XL door handle failure

[GSwaim]

http://swaimquest.com/images/old.jpgI have read many posts that talk about the creative way to get into your XL or XLII when the door handle decides to fail and lock you out. I've even seen pictures of the special tool made to jimmie your way in through the door bell access hole. I have yet to hear a full description as to how to prevent the failure from happening. What ever happened to an ounce of prevention being worth more? I have an 02 XLII that still has it's original handle and before I'm locked out I've decided to learn what it takes to prevent this handle mechanism failure.

Prevost says they have a fix which is part # 288556 "Product Improvement kit" as they call it. It appears very sturdy and they claim they have never had to replace it. I like to hear some testamony to that fact from the group here on how it performs. It appears the kit has all the linkage and such to make a complete upgrade. Prevost is looking at 5 hours to do this job. That makes this repair in the $1000 range which is rediculous until you factor in trying to break into your bus in the middle of a rain sptorm with no tools.
http://swaimquest.com/images/new%20hd.jpg
I can say after seeing and trying this new handle on a newer prevost model and several upgraded XLIIs here at prevost that the mechanism seems very stout and works well. How many of you have changed to this new handle? What kind of dollars were you looking at to do this upgrade?

[Kenneth Brewer]

I hope no one has encountered this problem on the H's?

[Jamie Bradford]

http://forum.prevostownersgroup.com/showthread.php?4350-Door-Latch-Malfunction&highlight=

Read this thread

PS... I called Prevost last week about another "issue" which they had originally quoted 5X ( $ 1000 vs $ 200 ) what someone else had quoted for a repair . I asked them to "check their math" and please call me back.......... I have yet to hear from them????????

[GSwaim]

Thanks for the link but I read that thread as well as three others on this forum and still don't know fully how to approach this problem. I'm not interested in all the exciting and creative antics of how to get back into my bus when the handle fails. I'm interested in hearing about how people prevented this from happening. Real details, not conjecture. I have yet to see a part number that matches the upgraded handle kit in the parts listing or hear a detailed account of the upgrade process. Am I missing something?

[garyde]

Someone in our group has replaced their handle with the upgrade. It does involve cutting out some additional metal on the door I believe. Other than that, I can't see it being very difficullt to replace.
The time may come in because you have to take the interior siding off. On some coaches that might not be easy.
I thought Prevost was covering the repair as a recall issue. Maybe not.

[Kevin Erion]

I did the upgrade, this was about 2 years ago. The parts where covered FOC and I did the labor. Bill Jenson had to approve of the freebe parts, which he did no problem, but that was 2 years ago when they also paid for all the side panels to be replaced, including paint and polish. Good luck today with that, and I would guess you won't get the parts for free now either! I know this is a very sensative subject but I own some commercial trucks and the customer is not the R&D department, whats up with the best bus ever built? Can't open the door, have to replace the sway bar bushings, a-arm bushings and this is just a few things that we are talking about at the moment! Please don't misunderstand, I like my bus but I don't drink the kool-aid. We won't go to the factory service centers becauce they rip us off, come on...700 + for an oil. filter and chassis lube! You must be joking, I am sure that this is not something that most of us don't feel, just kinda don't want to say in public because we might need some help in the future, sounds like $1000.00 to fix a problem that the mfg knows they made a bad part but we need to smile when they say, I can take care of that Mr. Prevost owner, as Jon has said in the past, we did not have the CFO send the ck in for our bus, we worked very hard to own it and the Co. needs to step up and fix the bad design problems that we now have to deal with! OK, I will step off the soap box and be quiet again, I just read some off this stuff and it makes me mad!

[HarborBus]

Well said Kevin, I'm sure there are a number of people out there that feel the same way you do.

[sawdust_128]

I hope no one has encountered this problem on the H's?

I wish I hadn't encountered it.

http://forum.prevostownersgroup.com/showthread.php?4656-H3-main-door-lockout-issues

[sawdust_128]

Gary:

You stated "What ever happened to an ounce of prevention being worth more? I have an 02 XLII that still has it's original handle and before I'm locked out I've decided to learn what it takes to prevent this handle mechanism failure."

I don't think that you can prevent the part from failing. I think you can do something to prepare yourself in the event of a failure. I think that you can replace the original with something better and reduce the chance of a failure. I think that these doors require some attention/inspection/cleaning/lubrication on an annual basis to reduce the strain and wear that causes failures. But, I don't think that you can eliminate the possibility of a failure.

The original on my H was pot metal. It failed. The new one, the improved one, is pot metal. I am sure it will fail as well.

[grantracy]

I spoke to Prevost Jacksonville about installing mod and they had no idea what I was talking about.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

XL and XLV owners will not be happy with how to deal with it, but they at least can access the inside of the coach without damaging it. All they have to do is pull the rip cords and pop out the passenger side windshield. For those that haven't seen a windshield replacement at a POG rally it is actually a fairly simple thing to do.

But Kevin and I are singing from the same page in the hymnal. There was a time when Prevost made a very fine product and then stood behind it. I have no clue as to what is going on with door handles that fail, skins that delaminate, bushings that fail prematurely, and design choices that make repairs both time consuming and expensive such as side windows and complex slide seals and mechanisms. Prevost of 2010 is not the Prevost of the past. Personally, I see it getting worse in terms of complexity and cost with little or no benefit to the customer.

I am not fixing or doing preventive measures to deal with my door handle. If I need to get in my coach I can access my ladder and tools and get in through the windshield. I just hope it is not raining.

[jack14r]

On my 05 XLII I did the upgrade and Liberty did it free and I think that Prevost paid for the parts.

[edsaylor]

Back when I had my 02 XLII, my door handle failed. Dallas or Jacksonville Prevost ( I don't remember which) told me that they were having many door handle failures and they replaced mine with the new upgrade at no charge. It only took them a couple of hours and the new one worked perfectly. This was about 4 years ago.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Ed, as a car dealer I am sure you can relate to this.

My Mercedes averaged three tanks of fuel between visits back to the dealer for a myriad of issues, some minor, some major. I was always treated with respect and never had to pay for any of the numerous repairs. This went on for four years.

But despite how well I was treated I will never buy another because when I buy a high dollar product I am doing so to avoid the problems and issues that we presume we have with cheap products.

I don't care how well Prevost treats its customers when they have to bring it back in because of flaws, some as related here being very serious. They should not have happened in the first place. Does anyone see the insanity of taking pre-emptive measures to replace door handles (at the owner's expense) to avoid a potential future problem? Ed (Sawdust) and others should never have to take on the burden of fixing something that should never have been a problem in the first place.

And to make matters worse I am certain Prevost is becoming less generous with repairing their design flaws. I cannot imagine a worse position to be in than that of an owner who cannot afford a new coach, but is able to buy a good older used one at a considerable discount from new prices, and then finds he is in the unenviable position of learning his skin is delaminating or his suspension bushings are shot, or he cannot access the inside of his coach and must break a window or punch a hole in a door handle and then face serious money for repairs.

These folks bought Prevost coaches because they were of superior quality compared to plastic.

[grantracy]

so is there a modified assembly or merely a replacement?

[gmcbuffalo]

If I recall right it's the handle that breaks, right? I wonder if it is possible to find out who the supplier is for this product and go to them?

[jimshoen]

I replaced my handle a few months ago. Purchased the replacement unit from Prevost $100.
Put it in myself. No big deal. Essentially, it is the same handle you currently have, but modified with a small piece of sheet steel to prevent the problem.
My old one was still working. I am glad that I replaced it. I witnessed one fail a few years ago. I was at an RV dealer who was about to show me a used coach, 1990's vintage.
The dealer pulled the handle and the door did not open. He had a few choice words, and I never saw the inside of the coach. This was not his first trip to this rodeo. He had the front window removed etc. I could not wait and left.

[rahangman]

Just my 2c worth. How many of us have ever had to replace a door handle on their car? Think about a commercially used Prevost and the # of times their doors are used. Maybe they have an angle since the Driver may be doing the opening/closing , but I think that is not a concern. You are all correct in thinking about the possible decline of our product. I went through mine and lubed and cleaned it well. No problems so far (knock on wood, 20 yrs old) but the corbin lock makes me wonder occasionally due to its sometime reluctance to work from the outside. Hmmmm

[GSwaim]

http://swaimquest.com/images/p1010114%20-%20copy.jpg
Here is the improved XLII handle that comes in the upgrade kit. The kit is complete with linkage and brackets as seen below. I haven't installed my handle yet but I see the new XLII's come with this handle as well as the entertainer buses.

http://swaimquest.com/images/p1010113%20-%20copy.jpg

My original handle isn't broken, its just tough to unlatch the door from the outside as if the handle doesn't give you enough leverage to open the latch. I'm convinced that this kit will fix my door but there must be more to this story. This kit is $454 not $100. I'm starting to believe there was another upgraded handle somewhere along the way or folks were given the same handle as their original when they bought a new one. I can't figure out what exactly is going on but this new handle looks like it will fix the flimsy design of the original XLII handle.

[garyde]

As they say, ' million mile bus , million dollar bus, a millon dollars in repair'!

[grantracy]

http://swaimquest.com/images/p1010114%20-%20copy.jpg
Here is the improved XLII handle that comes in the upgrade kit. The kit is complete with linkage and brackets as seen below. I haven't installed my handle yet but I see the new XLII's come with this handle as well as the entertainer buses.

http://swaimquest.com/images/p1010113%20-%20copy.jpg

My original handle isn't broken, its just tough to unlatch the door from the outside as if the handle doesn't give you enough leverage to open the latch. I'm convinced that this kit will fix my door but there must be more to this story. This kit is $454 not $100. I'm starting to believe there was another upgraded handle somewhere along the way or folks were given the same handle as their original when they bought a new one. I can't figure out what exactly is going on but this new handle looks like it will fix the flimsy design of the original XLII handle.

Would you happen to know the part number?

[phorner]

Does this handle also fit the XL's??

Even at $450 or so, it will still rank among the least expensive repairs I've had to deal with if I can install it myself.

Thanks for posting the pix!!

[GDeen]

At some level I get the fact they are trying to survive and may not be covering some things under warranty they used to. On the other hand, it seems like they could afford to price the $20 or so in parts cost in that repair kit reasonably without bending us over for $450!!

[Jon Wehrenberg]

It doesn't fly with me if they use the tough times to justify cutting back on repair work they would have previously done for free.

Imagine how little their warranty costs would be if the designers actually considered improving the product to make it more robust, and their defense against future warranty repairs took place on the drawing board and not in the service center after the fact. This also ignores the impact on customer relations.

[GSwaim]

I believe this handle kit which is listed as a part improvement kit Part# 288556 fit's all XL and XLII.

[TG Transport]

Thought I would resurrect this thread. I am sitting at Prevost Nashville on a Sunday night after having my door latch fail on Saturday while I was getting two new steer tires. Two hours later, and after a locksmith made a key for the drivers side access door, my spouse was able to fit though the toll window and she was able to open the door from the inside. i spent two hours today removing the defective latch and am sitting here waiting on 7am so I can repair the problem.

[Gary Carmichael]

I do not think I heard if H's have this problem also? If so is the latch for the XL's fit the H's Gary

[jack14r]

The H models do not have the problem,they have a different latch.

[TG Transport]

Update on progress: I bought the replacement latch at 7AM yesterday morning for $119 and was on the road two hours later. I asked about the upgrade kit and learned that it indeed cost $450 and required modification to the door and other internal hardware so I decided since I got 9 years out of the first handle I would just start the clock again. Prevost let me use their work bench and grinding bits as I had to enlarge the doorbell hole for the button Marathon used and I had to do some minor grinding on the existing latch opening. My solution moving forward is to store a hide-a-key so I can open the drivers side door and enter from that were a similar problem to occur again.

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

Thought I would resurrect this thread. I am sitting at Prevost Nashville on a Sunday night after having my door latch fail on Saturday while I was getting two new steer tires. Two hours later, and after a locksmith made a key for the drivers side access door, my spouse was able to fit though the toll window and she was able to open the door from the inside. i spent two hours today removing the defective latch and am sitting here waiting on 7am so I can repair the problem.

I keep reading this and rereading and can't figure why after you had a locksmith make a key, your wife had to climb through the window?

JIM

[TG Transport]

The locksmith made a key that opened the driver side half door - the one where you can access all the fuses and see under the dash and behind the bumper. That cylinder is the same one that is on all the bay doors as well. It is a modified Ford five pin core. Once that was done she was barely able to fit through the opening where the toll window is located. Once in the bus she opened the curb side entry door to give me access.

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

I see, I have one key for all that.

JIM