Tsssssssssssssssssssssss.........

[adamdegraff]

Long after my coach is turned off, I hear air leaking out of this item. The photo is looking up from under my coach on the passenger side, right in front of the drive wheels. I do not have any leans, but this sucker will leak air for 5 minutes or longer after the coach is shut down. What is it?

Fiddling around with some of the protruding parts I can get the air to stop coming out. I can even get it to stop when not holding it. But once I roll down the road, it comes back.

Thoughts?

Thanks,

Adam

[Orren Zook]

Looks like a leveling valve to me, Neway part: 90054007 OR Euclid E-4323 about $50 at your local truck parts store

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

Adam, I think Orren is correct.

I hope your not under the bus messing with the suspension without supporting the bus.

JIM

[Joe Cannarozzi]

Adam I want to be sure you are not hearing air exhausting out the short tube that just tails off hooking to nothing. Put your finger over that and see if it stops. If so at worst your ride height valve may be getting slow but working as designed. As the bus gets closer to ride height, coming down, the airflow decreases and some ride height valves take a pretty long time before the exhaust port completly seals off. It is like the closer the bus gets to height the smaller the leak becomes., finally it stops

I am probably way off base here:o

How do you know it comes back when you are rolling down the road?

Sorry for the spelling folks my hard drive puked I am on a borrowed laptop and can't find the spell check.

[adamdegraff]

Adam I want to be sure you are not hearing air exhausting out the short tube that just tails off hooking to nothing. Put your finger over that and see if it stops. If so at worst your ride height valve may be getting slow but working as designed. As the bus gets closer to ride height, coming down, the airflow decreases and some ride height valves take a pretty long time before the exhaust port completly seals off. It is like the closer the bus gets to height the smaller the leak becomes., finally it stops

I am probably way off base here:o

How do you know it comes back when you are rolling down the road?

Sorry for the spelling folks my hard drive puked I am on a borrowed laptop and can't find the spell check.

Guess what I meant to say is that the leak is audible when the engine is running and when I turn it off. The other day I had it over a pit and played around with it. I was able to get it to stop hissing by jiggling it around. But then when I started the bus up again, it started hissing again. That's all I meant. I was able to stop the leak but not keep it stopped once jostled about.

As for supporting the bus... yes, I know I am not to get under it without support. Is there a thread with suggestions as to how to support it? I can't find jacks at my local auto parts store with a high enough rating. I do have a big ass oak log that I use as a chopping block that would hold it though.

Thanks for the info about the part. You guys are great.

Oh, and hey, we have a show coming up at an AMAZING summer festival in Virginia's Blue Ridge Mountains. It is at the Wintergreen resort. Anybody in the area should drop me an email. It is one of the most amazing outdoor places to catch a show. It's just stunning up there. Concert is on Wednesday the 29th. I have a few comp tickets left.

~Adam

[garyde]

Hi Adam. I would not get under a Coach without primary and secondary support. If you have not been versed in this, do not attempt it. Find a qualified mechanic who works on heavy Trucks and such to show you the procedures. I would not use a oak log as it could split under the 30,000 lb.plus weight of the rear end.
Also, Hydralic jacks are not considered adequate support, primary or secondary.

[GDeen]

Also, Hydralic jacks are not considered adequate support, primary or secondary.

Gary,

so talk to me about this - I just bought two 30 ton and 2 20 ton jacks at Harbor Freight. That is not adequate support? Couldn't find anything like a jackstand rated that high. What does the shade tree guy use who doesn't have a pit? Also bought some of the solid concrete blocks at Lowe's for backup support.

[tdelorme]

Gordon, Northern Tool will have the jack stands you need. Keep the 20 ton jacks and take the others back. Solid cinder blocks are worthless as far as I'm concerned. I rather have Adam's oak chopping block. Best of all, stay out from under the bus. If you are feeling the need to crawl around under there, find a pit you can drive over.
Will you please PM me your office address. I have something that will look just super in your new coach.:D:D

[Joe Cannarozzi]

Gordon raise the bus all the way up and get a measurement at the support points. Have 4 pieces of 4in dia. steam pipe cut about 1 in short of that measurement and weld some square flanges on them for a base.

That will support it.

Jack stands rated high enough are too tall to fit.

If you can find them some bottle type screw jacks like they use to raise a home are short enough and strong enough too

[tdelorme]

These will work. I bought a pair before Jon built the bus spicific ones last year. The screw jacks are a good option also.
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200318703_200318703

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

Gordon and Adam, there are many posts on bus support points.
Use the search tool.
I have included one for you.
Your manual also has a diagram.

http://forum.prevostownersgroup.com/showthread.php?t=2138&highlight=support+points

Dale made his supports similar to what Joe described.

Gordon in theory the hyd. jack is not a proper and safe support because there is the possibility however remote that it will fail in some way and leak down on you. You only need one failure to ruin your day.

Some other things to consider when supporting the bus are you must be on level ground or the bus may tip the supports however strong and send the bus down at a rate of 32ft/sec/sec., that's like faster than you can scoot out from under.;)
Another is the nature of the surface on which you will be working. The supporting surface must be capable of supporting the weight of the bus concentrated in four points of surface contact. Do not assume that a concrete surface is strong enough. It may be to thin or of a composition that does not have a compressive strength per square inch high enough to support the bus. If your work area is in question place your supports on large pads to distribute the load over a larger area.
If you are at all doubtful do not proceed until you get on site expert help.
I have only offered tips and general info on the topic. I do not make any claim that they are all inclusive or fool proof.

JIM

JIM

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Adam, Orren is correct. However, just to satisfy my curiosity and perhaps lead to an additional problem, does the bus drop as air escapes?

With the bus running, the Norgren valves shift to run aux. air throught the ride height valve you have pictured into the air bags. When the correct height is reached, the arm moves to the center position and air flow, both in or out stops.

When you turn the key off, there is no air supply to the "air in" port on the ride height valve because the Norgren valve directing air flow has gone to the closed position.

That's why I ask the question to see if there is a secondary issue.

[adamdegraff]

Adam, Orren is correct. However, just to satisfy my curiosity and perhaps lead to an additional problem, does the bus drop as air escapes?

With the bus running, the Norgren valves shift to run aux. air throught the ride height valve you have pictured into the air bags. When the correct height is reached, the arm moves to the center position and air flow, both in or out stops.

When you turn the key off, there is no air supply to the "air in" port on the ride height valve because the Norgren valve directing air flow has gone to the closed position.

That's why I ask the question to see if there is a secondary issue.

No, the bus does not seem to drop as air escapes.

Thanks for the help!

~Adam

[GDeen]

Ok, thanks for the input. I spent most of Sunday afternoon under the bus running smartire antenna cable from the rear to the front and thought I was pretty well covered. Will check into some of these additional options.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Adam, just as I thought.

Question number 2.....is the bus at its normal ride height when you hear the air escaping? And just to clarify, the bus does not lean or sag in the front, but you do have your aux system air go down to zero reasonably fast, correct?

[adamdegraff]

Adam, just as I thought.

Question number 2.....is the bus at its normal ride height when you hear the air escaping? And just to clarify, the bus does not lean or sag in the front, but you do have your aux system air go down to zero reasonably fast, correct?

The bus DOES seem to be at its normal ride height when I hear air escaping. And yes, the aux system air does go down to zero somewhat quickly, though that effects very little on my bus as I don't have air pocket doors.... just the air slide.

Have we reached a verdict?

~Adam

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Adam,

My bad. I had my brain working in reverse and was thinking the Norgren five port valve is ahead of the ride height valves.

I think that ride height valve you pictured has failed, and what appears to be happening is that it is leaking internally and air is escaping. The air in your airbags is trapped by the 5 port Norgren, so the bus remains as it was when you turned off the key, but the air in your aux system is the source of air that is leaking and that air is escaping through the valve.

Replace the valve and you are good to go. The valve shown appears to be the type Prevost used that has a built in delay before it functions. I suggest when you order the valve you make sure you get that type. The other type now used by Prevost is an instant acting valve and has a black plastic case. Personally, I like the type you have.

That is an easy fix, but you have to get under the coach. Please do not get under it unless you have it properly supported. To get the maximum height raise it up on the air bags and use good support under the chassis support points. There is plenty of room for you to slide around on your butt once you are in the area between the two front wheels. Did I say support the coach?

If you do not change the length of the rod that ties to the lever arm on the valve you will not have to adjust your ride height so the replacement will be a simple remove and replace. Don't forget to support the coach.

Jon

[adamdegraff]

Thanks Jon,
My plan is to sleep under the coach tonight, just to get acquainted with it, and then support it tomorrow morning. Will that be soon enough to support the coach?

Just kidding.

Thanks for the help!

Adam

[garyde]

I think one of the most dangerous aspects of working on these Coaches is getting under them. You don't know what you don't know.
Jim C. has some very important points.
When Jon provided Stnds to a group of POG members, it came at the end of several weeks of discussion regarding supporting your coach and where the support points are located.
This endeavor should be approached with extreme caution.

[hhoppe]

Adam: After hearing you perform with your Fiddle (violin) I want you to stay out from under that bus. Take the bus to a truck service shop and pay them to replace the valve. I'm sure you can make a deal with the tech. there not to play a violin and you will not chance damaging highly trained and conditioned fingers and hands. This is your Pa Pa talking Son, so pay attention. Trade him performance tickets for his work and you both will be winners. The Poggers that have heard Adam play will agree with this post.

[adamdegraff]

Adam: After hearing you perform with your Fiddle (violin) I want you to stay out from under that bus. Take the bus to a truck service shop and pay them to replace the valve. I'm sure you can make a deal with the tech. there not to play a violin and you will not chance damaging highly trained and conditioned fingers and hands. This is your Pa Pa talking Son, so pay attention. Trade him performance tickets for his work and you both will be winners. The Poggers that have heard Adam play will agree with this post.

Harry,
you are too kind. I'll take that advice Pa Pa :-) Now, if I could just find somebody to un-mash that stainless steel rub rail that my wife used to uproot an iron gate at the National Park in St. Augustine, FL. :-) "Ohhhh," she said, "when you turn hard to the right, the back of the bus swings out to the left ever so slightly." I giver her a hard time, but she did put in about 20,000 miles this year without incident. It was mile # 20,001 that got her. Gotta love a lady who can drive a bus though!

Hope to see you sometime soon!

~Adam

[michaeldterry]

Harry,
Gotta love a lady who can drive a bus though!




Adam - I totally agree! I love that Vita can provide relief driving when we are on long runs. Besides, she looks hot behind the wheel of that beast! :D

[hhoppe]

Adam: Take a picture of the damaged rub rail with exact location and measured length. I'll see what I can do to fix or replace it. Are you going to make OKC for the POG rally in Oct.?

[Joe Cannarozzi]

Harry our bus will not be at Ok but can I ship you the engine bay doors off it. One has a dent and the other has a big scratch:o:rolleyes:

I got a better idea I will hand them off to Chalupka coming across on his way to the rally you can dazzle everyone with your tallent straighten them at the rally and he can haul them back for me.:eek::D

[adamdegraff]

Adam: Take a picture of the damaged rub rail with exact location and measured length. I'll see what I can do to fix or replace it. Are you going to make OKC for the POG rally in Oct.?

I'll do it. But I have shows in Ohio during the POG OKC rally. Wish I could have made it. If something changes though, I'm there!

Thanks,

Adam

[Darl-Wilson]

Adam: After hearing you perform with your Fiddle (violin) I want you to stay out from under that bus. Take the bus to a truck service shop and pay them to replace the valve. I'm sure you can make a deal with the tech. there not to play a violin and you will not chance damaging highly trained and conditioned fingers and hands. This is your Pa Pa talking Son, so pay attention. Trade him performance tickets for his work and you both will be winners. The Poggers that have heard Adam play will agree with this post.

AMEN Harry, those youngsters are Grrrrreat!:)

[hhoppe]

Regarding future SS repairs. This ole guy has been retired from Melrose Metal Products Inc. for over ten years. My son Mitch Hoppe owns and operates the company now. They are very capable of repairing (if possible) or replacing your SS Prevost parts as required. Please contact them at mhoppe@gomelrose.com. Mitch will be happy to give you a cost estimate.
Please remember large dents strech the metal and cannot be shrunk back into place. Deep scratches remove too much material and cannot be restored.
New parts are best replaced by using pre polished and papered SS sheet cut and press brake formed into original shapes.

[Joe Cannarozzi]

A large dent and a deep scratch describes our back doors perfectly Harry. I will expect that will need replacing.