Tires?

[adamdegraff]

Here's a question that will certainly have lots of different answers...

As most of you know, I have a tour coming up that will take me about 40,000 miles in 8 or 9 months. I have my two kids and wife on the bus and MUST be at my concerts on time, every time. (Missing even one concert would cost me more than a new set of tires.)

My bus is still new to me. The previous owner had the tires inspected every year. (removed, inspected at Michelin, new valve stems, etc.) He had pressure pro on and was quite anal about tires. Actually, he was anal about everything... which is why I bought the bus from him. I still have the pressure pro and it works like a charm. Tires are mostly under 3 or 4 years old. At least one is closer to 5 years old according to the codes, but all were installed within 4 years, some newer. All have deep tread. None have significant cracking on side. Some have NO cracking, some have a little bit, but nothing major.

What do y'all think I should do? Have them all inspected? Does that even make a difference? They are those Michelin XZA's. I think those are supposed to be good tires, but honestly, I don't get off on tires the way some people do. I tend to obsess about other issues. I don't want to be penny wise and pound foolish, but then again, I don't want to trash a perfectly good set of tires. I also don't want to be worrying all the time about them, nor do I want a blow out.

Suggestions?

Thanks,

~Adam

[dalej]

Adam,

You should be in good shape, just keep an eye on the pressure, but you should even with a new set.

[adamdegraff]

Adam,

You should be in good shape, just keep an eye on the pressure, but you should even with a new set.

Music to my ears:-)

~Adam

[BrianE]

Adam, Have them inspected. Sidewall cracking is generally not a good thing and should be monitored daily. Being anal about tire pressure and condition IS a good thing. Start with weighing each axle and refer to the Michelin pressure charts and related notes to determine correct pressure. http://www.michelinrvtires.com/michelinrv/tires-retreads/new-tires.jsp. Try and err a little on the high side when airing up. Considering the varied conditions you will encounter on your tour, you may need to add or release air if the average temperature changes significantly (more than 30f or so).

There have been numerous opinions about the use of pressure monitors and you might look at previous posts to get up to speed on the options. I use the Pressure Pro also and like it. The down side for me was that initially it made me lazy with respect to a daily tire inspection. Daily inspections are really important as any good trucker will agree. A quick check of tires and hub temps at lunchtime isn't a bad idea either.

[adamdegraff]

Brian,
in your opinion, what does a daily tire inspection entail?
~Adam

[Petervs]

Brian starts with a toothbrush and cleans them real well all over with the Simple Green paste. Then he moves the bus forward 3 feet to get the part that was underneath.

Then he uses a micrometer to measure tread depth in 16 places on each tire and enters the data into a spreadsheet which also tracks mileage, and compares tread wear on a per mile basis.

Then he gets out his 10x magnifying glass to be sure there is nothing on the tires that does not belong, like bubble gum residue or small rocks.

Once a week he lets all the air out, while the bus is supported on Jon's fine stands and puts in new fresh air, except if he is in Southern California or Texas where the air is not so fresh.

Then he gives each tire a little kiss and whispers " be a good tire today". Only then is the bus ready to drive.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

I heard from Goodyear at Sevierville, and Michelin at Pahrump.

The message was the same from the tire experts.

Maintain the air pressure in the tires according to the charts both companies have on tire pressures based on the weight each tire is carrying. That message was made very clear.

A tire life is in their opinion 6 years from the date of installation for service, or 10 years from the manufacturing date code regardless of when it was first put into service. Neither company will warrant any tire beyond those two dates.

To prolong the life of the tire neither company recommended tire dressings, but both were recommending the tires be kept clean. Personally I have no clue as to how we are to keep the inside walls towards the center of the coach clean unless we get under our coaches and wash them.

Tire repairs must be made according to their instructions which include a plug and a patch on the inside.

Any tire that has been run at 20% less than its recommended tire pressure is deemed unfit for future service. That one was a surprise, but after seeing Jim Scoggins pictures I can understand it.

Any cracking in the sidewalls is an issue and Michelin supplied a template to use to measure acceptability of sidewall cracking. Apart from inspections to check tire pressure and wear, I came away understanding that it is critical to look for evidence of sidewall cracking.

Both companies agreed that the best way to get maximum life from a tire was to raise it off the ground when the bus is stored.

When Brian is not out chasing moles he does follow all the guidelines and has been able to get several decades out of his tires.

[dalej]

One habit I have gotten into is when ever I stop for any reason I walk around and put the back of my hand against the tires to check for heat. I also touch my fingers on the wheels and check for heat.

Looking for anything above normal ranges. If the wheels have be running in the sun I add some heat for that.

[BrianE]

Adam, As you can see, Peter is not a very good resource. His emotions tend to get in the way of his poor advice.

A simple visual inspection for damage, nails, rocks, curb scuff etc which may have occurred on the previous days run is sufficient. A hands on or near heat check is also a good precaution during or just after the days run. A serious overheat may be detected as an overpressure alarm on your Pressure Pro but I wouldn't count on it. As Jon mentioned, we were all surprised at how critical the tire experts regarded running under inflated during their talks at Sevierville and Pahrump. Something to keep in mind.

[adamdegraff]

I heard from Goodyear at Sevierville, and Michelin at Pahrump.

The message was the same from the tire experts.

Maintain the air pressure in the tires according to the charts both companies have on tire pressures based on the weight each tire is carrying. That message was made very clear.

A tire life is in their opinion 6 years from the date of installation for service, or 10 years from the manufacturing date code regardless of when it was first put into service. Neither company will warrant any tire beyond those two dates.

To prolong the life of the tire neither company recommended tire dressings, but both were recommending the tires be kept clean. Personally I have no clue as to how we are to keep the inside walls towards the center of the coach clean unless we get under our coaches and wash them.

Tire repairs must be made according to their instructions which include a plug and a patch on the inside.

Any tire that has been run at 20% less than its recommended tire pressure is deemed unfit for future service. That one was a surprise, but after seeing Jim Scoggins pictures I can understand it.

Any cracking in the sidewalls is an issue and Michelin supplied a template to use to measure acceptability of sidewall cracking. Apart from inspections to check tire pressure and wear, I came away understanding that it is critical to look for evidence of sidewall cracking.

Both companies agreed that the best way to get maximum life from a tire was to raise it off the ground when the bus is stored.

When Brian is not out chasing moles he does follow all the guidelines and has been able to get several decades out of his tires.

Jon and everybody else,
thanks for the input. I think that if I can be sure of one thing, it is that the tires on my bus have NOT been run low. Like I said before, the previous owner was a tire nut and used pressure pro religiously. The sidewall crackling is so minor that it is hard to even see. I like the idea of checking the tires for heat and will start making that a regular routine at the end of the day. As will I do a walk around before I take off... as I already do.

Much thanks!

Adam

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Adam, for a few bucks you can get an infrared temperature sensor gun. I have a Fluke and it cost around $79.

When you stop to take a break you can shoot the temps of both the tires and hubs or wheels. If anything is out of the norm it will show up and further checking can be done.

I do like the concept of the tire sensors that measure both pressure and temperatures. I am not yet sold on the external pressure sensors that mount on the valve stem.

[Ray Davis]

Jon,

Where do you point your temp senor? I purchased one, and aimed it at the sidewalls. Steve Bennett suggested to me that he points at the tire treads, coming directly inline with the tire.

Just curious if there are opinions where to measure the temp most accurately.

Ray

ps: I picked up one of these infra-red temp sensors at Sears. Also around $75 (plus or minus). Really helpful for a lot of things, including checking your A/C to see how efficiently it's working

[phorner]

OK, so what temperatures are you finding as you travel? I've seen mine mostly in the 115 to 125 degree range. I tend to look more for uniformity than the actual temp.

Any guidelines?

[rfoster]

I too use the old infra red hand held thermometer to check tire and hub temps. The temps will vary as to outside air temp, daylight, night time, sunny side or shade side. I am like you Paul I am looking for the big variance in temps from one to the next. As long as they are fairly consistent from one wheel and tire to the next wheel and tire on the same side life is good.

Then I come in the coach an aim at the Ms to see what her temp is.

[JIM KELLER]

I also use a Fluke infrared hand held. Temps run 108 - 125 depending on outside temps and which side has the sun. I notice the drivers side of the towed vehicle runs about 10 degrees hotter than the passenger side due to the exhaust of the Bus. The red flag of this system is a variation in temps of a significant amount.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

My temps are consistent with Pauls. To be consistent since I cannot shoot the sidewalls of the inner drive axle tires I shoot the treads. If I could easliy shoot the sidewalls of the inner tires I would aim at the widest point on the bulge. If I had a willingness to assume some risk I would only shoot the outside sidewalls because a low pressure on either drive axle tire would show up as a high temp on the outside tire.

The sunny side of the coach is always going to be warmer by a few degrees so as long as one side has similar temps and the other has similar but warmer temps I assume I am OK.

FWIW, my tires and valves are all apparently as leak free as I can expect. When I check tire pressures, even after the coach sits for an extended period I rarely am off by more than a pound of pressure. The temperature in my garage varies from the coldest in the winter around 55 degrees to the hottest in the summer around 75 and except for the seasonal pressure adjustment I haven't had to add air, but I still check them because the downside is too dangerous.