were extending the slide?

[Coloradobus]

Tuga,

On the Prevost side of the installed slides, all you need to do is tease the computer a bit, remove a piece of outside molding and the room recesses into the coach. then the inner seal is accessible.
On non-prevost installed slides (HWH in older bus conversion like the 6 "XL" Dominion floorplan coaches Country coach did, 2000-2001 MSO, 1999 shells) the entire room MUST be removed. This entails cabinetry disassembly etc. Monster hours to replace the seal and a monster of a bill to follow>:eek: That's why we got rid of ours 4 years ago. That, and it drove like a "beached whale" and was over weight on the front axle.:(

[win42]

Lew: You were put on second because your arm went away but your voice is still strong. Yatta, yatta, yadda yadda (whatever). We definately missed you at POG2 there was exactly 20 seconds of silence at diner one night, which I'm sure you could have filled. You better show up @ POG3 or were coming to get you.
Harry

[garyde]

Well, the problem with the Liberty, as with other conversion Coaches, it takes 2 hours just to dis-assemble interior walls, exterior equipment just to get at everything. Yes , the slide does go in but first you have to;
A. Remove Fan, bypass the locking pins , 1 hour
B. Remove stops & Canopy @ top of Slide Room . 1.5 hour
C. Find / get to the slide motor, Hand ratchet the Slide 2-3 inches inside.
1 hour,
D. Remove Seal & Clean/Scrape off old Glue. 1.5 hours
E. Install new Seal, Slide roomm out, re-attach stops,re-attach Canopy.
Re-seal Stop Screws ( Marine Sealer) 1.5 hrs

F. Re-install Squirrel cage fan @ Computer for Slide Pins after re-setting.
1/2 hour
G. Wait 3 hours for Sealer on top of slide to dry before Sliding Room in.

I watched all of this so I could do it in the future. I am not sure how he go the Pins to open up, but everything else was strait forward.

[merle&louise]

Thanks Gary for the detailed description. I can now understand the 6 hour labor charges.

Do you know what caused the inner tube to fail?

Could you see a tear or cut in the old tube?

[MangoMike]

In case you haven't had your fill of POG II. A little pictorial summation of the trip.

http://www.prevoman.com/Pages/POG%20II%20SF/ApagePogII0.html

Mike

[garyde]

Hi Tuga. I was told by Liberty (Troy) Prevost might have a recall issue with that tube. Its hard to say, It was a large Leak. When I was driving back from Florida, I did hear a loud Pop one day, but never had a leak until weeks later. I hope everything is going great , hope to see you soon. Gary

[truk4u]

Great Pic's Mango, thanks....;)

[rfoster]

Thanks Mango, I got even more grins and chuckles viewing the photos. I really do like the "DUB TUB". What does AP stand for?

[MangoMike]

Thanks Roger and Tom. Pixs wil be fun to look at during the cold months of winter.

AP - Man of mystery and fashion - Austin Powers.

MM

[Navigator]

Mike, Tom, Dale, Roger and all other photographers,

All of your pictures are superb!! Its great to see everyone having so much fun. Hey, its worth a Prevo to have that much fun.
And to think all of the jokes, jabs and teasing are thrown in for free!

Mike, where do we send the money for those special Black Mail pictures of Jon, Roger, Chris, Jerry and the rest of the gang that you haven't posted yet??

Thanks

[MangoMike]

Nav,

I'm saving those pixs to when I need some serious work done on the Mothership. ;) (or quick fuel cash)


Mike

[Navigator]

Sounds like "Free Fuel for Life" to me!

[rfoster]

Mango/ JDUB:
Got my newest Mango Mike Cap out this AM. The lil lite was all but gone, but if you squeeze the battery hard, it will lite up.
395

Also - meant to pass on my compliments to the fine dining experience Jon and I had whilst visiting your "Western" eating establishment!
396

The Food at POG2 Was the Best- thanks again for the hard work, good food, and big fun!:cool:

[Jerry Winchester]

We did forget to post this photo of Chris "AP" Yates.

397

We have one of Navigator to post if he ever buys a coach.........

[Chris and Debbie Yates]

You try to help one sheep get over a fence and look at the trouble you get into:o
Like I told Truk4u I am not shearing her,you have to find your own:D

[dalej]

Well now the rest of the story....

Remember me blowing black smoke? When I took the bus in for that bad injector, I had mentioned to the Detroit guy the transmission hose that had rubbed a hole in it and I had fixed it with a hose nipple and four clamps, (remember the thread, Check your hoses?) I said if you have time you can put a new hose on, but re-route it so it won't happen again.

When I went back Thursday the bill was $900 and change. Remember that the injector is under warranty. He said he found a hole in the exaust manifold and had it welded, found a small water leak, replaced the hose, the KN filter was plugged from the bad injector blowing smoke. Anyway paid it and went on my way.

After sleeping on it, I started thinking man! that's was expensive for no more then what was done. So I called down and asked for the store manager and visited with him for a few minutes. He thought it sounded high and asked if he was to credit me back $400 would that be fair, I said yes.

I'm writing this to see if this is an isolated incendent or should we as "rich bus owners", beware. I would just think that they would call to see if you want these little things (that I enjoy fixing) done.

Any thoughts?


This is the rest of the rest of the story...

We were getting ready to leave for Phoenix on 11.9 so the night before I was checking the oil I found the oil on the dip stick was up about 10 inches above the F, WHAT:eek: , I checked it again and sure enough it had diesel in the oil:( . I got on the phone and called Detroit in Colby KS and he said that they must have cracked a fuel line when they put the new injector in. I had driven it 190 miles home after the repair was done. So I changed the oil and drove it back down to Colby so they could put in new lines on the #2 cylinder which had the new injector. It took 3 hours for the repair and we were on our way.

Also I had recieved three windshields from Prevost, before we had left so I put one in the drivers side, it always looks so nice when you have a new windshield;) We made it to Phoenix and then just started home, not even out of the city and bame, the drivers window took a hit:( . Well I have another windshield to replace.

Do you every think that maybe your supposed to just stay home?

[win42]

Dale: Bummer! Bad luck runs in threes'. I think you have your quota. Don't get discourged the black cloud following you has drifted away.

[MangoMike]

Dale,

Sorry man. I feel your pain.

I know Jon did a detailed HOW TO on windshield replacement, but for us simpler mind guys could you do a picture book of your next installation. That coupled with Jon's expose would be great.

Mike

[truk4u]

Keep the faith Dale, I see a trouble free trip to Kerrville in your future. ;)

[dalej]

Thanks Guys, After we left Colby KS we ran 2400 miles and the 8V just purred. I like how JW put it " didn't miss a knot"

Diesel prices were 2.49 to 2.62, ouch! spent a ton of Lewbucks on fuel.

[Ray Davis]

You know, sometimes I get a bit upset at these repair facilities. My lack of jake brakes turned out to be (according to the DD repair shop): "bad connectivity of the jake terminals under the valve cover".

I think the real translation of that is: :eek: Oops! We forgot to hook them suckers back up when we did your tuneup previously!!