Looking at Liberty Prevost 97

[stinky]

What should I look at in inspecting this coach. What about the over the road air, is this a good thing, is their dump system good . As compared to the CC and Marathons. Are the alternators large enough in them to run the airs while driving.I'm new to this and have been searching and researching for about 3yrs. Looking at all coaches but seem to go back to CC and Marathons. I live in the NW (Oregon). I've been told that to stay with what is in the NW.made here because of service ability!!! The 97 Liberty is in the California Coach Company adv.What say !!!
stinky

[dalej]

Welcome,

If you can get down to Lake Havasu, Arizona, February 13-15 give or take a day, there will be a lot of POG guys with there bus's you can look at and ask questions.

[jimshoen]

Go for the 1997 - 2000 Marathon or Liberty.
CC is out of busines or close to it.
Being close to the Convertor can be an advantage.

[garyde]

What should I look at in inspecting this coach. What about the over the road air, is this a good thing, is their dump system good . As compared to the CC and Marathons. Are the alternators large enough in them to run the airs while driving.I'm new to this and have been searching and researching for about 3yrs. Looking at all coaches but seem to go back to CC and Marathons. I live in the NW (Oregon). I've been told that to stay with what is in the NW.made here because of service ability!!! The 97 Liberty is in the California Coach Company adv.What say !!!
stinky

Hi Stinky. The Coach should be inspected by a mechanic familiar with Prevost, Detroit Engines, and Allison Transmissions. A few items on a long list would be Air bags, tires, batteries, brakes , brake air system, OTR cooling/heating system, belts.

Every switch, button, valve, etc. inside and outside should be tested turned, etc.
The Liberty is a well built coach, you need to verify it has been well taken care of; serviced and maitained on time etc.
The Heating/cooling OTR system is designed and built by Prevost. The alternator is designed to handle the Coach inverters & batteries for Coach and chasis.

Most work needed on a Liberty can be handled here in California thru Prevost, or other companies familiar with converted Coaches.
California Coach, Steve Bennett is a reputable company with a proven track record in buying and selling Coaches. He won't pull any punches.

[BrianE]

Stinky,

As usual, Gary hit the nail on the head. Steve Bennett is a very reliable guy and he will do his best to help you get through the pre-buy process.

Incidentally, if it's a 40 footer, that coach belonged to a POG member prior to Steve acquiring it. Many of us have seen it and it's previous owner took good care of it. I think it's a good one.

In any event, good luck and hope to see you at Havasu, where you can ask as many questions about these great machines that you can think of.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Stinky,

That vintage coach, and that one in particular will be a trouble free ride for a couple of reasons.

The shell represents Prevost's evolution of the model and has virtually no bugs. As a rivet coach repairs are simple and it has not risen to the complexity of later models that require only Prevost techs to repair giving you as an owner a considerable number of options when seeking service.

But the house portion is also one of the most trouble free on the market as well. Liberty makes a very reliable product, but that model which we in POG are familiar with is also very easily serviced, something rarely needed.

I don't know your plans with the coach with respect to length of time of ownership (if you tend to keep things a long time or flip them in the short term) but if you are going to keep it, I would suggest you go through it and deal right away with air bags, valves, and brake chambers unless those things were done. That is something a large number of us have done or had done to eliminate the nagging problems associated with an aging suspension.

Good luck. The previous owner is a POG member and I am sure between him and Steve you will feel very comfortable with your decision to buy this coach. Enough of us on this forum are very familiar with that vintage Liberty and it is doubtful that we wouldn't be able to answer any questions that might arise, and regardless of where you are based Liberty customer support is superb, with phone calls often being all it takes to resolve issues.

[Darl-Wilson]

Welcome Stinky! I agree with just about everything that has been written on this subject. I am especially pleased that you are dealing with Steve Bennet. You won't be sorry.

I just have a couple of things to add. You are in a great area to get good service on whatever coach you buy. Harry Hoppe uses a Detroit Diesel company in Springfield that he highly recommends. There are some great parts places in the Junction City, Eugene, and Coburg area that will make life easier. You will find links to many here on the Forum.

In my humble opinion and as a Country Coach owner, I would much prefer the Liberty over the Country Coach. Jim Shoen is right about CC shutting down (http://www.registerguard.com/csp/cms/sites/web/news/5064862-35/story.csp) but I believe that someone will eventually pick up the brand if not the factory. It may never be the same but that could be a good thing.

You would help us all if you put your information about where you live, etc in your profile. We are a curious lot. As a former Oregonian I would put NW Oregon as Astoria but I have children living in the Corvallis area and a great friend in Salem that I also consider NW. You will find several POGers in your area, at Battle Ground, WA and around Tualatin, OR.

We look forward to seeing you soon, maybe at Lake Havasu.:)

Darl

[stinky]

Jon,
The Liberty's come with the Prevost over the road air. What are the + and - of this system. Would you recommend this when looking for a Prevost !
Stinky

[Joe Cannarozzi]

IMO a plus for sure. Royal, Vantari, Angola are a few others that utilize it.

Ours has it and it is wonderful. The downside is you loose some storage and IMO that is a compromise worth making.

[jelmore]

Jon,
The Liberty's come with the Prevost over the road air. What are the + and - of this system. Would you recommend this when looking for a Prevost !
Stinky

Stinky, we travel all the time. The OTR air is as good as it gets. No generator while running, the engine does all the work and doesn't complain. This Prevost system was designed to keep 50 people comfortable front to back so it makes a great ride for two while traveling. I don't know what the negatives are.

[garyde]

Stinky. Pros: you can be in 110 degree weather outside and be very comfortable inside. The reverse is true with cold weather. And it is evenly distributed thru-out the coach.
Cons: You loose storage space ; Bay #3 on Starboard, Bay #3 on Port side.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Stinky,

Without a doubt the easiest way to stay comfortable while traveling is the OTR air and heat. It has about 80,000 BTU capacity so on a very hot day it will do a great job compared to 3 (39,000 BTU) or 4 (52,000 BTU) roof or Cruise Airs.

The biggest objection people have to OTR is the claim it takes up too much space. But let's analyze that. Open the OTR bays and you will see the two areas are only about 18" deep. Behind them are the fuel tank(s). What you gain is the equivalent of about 1/3 to 1/2 of a bay. The space utilization on the Liberty compared to others is superb. Everybody else uses up that equivalent bay space by sticking their batteries and their generator in valuable bay space up front, and then goes beyond that to compensate for the less efficient use of space by eliminating the long range fuel which is behind the first bay in the center.

Trust me, once you have both OTR and long range fuel, and a balanced loading which Liberty does by putting the generator and batteries where they are located you will appreciate how important that stuff is. If anyone wants to suggest a negative regarding the OTR is the engine power required, consider that energy is not free. No matter where it is used, there is still a price and running the big OTR compressor (which cycles and does not run continuously) is not much different than driving a big alternator which is putting out a lot of power to run the roof airs, or to run the generator to run the roof airs.

I expect a lot of whining and crying from owners of other conversions, but they know I am right.

[phorner]

Jon,

You're preachin' the Gospel here......:D

That OTR heat and AC is one of the defining differences between a Prevost Bus and everything else out there.....

[truk4u]

Hey, hey hey, take it easy on us poor low life forms without OTR!:o

[jack14r]

OTR also gives you redundancy,I heard of a situation in Las Vegas where it was 115+ and almost everyone left their coaches and checked into the motel.The coaches with the OTR just cranked up the Detroit Diesel and ran the OTR with the cruise airs and got the coaches cool and then shut down the DD.I have OTR and it will maintain 70 in the coach on a 100 degree day,it is the only way to really cool a coach.I think that most of the entertainer coaches have OTR.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Hey, when you are on that side of the fence you need to expect to have to face reality sooner or later.

The debate about OTR air and heat has raged on ever since the first converter figured out they could save serious dollars on a new shell by ordering the shell without OTR. It wasn't long before others followed.

Since the git-go every converter that didn't want to spend money for OTR has sung the same song. They claimed they were saving space and without the added drag on the engine the bus without OTR could climb the hills better and get more MPG. They repeated their claims so often the buyers started singing the same song without realizing the converters that were doing that were using up the saved bay space and more with their placement of the generator and batteries up front. If bay space is so valuable why waste it on a generator?

The folks that then shift their focus to the power consumed by the OTR compressor are also being less than honest. To produce a certain amount of cooling requires energy. Yes the OTR air compressor does take power that can be better used to climb a steep grade. If that is the case, turn it off until you hit the crest. You will never feel the difference in temps.

But if your non-OTR coach is going up a hill, how do you trun off the alternator. You don't so you have to turn those AC units off as well because the alternator also requires engine power, with the greater electrical loads requiring more alternator power. Or run the generator, retain engine power, but use more fuel per hour.

The reason OTR is rarely used by converters, apart from the above is that it takes a lot of engineering to balance the air flow in the system. Without it a converter can slap cabinetry and furniture anyplace it seems convenient. But in an OTR coach the converter has to consider the movement of air and make provisions along the entire length of the coach, not just for air discharge, but for return air. Any heating and AC specialist will tell you that is not as simple as it may seem.

Stinky, On the 97 Liberty which I have, I am still in awe of just how well that coach utilizes systems and features. I not only have the convenience of OTR, I have storage in one full bay in front, the equivalent of half a bay in the second position, long range fuel, ample battery capacity to go all night long without a generator starting, four cruise airs, and especially important to me 298 gallons of fuel. When the fuel prices were ridiculous I was able to tanker fuel and only buy at the cheapest locations. I happen to think the late 90's Libertys are as good as it gets.

[tdelorme]

We live and travel in warmer parts of the country and would not consider a bus without OTR air. But, if I lived and traveled in cooler parts of the country, found just the right unit at a good price, the lack of OTR air wouldn't kill the deal.

[merle&louise]

I can see the advantages of OTR AC. In both of my previous coaches, I experienced 2 ACs to go out in the dead of summer. In my 1987 2 of the 3 roof top ACs died at the same time; all I had was the dash air(which didn't work) and the bedroom AC. In the 1993 my son-in-law had 2 of the 3 Cruise Airs go out (you guessed it, the Bedroom unit was the only one that worked).

I would really like to have OTR AC. If for nothing else but an excellent back-up to the basement ACs and dash AC. When you are sweating driving down the road in your $300,000+ motorhome the last thing on your mind will be lost bay storage!:eek:

I like redundant systems.:D

[truk4u]

I have had 3 buses. The Marathon didn't have bus air, the CC did have CC's version of bus air that worked really well and now have the Liberty without OTR. It's a non-issue for us, I think I used the CC bus air two or three times through the entire summer, the dash air worked great. My Marathon also had a great dash air, we only used the cruiseair's via inverter a few times while driving.

The bottom line is, if you have to have your environment at really cold temps in order not to sweat like non sheared sheep in July, get OTR. Let's face it, I hear the OTR guys bragging about hanging meat in their buses, while the ladies are covered in blankets!:D