No power on right side of bus.

[LarryB]

I plugged into a 30 amp source at a friends place and got a warning that I was connected to 'reverse polarity'. The source breaker tripped and I unpluged the bus. Now I don't have power on the right side of bus on Battery power. The Gen. powers everything as normal. I checked breakers for the right side and the GFI on right side. I have to get deeper into the drawing but not sure what other protections there are for this condition.

Hell of a day--first the Check/Stop Eng.. light and now this. Some days you are the windshield and other days you are the bug.

[dalej]

Larry,

I'm taking it that you have inverter power in at least some parts of the bus. Is this correct?

If so, I would think that you have a double throw transfer switch that is only letting one side through. This is only a guess. I have had trouble with the transfer switch before. Generator or shore work good but when I rely on the inverter the transfer switch doesn't let it through.

Good luck!

[truk4u]

Larry,

You have a built in surge guard from CC. Just reset the leg that isn't working. On my 2000, it was in the curb side bay forward of the battery bay.

Dale - His CC has an automatic pass through for the AC.

[LarryB]

Tom, I don't have a booklet for the surge protector, so how do you re-set the unit? I see a key labled 'by-pass' and 'on'. Is there something I'm missing here as well?

Thanks

[Gary & Peggy Stevens]

Larry, could one of your Invertors be off Line? I had to reset one of my invertors to get proper balanced power in my bus, about 2 months ago. ( 35amp Resetable Breaker on the side of the Trace )

Gary S.

[LarryB]

Thanks Gary but the inverters check out OK. Mine are Heart so a bit different

Thanks for the help.

[truk4u]

Larry,

I believe you turn the key to re-set. If I remember correctly, there is a small light for each leg that should be lit. There are others with CC's here on the board with the build-in surge guard and hopefully someone has a manual. I looked on the net, but the new ones don't have the keys, so they're a little different. Also, make sure the inverters are set to 50 amp, but the AC will pass through anyway. I shut down my inverters on the 2000 CC I had and it had no effect on the shore power, kind of like an automatic bypass.

[HarborBus]

Larry, I have a surge guard in my Marquis and it wouldn't have anything to do with the inverters. It only protects the system against under/over voltage or reverse polarity from shore power, which it did. The surge guard doesn't protect the bus when the generator is on as the assumption is that it would always supply good power. So back to the inverters. If there is power to both inverters and you have not been able to find another breaker for them I would power down the inverter on the side that isn't working and power it back up in hopes that it will reset. The inverters have their own internal protections against bad power but possibly a little got through the surge guard and tripped something in the inverter.:confused:

[rfoster]

Larry: my 03 CC has a small breaker box in the bay passenger side forward of the battery bay on the inside wall that controls the outlets for both sides of the coach. It may be buried in behind something you have loaded and is not in obvious view. There are about 5 or 6 breakers in that small box. PLus I have a larger one in the bedroom but it has nothing to do with the outlets.

Good Luck

[Denny]

Larry,

I lost power on the right side on my 99 CC several months ago and it was a less than 3 years old inverter that went bad. I had power with generaqtor on and also on shore power but not on the inverter side. My bus has the same breaker box that Roger was talking about. Check the Right side breaker to be sure you have power going to it on invert. I had power to it and out of it on shore power and on generator but did not have it on invert. I believe those breakers are connected directly to the inverter thus I had no power coming from the inverter.

Took inverter to Xantrex and it did have a bad circuit board in it. All is well now....until something else goes bad.

I know you said that the inverters were good but it does not hurt to check, recheck and then check again. Had a starting problem three months ago and had chassis batteries checked by a converter and they were good. Sunday night went to leave home and bus would not start. I disconnected the batteries and put a load test on each one and found that two failed the load test. Checked ok under the volt meter test but failed under the load test. Four batteries later and a new equalizer everything is good. Bus started, lady in box was quiet and battery balance light was out.

As special thanks to Jon for a recent post of his concerning testing the equalizer!

[LarryB]

Denny, I saw your post on the other thread and just now found it here. Sorry I missed it---trying to attend a reuinon and trouble shoot this Bus I'm spread thin.

I will be back in the World today and will have the inverter checked out. All the breakers, CBs, fuses have been checked so it seems to be down to the inverter.
The problem is the same as you describe so, it seems logical to have that inverter checked. I am wondering if the 'Reverse Polarity' incident cooked the inverter? I was thinking that power never made it onto the bus and was stopped by the Surge-Guard.

Thanks for the info.

[Coloradobus]

Larry, Just a thought. Have you checked all your GFI equipped plugs especailly on either side of the bed? We had a incident with CC #60449 when we owned it.

[LarryB]

Jim, yes we hav e checked all GFI in the coach. Thanks for the thoughts.

[Jeff Bayley]

Was going to start a new thread but found this one that is right on target for my problem.

I have one inverter "out" somehow right now too. I have been trouble shooting. I've read through all the posts. I checked GFI already and I'm getting power through the J class 350 amp fuse ok but what I seem to notice that is most strange is that when I took off one of the terminals on that aforementioned J class fuse, the remote for that inverter didn't go blank. The LED's where still lit up. The "A/C" in light is on. My Levitron surge protector went bad about a month ago and I haven't replaced it yet which was unwise but I THINK that component should be replaced and yet not essential. The one inverter (passenger side if it matters on a Royal) was just working a few days ago.

I changed out my batteries but don't THINK anything bot mis-wired but I'm going to look at it again now. I'm in the bus and traveling so I'd really like to sort it out. At least the fridge, TV work but the main inconvenience is the toilet is out.

Would it be a major no no to turn everything off and take the terminals off the J Class fuse, then put some jumper cables to those terminals off the 2nd (good) Inverter at the J Class fuse just long enough to let me get the toilet fllushed until I can find the real culprit ? I can use the bathroom at the RV park until I sort it out but the potty.......it be stinky. I won't attempt that until I get a reply here. That might be adding insult to injury.

I just went out and tried something before hitting "Submit". I have a Progressive Industries Surge protector Mode: EMS-PT50C that I have not been in the habit of using. I just went and put that in line and it would not let power to the bus. I tried to video the codes but I did it wrong so I have to go back out and get the codes and check the owners manual to see what's up but meanwhile, is that a blatant clue ? I also check the inverter with the generator on and on batteries only and no change. The part about the remote staying on when I disconnect that one J class fuse has to part of the problem I would think.

[garyde]

Jeff. Is your toilet 12 or 24 volt or 120 volt? The inverter is for 120 volt loads. What else is not working?
It sounds like yo have identified several issues;
1. Your shore power surge protector no longer works. Are you still getting 240 volt into the Panel?
2. Your buss fuses on the battery side of the Invertor is OK. These batteries are usually in parrallel so your going to get readings on the battery side of the fuses.
3. You can not get correct voltage from the shore recepticle to the bus. Hve management test shore power.
4. You checked Generator which when started should run all 120 volt loads as well.
5. You replaced coach batteries recently. Check wires.

So, it sounds like a transfer switch problem, circuit breaker, or possibly a reset on a inverter itself.

[MangoMike]

Larry,

This will help make sure the power is clean before it reaches the bus.

http://www.prevoman.com/Pages/Cool%20Toos/surge/Surgepg1.html

5227

[Jeff Bayley]

Mike- That is the same unit I have however it's spent it's life in the box until yesterday when I put it in line to help troubleshoot. With that very surge protector in place, it wouldn't allow any power (on either side) to pass through). I just moved to a different RV Park and am getting back to troubleshooting again. I put the surge protector in line and a pen to go record the codes. I could hear that no roof A/C's went back on so I went inside to check the inputs on both inverters. Then, the power kicked on. Upon further reading of the owners manual I now learned that the surge protector takes a pause before allowing power through. So shore power and generator power are both eliminated as I also have input power on both legs on the panels.

I think I may have a bad GFI on one of the 110 outlets. I'm not sure but I'll explain.

Each side of the bus (on my Royal) has multiple 110 outlets of course. Only one of them as a GFI outlet. If that GFI is tripped, all the other outlets loose power also. We'll the GFI on the passenger side (the side I'm having trouble with) is not making any clicking noise when I push it from Test to On like the other (working correctly) does when I "Test" it.

Question: If no power is being supplied to that outlet, should I still be able to detect a clicking upon toggling the buttons ? I don't know. There is no clicking so I don't know if it is because of no power thorough or bad GFI.

(Answers to Gary's Questions follow)

Jeff. Is your toilet 12 or 24 volt or 120 volt? The inverter is for 120 volt loads.
>>>> When I read this I thought "Hmmm. I didn't notice anything electrical at all on the toilet when I removed it and rebuild the guts a few years ago". It's a Microphor. I believe it is totally air powered. I do not have a breaker anywhere for the toilet but there is a 5 amp breaker for the air pump for the toilet on the 12 volt panel. The light on the switch for the air pump comes on, but the pump doesn't come on.

What else is not working?

>>>>> The microwave, washer and dryer, and all the outlets on the passenger side. The TV in bedroom IS working along with all that A/V that goes with it (DVD, Bose, ETC) and that is on the passenger side). Not sure if relevant or related yet.

It sounds like yo have identified several issues;
1. Your shore power surge protector no longer works. Are you still getting 240 volt into the Panel?

>>>>>> Yes

2. Your buss fuses on the battery side of the Invertor is OK. These batteries are usually in parrallel so your going to get readings on the battery side of the fuses.

>>>>>> Not positive what you mean here but I do believe I've eliminated those fuses as being the problem.

3. You can not get correct voltage from the shore recepticle to the bus. Hve management test shore power.

>>>>>> Addressed I think and shore power at two different RV parks with same symptoms. Same symptoms on Gen power as well.


4. You checked Generator which when started should run all 120 volt loads as well.

>>>>>>>> Yes

5. You replaced coach batteries recently. Check wires.

>>>>>> Checked. However could possibly still be something in the battery bay. Still trouble shooting.


Further: My inclination is that it is not an inverter problem but I'm not sure. There is a tiny red LED viewable on the interior of the inverter though the grate. It goes on and off when I turn the inverter to the "off" mode on the remote as it should. It's just the toilet and the passenger side outlets and the microwave. Water pump working and everything else that I can tell. Continuing the battle and trouble shooting.

Any input on the GFI not making the clicking would be very useful. Replacing that is an easy and cheap attempt at the remedy even if it wind us not being the problem. Will check back here and wait until tomorrow for any additional input however before changing it out.

[ajducote]

Jeff,

On my Royale, The secondary panel in the bedroom that feeds all the circuits from the inverters has a yellow button on each breaker. I have had trouble with 2 of the breakers occasionally tripping when going from 1 power source to another. ( gen to shore, shore to Gen, etc). When that happens I lose one side of the bus. Reseting the breaker has always worked for me.

[MangoMike]

Jeff,
That unit takes about 3 minutes to check the voltage and initialize itself. You'll see a blinking dot on the display as it's doing it's check. Once the power starts flowing thru the dot will stop blinking.

Initially I thought mine wasn't working either.

Mike

Had I read the rest of your first paragraph, you're good to go.

[garyde]

Hi Jeff. The GFI will not re set if there is no power to it. you will have to unscrew the gfi to test the wires at the back of the recepticle. But, because your microwave, washer/dryer do not work, it has something to do with your panel power. Have you tested your transfer switch to verify you have 240 volt to your panel?
It is more than one circuit so it is possible it is your inverter, but I don't think your washer/dryer are on your inverter.

[Jeff Bayley]

Thank you all for the input.

I had a non bus crisis come up so didn't get any more testing done. I'm just getting to check the additional replies.

ajducote- I don't have the yellow buttons on those breakers. I have only one with a yellow button which is in the shore / gen breaker box section and belongs to the Bay Receptacles or 110 outlets. It's won't hold but it's been like that for a while and I have ignored troubled shooting it since being able to use the bay receptacles has not been needed enough but there must be a short somewhere that won't let that hold. It's been like that practically as long as I can remember getting this bus which was about 5 years ago. I doubt that is related to the problem but curious what the yellow button is for if you know and can tell me.

Mike- Thank you for confirming about the surge protector.

Gary- You wrote: ........"But, because your microwave, washer/dryer do not work, it has something to do with your panel power. Have you tested your transfer switch to verify you have 240 volt to your panel?

>>>>>>> No I have not but I think I should now that you pointed that out.

It is more than one circuit so it is possible it is your inverter, but I don't think your washer/dryer are on your inverter.

>>>>>>>>>> No the washer and dryer are not on the inverter. Only works on shore or gen power.


Further: I really have had some major distractions that have brought my time to keep testing and looking for the problem to a halt. I hope tomorrow I am able to get back to trouble shooting it. I need to check the transfer switch first I guess. It was replaced with a new one about 3 years ago. Am I correct that when I open that up to check it with the meter that I will find two legs coming off of each side of the two automatic switches ? Two 110 legs coming off the Shore Power side and two 110 legs coming off the generator side ?

To review briefly, I've established that the washer and dryer (not powered off the inverter) and everything else that IS powered off that inverter is out I believe. Not sure if it's relevant but the Washer and Dryer are on the same side of the bus that I've mainly got out (passenger side outlets and the toilet air pump also on that side). Microwave IS powered through that inverter and is out.

Thanks in advance for the continued advice. Ahhhh !!! Electrical issues. I see now why auto repair shops hardly ever give a flat rate for fixing an electrical problem. Fun,fun, fun.

[garyde]

Hi Jeff. You should have 240 volts read between the two wires coming into the transfer switch from shore. The transfer switch should be closed and 240 volt should go out to your panel. Be careful.

[Jeff Bayley]

I have been very slow in carving out time to get to the bottom of the inverter problem but today I noticed that the status changed. The Trace remote panel (inside the bus) no longer says "A/C input Good". The led for "Inverting" is still on (like it was before). The symptoms of what was not working (stated in the prior postings) are the same.

The needle on the meter for that inverter is showing that shore power is being supplied to the side in question.

[garyde]

It could be a loose wire which might explain why it indicates good but the led is reading inverting. Check all of your cord connections and transfer switch connections.