Michelin Tires

[lewpopp]

I went out to my local tire dealer and their main product was Michelin. I priced another brand (TOYO) and Michelin. Am I in the dark ages or are these prices good on a R12 22.5 : At the moment they are 490.12 plus the balancing compound $10 installed. They expect a 8% increase any day and I have asked for them to call me of the availability. If they could resell my old 6 yr old tires as used, they will give me as much as $150 a piece. Is this a good price or what? I expect they are the same tires I presently have on my coach on the drive wheels. Is there a special lettering on them I should be aware of? I have XZE now. I've gone brain dead.

I expect that anyone who needs tires and sees this will be calling to find out where this is. I can recall prices as high as $600 or more in some places.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Lew when we were talking about the $600 plus cost of tires it was for 315 size.

I would recommend you get the tires rated for 75mph. Michelin recommends the XZ2 for your size tire.

[truk4u]

Lew,

If you do it, also check the DOT dates and make sure your not getting old stuff.

[hhoppe]

I still don't see spending big bucks for tires that won't get worn out, they'll just rot out in 5-6 years and have to be replaced. Maybe Premium on the steer tires if you really need your blanket. Sumitomo, Toyo, Michelin there probably all Hecho in Mexico or China. Retired folks bucks come hard, don't waste them. Joe chime in here you have worn out more tires than weve seen.
How much risk is involved in tire selection? Race cars run over 200 MPH on 2 ply tires.

[Joe Cannarozzi]

Shoot Harry I do not go far from home with the stuff I drive with used rubber and caps.

As an example though, Last I blew a used trlr tire, there was 15 or 20% tread left on it and it was 10 year old according to the code. Never run low pressure and rode over nothing. Until that point accept for slight cracking and dryness looked o/k. So maybe at 8 or 9 Yr your pushing it 5 yr is too soon to pull and that goes for any brand you choose. That is my comfort zone for the bus. We only weigh 42000 all full tanks and gear so I tend to agree with you. But


I think buses have gotten all over the board with weight. If I had a 50,000+ rig I would be spending more.

I have learned to try to only suggest size and capacity and let the guy who is paying for them decide the brand. You can buy new tires for 2400 for 8 and you can also spend 5000+.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

You have to be a magician to get our size tires, either the 12s or 315 for $300 apiece. If we were running 11s or 295, maybe.

Its not our total bus weight that is the issue. It is the load our individual tires have to carry in some instances. My bus is only 46,600, but the front axle tires need to carry 7,000 pounds each. Some are carrying 9,000 per tire when you add a slide up front and locate a generator or batteries up front also. I don't think the steers on the typical tractor, even when heavily loaded come close.

[dalej]

We are looking at bringing in a portable scale from the State Patrol for the Spearfish rally. You will be able to see the weight at each tire and duals.

Hope it works out, sound like a good way to be sure on this subject.

[Joe Cannarozzi]

Jon

Agreeded, for some. Most folks are spending more.

On an older 40 like ours the back 6 tires each carry 5000lb and my fronts carry 6000 each. I do appreciate I am in a minority with these #s. I carry 12 on the steers on the Pete, little less little more loaded and empty by 300lb. It is a set-back front axle and the fifth wheel is slid up. 11-22.5 tire size no problemo for these weights. Comfortably under limit raitings for this size.

With the correct tires, in some states, you can put 20 on the steer on semi tractor, Michigan is one for sure. All straight trucks get 20,000max on the steer, correctly equiped, legal. Spread axle trlrs. are legal to carry 20,000 an axle and on supersingles tires if you like, everywhere. That would be on 11-22.5 rubber if duels or 385 singles.

[phorner]

We just had our bus weighed at a rally and the numbers weren't pretty.

LF was 7750 and RF was 7700. Ok, so that's not over my gross axle weight limit of 16,500, but according to my chart, still requires pressure of close to 115 psi.

The issue for us is 10,700 for the LR drive and 10,100 for the RR dual. Exceeds the gross weight limit by 400 lbs and is 600 lbs out of balance.

The exciting part is the tag. LR tag at 6800 lbs and RR tag at 6050. That's 850 lbs over the axle weight limit and all of it on the LR The whole coach was only 200 lbs over the GVWR.

With the fresh water holding tank located so close to the drive axles, I can probably get the weight down simply by not hauling around a full tank of fresh water. So, that will be my plan and then check the weight again under those circumstances. The good news was that the tire pressures that I was maintaining was plenty to do the job. But, there is still the issue of overloading the axles and suspension components.

There's not much flexibility as to loading the bus with regards to the weights in the rear..... unless Janice empties her closet.... and I don't see that happening anytime soon :rolleyes:

[Joe Cannarozzi]

Dale

They may be suprised when they see 20,000+ on the drives. And as Paul has mentioned with variance.

You may be giving them some information that we might be better off them not knowing.

Use your bus it is a lite one like ours, empty out:eek:

[Kenneth Brewer]

Lew,

Lewpopp,

If you do it, also check the DOT dates and make sure your not getting old stuff.

I have bought many tires, or so it seemed; 3 sets over the 19 years we had our Bluebird FC. I agree with Truk4u; the price seems good, but there may be a reason: the tires may have been in the warehouse for a few years, and if so, if you don't see mini-cracking ('rot') when they are mounted, you probably will, surprisingly quickly, and you will be tempted to assess them as 'not too bad'. I have had 2 inside tire blowouts in this way. Just be sure they are adequately 'new', please.

Take care.

[lewpopp]

As a matter of fact, I did discuss the build date of the tire with the tire man and he assured me these would be fresh tires with an age of 90 days or less on them

As for the wieghts and measures troopers coming to Spearchuckker, when they arrive, you'll see the place clear out like turning the light on massive swarms of cockroaches. Dale, don't you know that the majority of the members are on the lamb from the feds?

I will call today to see what he found out. Damn, I am between a hard place and a rock as to wether I should change rubber now or not. You know me, I don't want to spend the Lewbucks.

[Darl-Wilson]

Lew,

If you do it, also check the DOT dates and make sure your not getting old stuff.

Go to this site (http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=4826897) for a John Stossel video report on the above. Good post Tom. This is very important for all of us.

Darl

[Ray Davis]

Interesting report. Kind of contradicts what evidently was said at the SV and Pahrump rallies this year by two different tire makers? If I heard correctly, they said ties were good for 10 years, as long as there was no visible cracking. This report is more along the 6 year line that I'd always heard.

Ray

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Six years and both manufacturers will no longer provide any warranty coverage.

Both said that is six years from installation.

Both said if they are tne years old, regardless of the installation date they will not provide warranty coverage. Michelin provided a set of photos to compare the sidewall cracking to and gave specific guidance as to the tire condition. The worst condition shown called for replacement.

What I cam to understand was as long as you are within six years of the installation date, but not greater than 10 years from the date of manufacture both companies consider the tires OK as long as sidewall cracking is less than the limit depicted by Michelin. After the 6th or 10th year the tires were not warranted and any age between the two requires the tires to be routinely inspected.

I couldn't make the link work. It said I was trying to get a link that no longer exists.

[Kenneth Brewer]

Interesting report. Kind of contradicts what evidently was said at the SV and Pahrump rallies this year by two different tire makers? If I heard correctly, they said ties were good for 10 years, as long as there was no visible cracking. This report is more along the 6 year line that I'd always heard.

Ray

Tire manufacturers aren't in the business of storing tires. And tire dealers aren't in the business (successfully) throwing out inventory. I would think a tire a year old or so is fine, but the problem is if you don't check you won't know. And I think most business try to clear the oldest stock first. Please view that video Darl-Wilson posted the link to. There is a reason why you are hearing a number of us warn you. You won't see 'visible cracking' on an old tire until after it has been mounted and you drive away; in my case, in less than a month, when I went to clean and polish the rims, and I said "What the f....?". Take the benefit of these responses, even though it's free. It is right on the money.

[Ray Davis]

I did indeed watch the video, which prompted my earlier question. Jon, I guess I misunderstood, but there seems to be a long distance between "providing warranty", and dangerous, as per the video link. The video link indicated tires should be replaced at 6 years of age, but also cited that they found tires as old as 12 years being sold as brand new at name-brand stores.


Ray

[Darl-Wilson]

Six years and both manufacturers will no longer provide any warranty coverage.

Both said that is six years from installation.

Both said if they are tne years old, regardless of the installation date they will not provide warranty coverage. Michelin provided a set of photos to compare the sidewall cracking to and gave specific guidance as to the tire condition. The worst condition shown called for replacement.

What I cam to understand was as long as you are within six years of the installation date, but not greater than 10 years from the date of manufacture both companies consider the tires OK as long as sidewall cracking is less than the limit depicted by Michelin. After the 6th or 10th year the tires were not warranted and any age between the two requires the tires to be routinely inspected.

I couldn't make the link work. It said I was trying to get a link that no longer exists.

Cut and paste this Jon. http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=4826897 Link still works.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Darl,

Thanks for the link. One thought that I had while I was watching the video was related to how the people maintain their cars, and specifically their tire pressures.

Back in the days of bias ply tires you could see when a tire was under inflated. With radials being the standard today the pressure needs to be very low before the tire takes on the appearance of being under inflated. I don't remember if it was the Goodyear or Michelin guy that said if a tire is run with the pressure down by 20% it has to be considered trash.

I was very surprised to learn that. He was very clear that driving with an underinflated tire damages the tire beyond repair, so how many of the tire failures attributed to age including on our buses are the result of low tire pressure.

[Will Garner]

The tire seminar was one of the few seminars I was able to get to in Sevierville - to much time spent looking for and watching the installation of two new converters/chargers for my domestic batteries. I do recall the Goodyear repreresentative clearly stating in Goodyear's opinion running tires 20% low on air would result in their considering them trash.

I put almost 7,000 miles on our coach from 29 May to 2 July. Tire pressures were checked, and adjusted as necessary, multiple times each day. When I checked them at a stop in western Arizona (106 degrees of dry heat with no cloud cover so it was not that bad!) I found the tires to actually be about 3-4 pounds over their maximum rated pressures. Air was released to get back in the correct range. I did wonder what percentage of pressure over the recommended maximum pressure over what time frame would result in the same conclusion - trash.

[jonnie]

Will,

Are you sure you are doing the correct thing by checking your pressures hot. Tire pressures are indicated in max pressure cold.

John

[MangoMike]

Will,

It was my understanding from the tire guy that you checked them cold and if they expanded due to heat after motoring down the road, not to mess with them.

mm

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

It has also been my understanding that tire pressure is a cold pressure.

Any increase due to elevated temperature is to be expected and maintained!

Do not let air out of a tire when checked hot and found to be higher than specifications.

It is OK for a tire to be over specified pressure by a reasonable amount, and that would be the pressure increase due to a temperature rise.

It is not OK for a tire to be under inflated, and if air is let out hot in a likelihood the tire will be under specified pressure when the temperature drops, such as at night or in the morning.

[Ray Davis]

Agreed on that point.

Perhaps one thing that wasn't clear (not sure if it's this same thread or not). It's perfectly valid to take an IR gun to check your temperatures at a stop. As long as ALL the tires are getting hotter together, then you are fine. It's when you find one that is a significantly higher temp, then this might be indicative of being under inflated (perhaps losing air), or a problem with the wheel and/or bearing.

Ray

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Scientific or not when I shoot the temps on my tires I look for consistency. I am presuming the tire pressure charts (which I follow) have pressures listed that are proportional to the load carried and thus the amount of tire flex is constant between all tires.

Again, assuming that is the case I can expect uniform temps. If I have a tire out of the norm then further checking is necessary. I have learned the tires on the sunny side of the coach will be slightly warmer, but if I check them almost immediately after stopping the differences are only a couple of degrees.

If I have a failure of a tire on the drive axle I presume it will show up. I am not able to shoot the temperatures of the sidewalls on the inner dual, so I shoot the center of the tread on all tires to be consistent.

I agree strongly with a cold temperature check and then not adjusting pressures on warm or hot tires. That has been emphasized consistently by all tire companies. The cold inflation pressures are established knowing the pressures after driving are going to increase.

[lewpopp]

I wnt and found the difference between the XZE &XZ2.. Only the derailer grouve on the "2". Jon, you told me to ge the XZ2s, right. Same price as the XZEs The current price is $548 + balance. Trade in are worth up to $150. I may get 4 drive tires. I thought the XZ2s were for the front.

[lewpopp]

I forgot to mention that they had 2 tires in stock with the date code of 4507. That would be Nov 07. the 2 tires in stock were $510 + balance. I cannot be too wrong getting them if Michelin guarantees the tires for 5 years from installation, right?

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Lew,

Both are recommended and both are rated for 75 MPH. Either will work.

I think the Michelin warranty was 6 years from date of installation.

[Will Garner]

Yes, I agree that tire pressures should be checked cold. Did that every morning. Also oil and water.

One thing I found out was you better check them before the sun comes up. The sunny side will be a few pounds higher than the shady side.

My concern in checking the tires after driving was that they not exceed the maximum rated air pressure embossed on the sidewall of the tire. I did not reduce the air pressure back to what I look for when checking it cold. I did reduce it to just less than the maximum rated air pressure printed on the sidewall since there should be no reason for the tire temperature to increase further.

My initial reason for checking the tire pressures after driving (300-400 hundred miles between checks) was to make certain there were no slow leaks - since my oldie but goodie does not have a high tech tire pressure monitoring system. Most of the time the pressures were under the maximum rated pressure and uniform numbers. The time they were not was in that really sandy area in southern Arizona (can we all say Sonoran Dessert?).

By the way, I also checked the tire pressures on my toad at the same time. I've always had one factory installed Michelin that just kept slowly leaking down (65 psi fronts; 70 psi rears). Local dealers could not find a puncture or reason for the leakage. That problem should now be solved as two of them had to be replaced in Phoenix - my bad - and the other two got replaced once I was back home. That reminds me, better go check the tire pressures this morning - fortunately we are awaiting rain so I can sleep in. I'm also going to the bus this morning and will check them again just for the practice. The bus is inside so the sun factor does not come into play. I have not driven it since the big trip - 2nd July arrival home - so it will be interesting to see where the pressures are this morning.



Is there a tire manufacture's representative out there to pose this question to?

[phorner]

I've been having a hard time finding a small, portable compressor that has the capability of maintaining the pressure in my tires. Seems that most struggle to get the tires to just over 100 psi.

Any recommendations on a compressor that will do a better job and be capable of raising the pressures to 115 psi or better?

[merle&louise]

Paul,

I have an air doubler installed on my coach. I run 130 psi in my front tires and the air doubler has no trouble pumping that much air. Here is the website where it can be purchased. Ebay also may have some listed at a lower price.

It is connected to your engine air compressor system so you don't have to purchase a separate air compressor.

http://www.pneuaire.com/nvba1110-t02.html

[phorner]

That looks perfect for what I need. After weighing my coach, I need to maintain a minimum of 113 psi in the front tires, which I'll round up to 115 psi. The rest are fine at 95 psi.

And, I get to free up some storage space so I can haul more stuff :D

Thanks for the link.

[MangoMike]

Paul,

Here's an option for you. Works great. JDUB and I both have one.

3042

More info over at prevoman.com

http://www.prevoman.com/Pages/Cool%20Toos/PowerTank/powertankpg1.html

[0533]

I replaced all 8 tires with Michelin's about 2 months ago while at Prevost. I had the Bus weighed before making the final decision.

The total weight was 49,220, 16,080 in the front, 20,320 drives and 12,820 on the tags. These weights reflected a full load.

We have a big slide out on the D/S side plus the Marathon 20K Genset in the C/S front bay.

After careful consideration we decided to go with the 365 upgraded wheels and tires used on the newer Prevost's, 365/70 R22.5-XZA1 wide profile tires. The thought process was to have a larger weight capacity and to be able to lower the tire pressure from 120lbs (315/80 22.5) to 100lbs which Michelin called for based on the tire and front axle weights. The ride, handling and bumps are much better as a result, and the piece of mind with the extra weight capacity is reassuring.

We also replaced the drives and tag with Michelin 315/80R 22.5-XZA-2 Energy, but do have an order in for the 365 upgrade for the tag when they have studs that will fit on the Rockwell disk brakes. We keep the tire pressures at 105 on the drives and 100 on the tag, which was recommended by the Michelin tire guide based on axle weight.

PS> We check the tires before every drive, only when cold and only in the early morning before the sun has had a chance to beat away on one of the bus sides. We never check or add air after we have driven the bus (unless something looks or feels wrong of course) and do not feel that making any decision to add or release air after running the tires to a hot point would offer a good result and may in fact provide a very bad result depending on where you are, how hot the tires are etc.

PS> We were not able to find these tires listed above at any source that was close to the prices you mentioned in these threads, not close, and yes Prevost does charge more than most but when I get a problem with one of these tires down the road I will expect Prevost to take care of it without question.

Another PS> I was washing the bus at an RV Park in Maine a few weeks ago, was in the process of applying some spray on tire shine, when a neighboring WonderLodge owner came over and said that when you add the tire shine to your Michelin tires, Michelin will down grade the life of the tire warrantee by 2 years, as Michelin feels it takes off the UV factory coating that is applied by Michelin. have any of you ever heard this, as I cannot find this written anywhere, and if so it should be part of some literature.

[rfoster]

Did you ask to see his credentials? I have never heard of such a thing and even if he had something that would render some credibility I would still question it and continue to use tire dressing..

My Chinese tires really shine up good.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Bruce,

The tires have a compound that migrates to the surface when the tire is used to prevent cracking and damage associated with UV. There is no Michelin surface treatment. The "tire expert" must have been using recreational chemicals. However.......most tire dressings contain petroleum distillates and petroleum products are detrimental to a tire. The manufacturers say to keep them clean because dust and dirt on the surface wicks out the compounds intended to protect agains UV. As a practical matter however I doubt if anybody will be cleaning dust and dirt off the inside of their tires or the space between the duals.

Paul,

If you need to fill your bus tires with air don't worry about doing anything other than running your bus engine while filling. You should have aux system pressure of 125 to 130 when running. That is more than enough. The fuel you use will be cheaper than any compressor or pressure multiplier.

[phorner]

Mike,

That does look like another good option. How often have you needed to refill the tank?

Jon,

Good idea... I'll give it a try and see if it's enough to do the job for me.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Paul,

Unless you are exceptionally heavy on the front end you are likely to only need about 100 to 105 PSI in the steers, less everywhere else.

Easily handled with the aux system with the bus running.

[Darl-Wilson]

I posted earlier in another tire thread that I was going to buy this device and would report on it to the group. This is just an overview as it relates to this thread. I will take some pictures later today and post additional information.

As some bright person said, "Opinions are like A--holes, everybody has one", and this thread verifies that quote. I am only going to report what has to do with instructions and information from people a lot smarter than I. (That's almost everyone!)

1st, every publication and every tire I can find states to only inflate tires when cold, PERIOD..

2nd, many tires and publications list the two most common causes of catastrophic tire failure as under-inflation and overloading.

This should lead to the conclusion that checking tires cold, which I interpret to mean, prior to driving, is essential. "Cold" temperatures are going to vary greatly depending on location. We were in Redding, CA last week and the temperatures varied from 87 degrees to 116 degrees in one 24 hour period. back in Reno it was down to 59.

Before installing the TireSafeGuard system I checked my tires late in the evening prior to a trip and again before leaving in the morning. Sometimes there was a substantial difference in those 2 readings.

My TireSafeGuard has the Flow-Thru caps on the bus and the simple black, caps/transmitters (http://www.tiresafeguard.com/images/tpm-s1x4.gif), on the Honda CR-V. This link (http://www.tiresafeguard.com/pdf/TTPM-PV-RV%20OP%20Manual.pdf) displays some of the items that have been replaced with new and much-improved equipment. Simply the system I am using would not meet Jon's requirements because it does not report the critical inside tire temperature such as the transmitter that straps to the inside of the wheel. Actually I would prefer that system and I may buy those transmitters when I replace my tires. For now I avoided the almost $400 I was quoted to remove my bus tires, install the equipment, rebalance the tires and replace them on the vehicle. The rest of the equipment is the same regardless of the type of transmitter. Incidentally, HCI sells an antenna booster to use in stainless buses but I didn't need it. I even get accurate readings on my toad when it is disconnected from the bus and parked several yards away.

Using the cap transmitters do not give an accurate temperature indication of the air inside of the tire, however, they will show the difference when compared with the other wheels and will set off the alarm if the difference is too great. They will also report high brake or bearing temperatures.

How does all of this relate to the topic at hand? First, I am able to check my tire pressure from the comfort of the drivers seat. I have manually checked the tires to be assured that the HCI device is working properly. It is dead on.
Since the screen is wireless I am able to take it with me. No need for a manual air gauge.

Secondly, I do not have to get out of the bus and bump my tires as I normally do at every stop. I do continue to inspect my tires every day when traveling. And most importantly I am able to monitor the pressure and temperature while driving. Any aberration in either is going to set off an alarm.

I have discovered on the almost 500 mile 'shakedown' trip that temperatures and pressures vary greatly from where they were when cold in the morning. The sunny side may have a few more degrees and more pressure after driving just a few miles. I have Michelin XZA-80 315 R22.5 tires that have a capacity of 130# cold. I carry 120# cold in my steers which seems appropriate for my heavy axle weight. One interesting fact is that the alarm temperature for the HCI device is 170 degrees. Some research on the subject yields information that 150 to 200 degrees is acceptable on truck and bus tires. Here is an interesting article (http://www.drivetosurvive.org/tire_safety_article.htm) that goes into more detail on temps and pressure.

I guess my conclusion is that tire safety cannot be understated. The more good equipment we have to monitor our tires the better chance we have to protect ourselves and our passengers. A good outcome is a tire failure that never occurs.

More to come later about the TPMS.
Note about air compressors: I have the blue twin tank model (http://www.masterpowercompressor.com/). Paid about $140.00 2 yrs ago at Costco. Pumps up tires, inflatable boats, toys, etc. Great for Air Tools, cleaning, pressure washing, and about anything else where high pressure (150#) air is needed. Fits easily in 3rd bay on right where CC put a 110V plug. Portable. I wouldn't be without it!

Darl

[Darl-Wilson]

"A blown-out tire on the bus, operated by Angel Tours, contributed to the wreck, Ayers said." (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,399942,00.html)
Here is a grim reminder that we need to be so very careful with tires. It is also a reminder to post the pictures I promised about the TireSafeGuard device I purchased recently. (Roger Foster also has the same set-up )
Mine works great and has identified a slow leak I have on an inside dual. But the main reason I bought this product was to protect my family, myself, and my fellow motorists from a fate such as the above.

Maybe a short session or demonstration of these various products would be in order for Spearfish? Any comments? See you there!

Darl:cool:

[Joe Cannarozzi]

I have had blow-outs on steer axle tires on loaded semis, with and without power steering.

If you are paying attention and even without power steering it does not take excessive effort to control the vehical and get it to the shoulder. I once rolled over something with an old KW without power steering at highway speed and the explosion was so violent it literally blew apart the right front fiberglass fender from the hood and the truck held the lane and I simply slowed down and over.

IMO if a steer tire blowout puts the vehical off the road the responsibility lies with the driver.

Pardon me for being cynical about crash investigation conclusions.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Ditto what Joe said.

When Ford had the tire blowout fiasco years back and everybody was suing everybody, especially Firestone and Ford, one of the car magazines did an article on what happens when a vehicle has a blowout and how to control the vehicle. This article was brought about because the media portrayed the issue as if everyone that gets a blowout spins and rolls out of control killing everybody.

They did the blowouts at various speeds. Intitially they could not get the tiires to lose air fast enough to duplicate a blowout and sudden loss of air pressure so they rigged something up to make the air pressure drop to zero instantaneously. I don't remember how they did it, but they ended up doing that because all the tests prior to the modification were non-events. Nothing violent happened and the drivers never lose control.

So when they did the simulated blowouts the results were the same. The driver steered to maintain control and did nothing more than to allow the vehicle to slow down. It was concluded that if control of the vehicle was lost following a blowout it would have to have been because the driver did something such as letting go of the steering wheel or did something ill advised like jerking the steering wheel or slamming on the brakes.

[Joe Cannarozzi]

I put that out there not so much to to disagree with anything but rather to try to inform folks and to maybe put some fears to rest about steer blowouts.

The sound of the explosion and being startled is the worst of it.

[Ray Davis]

So, I assume besides holding the wheel firmly, you should NOT apply excessive force to the breaks, and try to slow down gradually?

Ray

[garyde]

On the Michelin Tire website there is a video explaining what to do in a front end tire blow out. Its worth watching.
I have had several blowouts on RV's , one being on the front end while traveling in LA at 65 MPH. You should not use your brake, but instead maintain steady throttle, not accelerate, and move to the side as soon as safety allows.
If you brake , it is actually harder to steer. If you maintain throttle the vehicle maintains its path of travel and allows you to steer .
http://www.michelinrvtires.com/michelinrv/toolbox/videos-demos.jsp#The_Critial_Factor

[Ray Davis]

Wow, thanks for posting that Gary. I would have never thought to first hit the accellerator when experiencing a blowout. Makes sense, but it's not one of those intuitive things.

Ray

[Darl-Wilson]

Joe and Jon, I am sure you are not suggesting we be careless about our tires because a catastrophic loss of air is no big deal. I too have had a few blowouts and I'm still here. Two of them were right steer tires, on two different trucks. One was a Freightliner COE and the other was a Mack conventional. Both were on Rice hill on I-5 in Oregon. I never left the pavement on either.

I knew how to handle the vehicle. Some people don't. I am not picking on Ray but who would have believed that he has owned several large RVs and didn't know not to touch the brakes when experiencing a blowout. (This is another plus for getting a Class B license)

Gary, thanks for posting the Michelin video. You may have saved Ray's bacon. I'll bet there are several other folks here that appreciate that link too.

My point in posting the accident in Texas was a reminder to take care of the tires. It now seems that the steer tires had been regroved (legal but not for steer tires) and separated causing the accident. It looks like the driver hit a low concrete guardrail then rolled over it onto the right side. It could very well have been that the driver hit the brakes causing the vehicle to veer to the right into the concrete abutment.

The point here is that we never know when we will have an emergency of any kind. If we were in the same location as this bus driver with no emergency lane, traveling at 65 mph, just inches from the abutment would we have avoided the same fate? Checking and rechecking all of our equipment just makes sense. I never flew my airplane, even around the pattern, without a thorough pre-flight. I do the same on my Prevost. I pay special attention to my tires because the accident that never happens is the only one I want to have.:cool:

[Jon Wehrenberg]

I think you know me better than that Darl. I think a well maintained coach and careful pretrip inspections are vital and I don't think an owner should even drive the coach until he knows and understands the systems.

It is my opinion that some folks on this site need to attend a seminar put on by folks that really know and understand how to drive and how to do a pre-trip inspection and how to react to emergencies. I know you and Joe and Brian E would all be excellent instructors for that.

I would love to see a complete seminar on safe driving, including some graphic demonstrations on stopping distances, tire pressure checking (wanna bet a lot at our rallies are too low?) precision driving, and applicable safety checks.

[Darl-Wilson]

I think you know me better than that Darl. I think a well maintained coach and careful pretrip inspections are vital and I don't think an owner should even drive the coach until he knows and understands the systems.


Yes, I do know you well Jon and didn't mean to suggest that you would encourage taking short-cuts where safety is a concern.

I think you are on to something about having a discussion about safety and proper driving habits? I would be honored to volunteer to help in that endeavor.
It's about time I contribute something! Now all we need to do is get Brian E. and Joe on board. How about it guys?;)

Darl

[Joe Cannarozzi]

I would like to see a demonstration in "drifting", in a 45er:D

[Ray Davis]

In a little defense, I knew not to hit the brakes, but accellerating was news to me. No-one has ever mentioned it, and I've never seen it here. So, not quite sure where I would have had that knowledge.

Ray

[Darl-Wilson]

I would like to see a demonstration in "drifting", in a 45er:D

At 85mph down Donner Joe?

So does this mean you're coming to Spearfish?

[truk4u]

If your old enough and drove really old trucks, 60's, do you remember the dash valve that you could throw that would take the front brakes off line? The purpose was to help maintain steerage while braking in snow and ice, but the side benny was if you blew a steer tire and jumped on the brakes, no big deal. Prior to this era, there were no brakes on the front axle.

Just a little tidbit from the past for those of you that give a rats ass.....:p

And what the hell does all this have to do with Parts & Pieces for Sale or Trade?

[lewpopp]

I guess a lot of us learned from the video telling us what to do. Another thing you learned from Darl's post was not to mention you learned from it. In the future, if you do post you learned something, Darl will jump your bones like he did here.

Sorry Darl, I did take my meds and as a matter of fact, they reduced the amount I need, so there!

[rfoster]

Tuck: Was that truck pre 1800? I not old enough to know this kinda stuff.

Did you see it on the History Channel or do you really know this from experience?:cool:

[BrianE]

Don't know about drifting Joe, but JDUB is reported to be the "drafting" pro. By the way the truk has forgotten more about herding a big rig than most of us will ever know and a nice line of BS besides. :D

[truk4u]

King - I was driving a White JT and a 35' trailer at age 14, while my grandfather took a snooze in the right seat. My Dad wouldn't let me drive his truck on the road, so I would always try to go with my Grandfather. I fueled trucks, washed trucks, unloaded trucks and did just about everything in between while in school. After Vietnam, I went straight to driving, hauling produce from upstate NY to the Big Apple. Drove and was an Owner Operator for 15 years, then got smart and started dispatching. Then got stupid over the years and at one time had 175 trucks. Then got smart again by forming a Logistic Company with no owned trucks. Still drive occasionally, trucks today will really spoil ya..

Back in the old days, it was an honorable profession with great drivers that would help anyone anytime. It's not that way anymore, just listen to the CB.
So there, no history channel here big boy.

Brian - BS? You've been listening to Mango and Jdub.:D

[hhoppe]

Ok now as I understand it : Truk has done the research, design and engineering and will soon have kits available for all POG members to push a button on our dash and disable our front brakes. This will allow us to buy cheaper steering tires, maybe even re-caps. Way to go Truk. $$$$

[Jon Wehrenberg]

If you haven't driven six months out of the year on snow covered roads you can't appreciate what a blessing it is to be able to steer out of a skid, something not always possible if the drives are fully loaded and thus will not lockup until long after the steers have locked up.

[flyu2there]

King - I was driving a White JT and a 35' trailer at age 14D

Below is a White JT in pristine condition..............