Woe is Me, Misery, Misery

[Will Garner]

OK, went to the barn to start the bus and bring it to the house. We were supposed to leave tomorrow morning for Naples. Got to the bus, hit the key and it almost started then didn't catch. Sat for a couple of minutes and then tried again. Motor cranks, plenty of battery but no ignition.

Went into the engine bay and could not see any reason for the no start but did locate the ether cup for future use. I went to turn on the engine bay lights and inadvertently moved the rear starter toggle switch. I think it was in the "Normal" (bottom position) prior to my hitting it. I finally did reach the toggle switch for the engine compartment lights. All three worked fine. So I turned the RR Start switch to "Normal" and went back to try another time. Now the ignition switch turns on the electrical devices but won't crank the engine. It is like the switch is dead. Back to the engine bay again and put the RR Start toggle switch in the "Off" position. Go back inside and try again to crank it over. Same result, electronics come on, do their thing and the ignition key won't crank the engine.

OK, back to the engine bay. This time I said why not see if the RRStart toggle position and the push button works to crank the engine. Wow, it did and the engine started. I should have left it running but no I turned it off. I returned the toggle to the "Normal" position and went to try the ignition switch. Same result, no crankie. Now I'm getting crankie so we shut everything down for the night. The generator works, the Webasto runs, the ignition switch just refuses to make contact and crank the big motor over.

I'm leaning to the switch having crapped out. Is this where I should start or is there a better sequence to identify the source of the problem? Does anyone know of a substitute replacement ignition switch - maybe from a 1956 Buick! We would really like to get going tomorrow as soon as is possible. It is supposed to get lots colder tomorrow night - single digits even!

As always, any and all help/suggestions/comments will be well received by me. Could this be LewPopps way of payback for my not being able to come by and say hey while in Florida?

Thanks POGgers.

[Joe Cannarozzi]

Will that switch in the engine compartment is notorious for going bad due to both its proximity and infrequent use.

I think possibly your initial non start was simply due to sitting and cold and you added to the fiasco when you accidentally switched it. When is the last time you started the bus and how cold is it?

I would go back to that switch and really exercise it, spray it with some contact cleaner if you have it. Put a circuit tester on it

If it were me I would have to get it right now cause I would not be able to sleep otherwise.

[Will Garner]

Last start was on Friday 9 January last week. I ran it up to Randleman, about 75 miles north of me to get a couple of items taken care of and a safety inspection. Bus ran fine both ways.

I don't think the switches in the engine bay are the problem. It is the ignition switch inside on the dash left side of the steering wheel. I'd rather have a right hand switch but it is on the left side. I also tried the switch in the engine bay in all three positions without success.

I tried cranking it with no start about 5 - 6 times. then the last time the momentary contact position of the switch would not activate the starters bendix drive to turn the engine over. The switches in the engine bay seem to be OK but I'll exercise them first thing tomorrow and try again. Is the "Normal" position where the toggle needs to be left for the inside ignition switch to crank the big motor? I could have Carole hold the inside ignition switch in the crank position while exercising the toggle on the premise that there would be a position during exercise the bendix would kick in. Good or bad thought?

The temperatures have been moderate until last night. It got down to 32 degrees, which I know is nothing compared to where the temperature goes in Chicago. Tonight it is going into the 20's and tomorrow night it will be Chicago cold, single digits! I gotta get out of here!

Thanks for the thoughts.

[garyde]

Someone else had the very same problem and there was a long conversation about the rear switch being bad on a post last year. They replaced the switch after testing all the relays ,etc. So if it starts in the back, put a voltmeter on that switch .

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

Check the voltage on your start batteries, Will. What is it.

How old are the batteries.


JIM

[jimshoen]

Will,
Here is a long shot, but give this a try.
Put the dash ignition to the off position, key out.
Go to the back of bus and start engine from rear.
With engine running go to front and insert key and put key in the run position (do not turn all the way to start position)
Go to rear and put the remote start switch to the normal position (engine is still running, be careful)
Now go to the front and turn engine off with dash key.
Now see if it will start normally.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Will, Dan Smith had a problem with the rear start selector switch.

To get you going, just connect the front start wires together. That will disable the rear start feature and take the bad switch out of the circuit, but at least you can get going.

The switch just makes it convenient and safe for working in the rear on the engine. Other than that it is just something else to service.

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

This is the post, Will.

Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes #1 Report Post Old 12-21-2007, 04:30 PM DANSS DANSS is offline Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Miss. Gulf Coast Posts: 173 Default Bus starting problem SOLVED MY problem with starting the bus from the front was believe it or not, a bad run start switch in the rear which was the only place I could start the engine. Switch was $21.00 plus 2 hours labor to run it down. I would have never believed that the very switch I was using to start the engine was causing the problem As we all know the buses are a work in progress! Thanks to everyone for the help. Dan __________________ Danss 1999 Vogue, 03 Chev. Trailblazer Reply With Quote

JIM

[Will Garner]

Joe, Jims, Gary,

I am hoping the rear switch is the problem. It is somewhat counter intuitive to think that but since others have had the experience I guess this ones on me.

Life is full of learning experiences. I'll just put this one as the most recent example.

I'm confident we will be headed south sometime today - the sooner the better.

[hhoppe]

Will: I tried to read and understand your problem but am not sure I have it correct. In my other coach the solenoid operated by turning on the ignition switch would sometimes stick and not kick in to allow the starter to work.. It is located in the panel under the drivers window. Many have had this same problem and we carry spare 24 volt solenoid switches with us. Some times a sharp wrap on the solenoid will unstick it. These solenoids are not unlike the starter solenoid on my old 31 model A Ford.
I hope i haven't added more confusion to your problem.

[Will Garner]

To all,

We are running. I'm filling the fresh water tank and then we are outta here. Thanks to all for your comments. It was that three position rear start switch. I did not have to jumper it out of the circuit - thank goodness. I did however give it - well a work out of back and forth between positions. My fingers are so tired I think I'll give them a rest - as we drive south to Naples!

Yeah!

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

Hey Will, don't turn it off anywhere you wouldn't want to park for awhile!
Have fun and be safe.

I guess you knew, where there's a Will there's a way.

JIM

[Will Garner]

Jim,

Thanks for the advice. I did stop a couple of times on the way down. I was concerned it may not start but it did every time. I'll order a replacement switch from Prevost and perhaps it will be waiting on me when I get back to NC.

And yes I have heard that expression several times. I even used it when I ran for the Moore County NC School Board. It did not work then, I'm very happy it worked in this case!

Hope its not too cold where you are. A trucker told me it was -12 in Columbus Ohio two days ago.

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

Kinda sounds like that switch could be added to the spare parts bin, or at least looking at the accessibility of it and what it takes to jump it when it goes down.
Better to know in good times than bad.
What does anyone think, has the switch now shown us it's a maintenance item and needs to be changed out periodically??

I can't help but wonder why it would fail so often. It's not used a great deal and one would think that it's service life would almost be that of the coach. Perhaps it is under rated in it's application or it gets very hot????

Will, when you get the replacement, see if you can get a mfg part no and amp rating etc. Maybe we can find a better one.

The old racers maxim, "If you can't finish the race you can't win.", applies here.

:eek: JIM

[Jon Wehrenberg]

That's actually an unnecessary part. If one fails while on the road connect the two wires in question (for front start) and you can complete any trip trouble free.

There aren't may parts related to starting the bus that you actually do not need, but here is one of the few.

[lewpopp]

Damn it, Jim still wants us to get one.