Bus Supports / Stands

[Jon Wehrenberg]

I can't find where I previously posted to see if there is any interest in stands to support the coach. Since I posted it I had some made so everybody could see specifically what I was talking about, and so I could get a reasonable quote.

The stands are pictured below. The intent is to find out who would like them, and what height the purchaser would like them. Dale uses a variation and perhaps he can make suggestions both to the configuration and dimensions.

I would suggest a height about 1/4" less than the distance between the floor and the support point on the bus when fully raised.

The price quoted will be in the $30 range plus freight. I was thinking of having them shipped to my home and I will deliver them to the TN rally goers, and space permitting will bring the ones for the NV rally with me. Let me know who is interested top see if there is enough quantity for a run.

These are heavy, a minimum of 3/16 steel, and powder coated.

[dalej]

Sweet Jon, really sweet! thats what the kids say now a days to describe something that looks really nice. You have got a nice bus stand there.

Don't even ask to see mine! :)

[dalej]

For those of you that like to work on your bus i.e. shocks, air bags, air valves or change oil and
do the service work, you need to use these stands.

For those of you that want to use stands, you just might need a aux compressor to raise the bus
all the way up so you can set the stands and work underneath with out the feeling of what if.

The height is always best if its all the way up and then let it settle a bit on the stands. When you
are ready to move the bus it's nice to have a air compressor that will pump up to around 135 to
raise the bus to get the stands out. Then you can lower it below ride height and then start the bus.

Sometimes when I'm in a hurry to move the bus I use my air over hydraulic jack to raise the bus
to remove the stands. Front first, remember.

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

Those sure are fine stands Jon.:)

Here is the link to your original offer.

http://forum.prevostownersgroup.com/showthread.php?t=1618&highlight=supports

[rfoster]

Jon: That looks good to me, put me down for a set - make mine the same size and color as yours, I like black.

[Petervs]

Hi Jon,

Nice design. I just gave Brian a chunk of 6 x14 wood so he could cut some supports. That works fine but has no elegance. More of a Winnebago approach I think.

I think you need to put me down for a set. 6 of them for a 45 foot coach, right? I will need to measure the heights needed and advise you in a few days.

Thanks for making another improvement in the lives of POGGERS.

[BrianE]

Jon,

Actually, Peter doesn't need them because I'm going to give the wood blocks back. I'll sure take a set though. 4 at 14" will work for me. Am hoping to pick them up at Sevierville. Thanks.

[nrhareiner]

Thanks Jon,

Count me in, the same height as for your bus.

[JIM KELLER]

What an opportunity ! Please put me down for a set. Thanks.

[tdelorme]

Put me down for a set. I'll check the heights today and send you a PM. Now, can I send you a check now, or are you going to finance this deal yourself? Did you weld up the prototypes? Very professional looking job.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

For all who have expressed an interest I will measure my coach less 1/2" but I don't want to be responsible if yours is different. You need to verify the height will work because I know some coaches have different wheels or tires and that will affect the height.

No money need change hands. My daughter owns our old factory and she will be manufacturing them. I will settle with her when I deliver the stands. Before then, once the quantity is known I will get a firm number for the freight. One of the POG members indicated he would pick them up at the factory and that is OK. He should get a plant tour. I will post the presumed height later. Bear in mind this is for a 97 XL with 315 tires.

Kim, can you check an XLII? I hope they are the same.

[Ray Davis]

I'm interested in a set, but will need to go out to the hanger and measure the bus ...

Ray

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Ray, no rush. I was going to get them into production after Christmas.

I will use your dimensions to apply to an XLII chassis and hope the 40 is the same as the 45.

[Kevin Erion]

Jon, I will measure mine this weekend, that will give you 2 XLII to work from, I have an 01 45'. I will use the level low to raise it all the way up, I have no aux air at the house to add more air to try to get it a little higher but we will be able to compare notes. The stands look great but I have my needs covered, just trying to give you some info.
Kevin

[mcirco]

They look great. I would like to get a set also. I'm not sure if I will be able to determine the exact height for my bus based upon it's current storage location so I would ask you to use the same height as some other member who has a 45' XLII as close to my year as possible. Mine in an Preovost 2003 chassis. Thanks so much for putting this together in the hopes of keeping as many POG members alive as possible.


Miles & Laura Circo
2004 Country Coach 45' XLII D/S

[Jon Wehrenberg]

On my 45' XL the front dimension, floor to underside of body support point is 15" and the rear dimension from the floor to the underside of the body support point is 13 15/16".

These are with full bus air system pressure on the airbags and I think the heights are mechanically limited by the suspension linkage. I am sure there are variations from coach to coach and because of tire sizes and pressures.

Based on dimensions required for XLII coaches I think we can come up with a way to make the supports universal. I know we have some good thinkers out there so I'll throw out the first idea.

I think we can make the set two pairs, one pair 14.5 " and one pair 13.5". I will then see if we can include with each set eight shims cut to match the top of the stands and with 4 being around .100" thick, and 4 being around .150" thick. In this way you could fill the spaces if you desire with shims to compensate for uneven floors or variations in the shell. At the worst you might be supporting the coach 1/2" less than at maximum height.

If the XLII dimensions vary widely from the above we may require shell specific support heights but I don't think that will be an issue.

Any ideas or suggestions?

[Ray Davis]

Jon,

Do you know exactly where I should measure when looking at my bus tomorrow? I'm not sure if I have a manual or picture detailing where the supports should be placed (measured).

Suggestions would be helpful, otherwise, I'll meansure in multiple locations and try to detail with pictures.

Ray

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Ray, I can't be sure I would tell you the correct place. My support points are listed in the owner's manual. They are at the heavy steel structure immediately forward of the front wheels, and at the base of the vertical column just behind the tag wheels about in line with the mud flap.

On my old 87 there was also a point at the rear of the front axle subframe that was at the bottom of a vertical column member.

I am especially concerned about that being valid because as slides came along the structure of the coach has evolved to where the strength for support may no longer be like it was on the XL. I have zero clue on an H3.

[dreamchasers]

These look great! Count me in for a set. We are planning on attending the Tenn. Ralley and can pick them up their.

Thanks,

Hector

[gmcbuffalo]

Jon
I'll take a set of four for a 91XL and 315 x 22.5 tires. Jon any idea of what weight these will support?
GregM

[Toy Box]

Jon, please put me down for two complete sets. That way, I can have one down in Lauderdale and one out here in Durango. I think your price is too cheap to make it worth your while... let me know where to send the money. George

[rfoster]

Jon: Looks like you are employed again? congrats, that is a great idea and very generous of you to offer these to the group at such an attractive price.

[garyde]

Very nice design Jon. I would like a set as well. I will get some measurements this weekend.

[Jim_Scoggins]

Jon:
I will take a set:
40' XL
I can pick them up at the TN rally.

It will be 7 Jan before I can get the measurements. If that is too late I will bet on the come.
315 80R 22.5

Thanks you.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

I hope I haven't misled anybody. I reread the post and the price is for a single one. But let me assure everybody that at $120 plus some for whatever the freight will be per set they are real insurance against the bus falling.

BTW, the company sprays black, gray, and white routinely. Unless color is a big deal they can be any one of the three colors. They will be all alike no matter the color. If there is a strong concensus about color let me know and that is what it will be.

[dalej]

Jon,

Do you think that a posting on Prevost-Stuff might be a good idea for the stands? I can do it with a link to a photo if you want me to.

[Gary & Peggy Stevens]

Jon your Jack stand sets really turned out great. I can see why everyone is anxious to get a set of their own.

I guess it be a litte presumptuous of me to buy a set now, SINCE I DON'T HAVE A BUS YET? :( But I am still looking. :)

Gary S

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Dale,

Go ahead to see what happens. I think the guys that work on their coaches for the most part are here on POG, but we can see if there is interest. I think I will put the order in right after Christmas so use that as a cut-off date.

[Toy Box]

Price is still too cheap...Put me down for two complete sets...45xl white in color please unless you decide to go with red. George.

[rmboies]

The stands are pictured below. The intent is to find out who would like them, and what height the purchaser would like them. Dale uses a variation and perhaps he can make suggestions both to the configuration and dimensions.
.

Jon, Bob would like a set if you can show him where to use them under the coach. He has always been leary of anything you can't put up on his lift but obviously, the bus won't fit on the lift:D Please add him to your list along with an instruction manual:rolleyes:

[Orren Zook]

BTW, the company sprays black, gray, and white routinely. Unless color is a big deal they can be any one of the three colors. They will be all alike no matter the color. If there is a strong concensus about color let me know and that is what it will be.


What, spray paint?!?!?! - no powdercoat?

[Jon Wehrenberg]

It's definitely powder coat, but a spray application as opposed to fluidized bed or other application methods. And for what it is worth it is applied on the powder coating system previously used to powder coat Detroit Diesel Series 60 engine blocks.

[garyde]

How about chrome? I would have them done locally if they came un painted.

[hobobimmer]

What about a bright hunters orange to help us see them and remind us to remove them?

[rbeecher]

Jon,

I would like to have a set for a 2002 XLII 45

Thanks for doing this for all of us.

Richard Beecher
2002 Marathon XLII 45
1996 Vogue XL 40 for sale
08 Sliverado

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

It sure was nice to see so many "take" a "stand" on Jon's "posts".

In their "work" they have "risen" to the "common" cause of "elevating" their coaches to a "uniform height" in the work area.

POGites are bonding

:D:D:D

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Jim....when it comes to puns, Loc has us all beat. I won't even try to be a smart ass here because he has an unending supply.

[Just Plain Jeff]

I would be willing to take a stand on this issue, but don't have the meddle to do so. It would require the height of passion and raise the level of posting on this site to an even level. Furthermore, we need to have a steady and firm footing in our discussions.

That should support you in your efforts without raising the bar of dialogue on this forum too high.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Instead of trying to out pun the punster, should you not be splitting wood?

There is a family in ME freezing because of you.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Here is the tally as I understand it for stands.

Roger, Jim C, Peter VS (4 or 6), Brian E., Kim, Jim K., Ted De, Ray D. Miles, Hector, Greg, George C (2 sets), Gary D., Jim S, Bob 00, Rich B.

As of now it appears a set should be 14.5" for the front, and 13.5" for the rear with shims totalling .250" per stand to compensate for uneven floors or manufacturing variations in the shells. I am awaiting a concensus on XLII heights.

To Peter...I support my coach per the Prevost manual at the front and rear. They do not call for six supports.

Gary D, they can be supplied raw.

Greg, I don't know their capacity. They are of 3/16 wall 4 X 4 steel tubing. Peter, any idea? I think on my coach the rear supports will be carrying 17,000 pounds each.

to all...the colors will either be black, gray or white unless the company can time coating with a run of another preferred color. I posed the question to see if any color is possible. Special colors will be big bucks, so I suggest we see if there is a concensus on the three color choices, and meantime I will see if the company is running red or some other bright color such as yellow that this run can piggy back on.

To keep the costs down the run needs to be a single color.

[Just Plain Jeff]

On this Forum, we have danced around the topic of getting wood and campers for many weeks now. Not wanting to split hairs, a certain webmaster was indeed the recipient of a massive amount of wood, which has been noted in other posts and we have seen the results thereof.

Here is a stiff reply:

My role in that was to drop a 60-foot maple tree on his property to indeed supply his family with wood (as if they needed it) a year ago. It had been damaged in a storm and had to go.

To the dismay of the person mentioned and his family, I dropped the tree precisely at the mark over a year ago.

Since that moment, said wood has remained uncut, split or processed for firewood. In the heat of the moment, we often forget what was on our minds, but at my age, I do recall that I had sown enough seeds in fallow grounds to adequately provide for several seasons.

One guy can't do wood for another guy.

And Jon, considering the ram-shackle nature of your scattered piles of wood, you are hardly a person to criticize. I do indeed have photographic evidence, as you well know, that your wood is not in order. It is not labelled, categorized by species, size and dated as to the location of the tree-fall, date and time of splitting. This goes against the grain of proper wood maintenance.

For some time I have considered a thread called, "Getting Wood in Your Camper," but have resisted the impulse to do so. I will leave that to others, as their roots are deeply embedded, branching out into unknown areas and don't want to look like a sap.

Oh sure, criticize a guy for his wood.

You know what happens when that conversation begins. You wind up out on a limb.

(Did you really want me to go on?)

We don't want to have a thread hijacked here stemming from a misunderstanding?

[Jim_Scoggins]

Jon:
My druthers: A bright color would be great. However, any color you or group think comes up with is fine with me.

[Denny]

Jon,

Put me down for a set of four for a 1998 chassis XL 40; black is fine. Thanks.

[Jim_Scoggins]

I am wondering if some day the "Jon Stand" might one day become a highly desirable collectable.

Maybe they should be signed and certified:
Set 1 of 25,
Set 2 of 25,
etc

[Ray Davis]

Jon,

I'm hoping another XL2 (both 40 and 45) will chime in here with comparison measuremeans.

I attempted to raise the bus as much as possible, using level-low while bus was on high idle. My front didn't come up as much as expected (which may be part of my front loading problem. I might need Prevost to check this).

Anyway I took 3 measurements.

1. In front of the front tires, there is a support which comes at an angle from the center, towards the exterior side. This beam on my coach was up at around 13.25 inch.


2. In the back, there was no supports behind the wheels. Just in front of the drive wheels, I found an inner beam, which connected to a vertical support, and raised upwards to another beam which attached to the shocks etc.

Those measuremeans were:

inner lower support 10.25 inch
inner upper support 19 inch

So, these numbers are a long way from your 14in standard on the XL. Before committing to that, we really could use another XL2 measurement. In rereading your previous post, I see you mentioned "between" the drive and tag as a possible location. I'll try again.

Is there a better way to raise up the bus, other than using level-low with engine running?


Ray

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Ray,

Without an XLII owner's manual I can't say for sure where the support points will be, but I have no doubt that wherever they are they will NOT be between the drive and tag axles. Unless the XLII structure design is a substantial departure from the rivet coach the support points will be under vertical columns that are part of the axle subframes.

I cannot say this for sure because I do not know what affect the slides have had on the Prevost structure design, but generally the coach has a front axle subframe assembly and a rear axle sub frame assembly, and the trusses beneath the windows and above the wheel arches form the bridge on top of those assemblies to keep the bus from bending in the middle. On my bus the body support points are under the vertical portions of the axle subframes at each end of the bridge.

Who has an XLII manual that shows support points?

It is critical that the bus is supported in the correct place. Also, is there a difference when the coach has slides.

Ray, as far as raising the coach the best and only effective way apart from hydraulic jacks, is to set the level low system to raise the LH, RH and front. There may be a trick to this if your system is supplemented with the HWH, but if you have max air pressure to the air bags you have done all you can do unless you use jacks. A trick to get some weight off the front is to lift the tag when raising the front. Once the air dryer spits a time or two with only the front being lifted and the tag up, you have the max extension and pressure in the bags.

[Darl-Wilson]

Jon, with all the problems of a variety of heights on the coaches, would it add a great deal of cost to have these adjust? What would it add to have a simple insert with 2-4 holes drilled plus the pin? I don't think this would compromise the capacity of the stands and would certainly make them more appealing and universal for use in other applications. Thanks for your thoughtfulness! :)

Darl

[Ray Davis]

Jon,

The 10.25 measurement I mentioned was directly in front of the drive wheel. I'm pretty confident of that measurement, and I believe my back end was up pretty high (I could slide underneath at that point near the drive wheel).

The front measurement is probably good, although perhaps as you've suggested, I may have gotten a little more height by first dumping my tag. I will check that out.

It would be nice to get another set of XL2 measurements. I do have a Prevost manual, but had run out of time, and wasn't able to spend time going through it looking for jack points.


Ray

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Ray,

There is a good vertical column in front of the drive axle, but the radius rod attach point is there. It is my opinion that would work, but I would be reluctant to unless Prevost said it was OK. If you think about it you are cantilevering the entire rear of the bus off that point, and in addition to the weight now on the rear axles, you are adding some of what is on the front axle as well putting not only very large loads on the stands, but possibly stressing the upper structure of the bus due to the unsupported weight hanging beyond that point.

Darl,

I thought about a large adjustment screw. I think the strength would be compromized unless the adjustment screw and its corresponding nut were substantial and I think that would add more to the cost far beyond its value.

From a manufacturing point of view, if we need to have multiple sizes it is not a big deal because the only variable is the cutoff length of the 4 X 4 tube. All other parts are the same, and the operations to produce remain constant.

[Petervs]

Hi Jon,

Well, I played with my bus today ( 1994 Marathon XLV) to get some dimensions.

The front has 15 inches clear between the floor and the bottom of the frame member that has the tow hook welded on, this is just in front of the front wheels, but inboard a little bit. It is the only sensible place to put the stands in my opinion. So the 14.5 inch height you have posted should be fine.

The rear on mine must be different than what you have found. I measure a clear 18.5 inches between the floor and and the frame member that is the truss which mounts the shock absorbers and air bags. This is just in front of the drive wheels. I would need an 18 inch stand for this location.

I should dig out the book and see where Prevost recommends the supports be installed I suppose. Clearly 4 stands is sufficient.

Everything else under my coach has been sprayed with a foam insulating material, and many of the frame members are covered over, so it is hard to see where they are exactly.

As for paint, my vote is for a light color. It is dark enough under there already. I plan to pin stripe them and add neon. If they are black, I will smear some grease on Brian's stands when he is not looking.

As for the rated capacity, well, you have to first decide what the failure mode will be. If you expect them to crush or buckle as a column would under a high vertical load, well, that load would be more than the total weight of several busses on one stand. Actually, I got curious and worked it out. One stand would hold over 500,000 pounds! Jon will soon get the Most Overengineered Gizmo award.

It is more likely that they would fail by toppling over due to an uneven load applied. It is hard to set a rating for that.

Compared to the typical adjustable jack stands we are familiar with, those have the weakest point on the pin that holds them up to whatever height is chosen. That pin is loaded in double shear and it determines the rating of the stand, after applying some multiplier for a safety factor.

Jon, I hope this answers your questions, if not, let me know. If you have a better location in mind for the rear, please advise. Thanks for tackling this project.
Peter

[garyde]

Hello Jon. Here are my measurements; Front; 14.5", Back 12.5".
Front is support point behind front tire and in about 24 inches.
Back is behind tag and in about 24 inches.
There is another support point in front of front wheels by tow hooks; 15"
My Coach is a 2002 XLII Chasis.
Paint is ok.
These support points are shown in the Prevost manual.

[garyde]

[QUOTE=Ray Davis;21880]Jon,

The 10.25 measurement I mentioned was directly in front of the drive wheel. I'm pretty confident of that measurement, and I believe my back end was up pretty high (I could slide underneath at that point near the drive wheel).

The front measurement is probably good, although perhaps as you've suggested, I may have gotten a little more height by first dumping my tag. I will check that out.

It would be nice to get another set of XL2 measurements. I do have a Prevost manual, but had run out of time, and wasn't able to spend time going through it looking for jack points.

Hi Ray. In the Prevost manual, under the section regarding supports and Jacking, there should be two topics. One discusses supporting the Coach Chasis or body. The other describes jack points under the axles in the front & back. You should have a total of 12 support points, half for the chasis, the other half for axles.

[dalej]

It looks like everyone is coming in all over the place....lets remember that a frame is a frame so the supports need to be under the frame. I really think that one size will work on all the bus's, but that's my opinion. Mine will work with one size, but I don't like waiting for my front to raise all the way up so my front ones are a little shorter.

Check out how this 45 footer is supported, maybe you long guys need 6 supports. I lightened then to show detail but I think that the front two on the rear is just to support the axles.

[gmcbuffalo]

I must be measuring the axle supports because I get the same readings as Ray and I have a 91 XL.
GregM

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Dale, Thanks...the posts look good.

As to six supports....I don't feel comfortable there because these stands have no adjustment. In order for six to work the coach has to hit them all at the same time when it is lowered.

[dalej]

Your right Jon, I would not like to use 6, you would have to use shims to get it all to be level.

I think that the 14 inch stand will work for all. I can't imagine ordering a set 13.25 and a set 13.50, we'll you get the idea.

[Kevin Erion]

The picture of my bus on 6 stands is because I was supporting the suspension in the rear, not the frame. I wanted the little extra height the air bags gave when they where overinflated.
I did measure the bus with tires on and the level low system as high as possible yesterday. The front is from the ground up to the bottom of the tow hook plates, 11.5"
The rear is behind the tag axle just in front of the transmission, there is a cross bar that mount to the frame and runs from side to side, from the ground up to the bottom of that bar is 12.5"
This is a 2000 XLII 45' shell.
Kevin

[Ray Davis]

The rear is behind the tag axle just in front of the transmission

I'm going to have to re-check mine. There's been a couple of posts about "behind" the tag, yet I didn't find a good place behind my tag. It could be that the 40 ft is different in this regard.

Ray

[MangoMike]

Jon,

I'm in for 4. I'll have to measure the H3 to see if there's any difference in height.

Thanks for making this happen.

Now I can stop using these guys.


1962



Mike

[Orren Zook]

Jon,

I'm in for 4. I'll have to measure the H3 to see if there's any difference in height.

Thanks for making this happen. Now I can stop using these guys.

Mike


MM aren't those the prototypes that JPJ was constructing in the great white north? Probably why he was saving Skiffer's tree.....

[Petervs]

Here is a skeleton view of the bus shell I found on a Prevost site some time ago. Gives an idea of what we are lifting.

As for the handle on the side of Jon's design, I was thinking it should be placed near the bottom so you could reach under the bus with a long handle and pull the stands out without them tipping over.

My color preference would be gray first, white, black last.

[rbeecher]

I'm going to have to re-check mine. There's been a couple of posts about "behind" the tag, yet I didn't find a good place behind my tag. It could be that the 40 ft is different in this regard.

Ray

I'll check mine this weekend, I'm pretty sure I have a diagram in one of the manuals that came with the bus that are specific as to location of the lift points.

Richard Beecher
02 MARATHON XLII 45
96 Vogue XL 40 for sale

[Petervs]

Hello Jon,

Went back to the bus today to check the manual for the lifting points. Boy, what a poor explanation I found. There was only one small side view of the coach with an arrow pointing up just in front of the front wheel, and another arrow pointing up just behind the tag wheel. No specifics at all.

There was another similar picture showing where to jack each axle in case you want to swap a tire, 6 points in all there.

I also examined under my coach again, and noticed I made a serious error in my measurements the other day. In the rear, I measured a jack point on a truss connected to the axle assembly, this location remains fixed when raising and lowering the coach on the air bags. It would be a great spot to jack up the rear axle though.

So my dimension was wrong and I would have to join the rest of the group in whatever length you come up with, around 12 to 13 inches or whatever for the rear suports.

Thanks again for doing this fine service for the POG group.

[tdelorme]

OK, Jon, I was having a problem with the 13.5" rear measurement because I was checking the "jacking point" not the support point. In the front, they are the same. Not so in the rear. I have found the proper support point for the rear and 13.5" will work fine. The 14.5 for the fronts is good also. Actually, 13.75 & 14.75 would be better, but a fully loaded coach might present a problem. So, the 40' and 45' will be the same. Any color works for me.
Here is what screwed me up.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i174/tdelorme1/J1.jpg

[MangoMike]

Mel Torme,

Just so everyone is clear. The diagram represents the placement for raising the axles, not supporting the frame. I've made that mistake.

Mike

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Mike is correct Ted...

The stands are intended for supporting the shell. With the bus supported that way it can be stored with air in the suspension dumped like Dale does, It will allow you to work beneath it with no possiblility of the shell dropping down, and it still allows you to raise or lower the axles with much smaller jacks if you want to work on wheels or brakes or even air bags.

[BrianE]

Jon: The stands are intended for supporting the shell. With the bus supported that way it can be stored with air in the suspension dumped like Dale does, It will allow you to work beneath it with no possiblility of the shell dropping down, and it still allows you to raise or lower the axles with much smaller jacks if you want to work on wheels or brakes or even air bags.

Just to put the last nail in the coffin: tdelorme's Maintenance Manual page depicts the axle jacking points which MUST be used when jacking a wheel off the ground. The attached Maintenance Manual page is the previous page in the manual and it depicts the points under which Jon's new stands will be used after the bus has been raised to the full height of the leveling system.

[garyde]

Great illlustration Brian. That is much better than what is in my manual which just shows a elevation drawing ,side view, with arrows.

[gmcbuffalo]

This has actually been a good informative thread. All this time I have been running the bus up on ramps thinking I was safe. Even though the bus was high and would not bottom out on the floor it could still drop and give me a good knock'en. I have also been using the the rear axles support to hold the bus up. Bad again.

Thanks to whomever started this.

GregM

[Jon Wehrenberg]

This will probably help make more folks aware of relative risk.

Since I have a pit I can work on the bus whether it is up, down or at ride height. Theoretically I do not have to block the bus up in the air. If anyone ever watches a grease monkey at a truck stop you will never see him block a bus or truck when he lubes it. He has some degree of risk.

The risk of an air bag failing catastrophically is slim. But when my bus is going to get worked on from the underside, I raise it fully and support it under the body support points because sometimes I am putting my arms or body between pinch points such as between an axle and the underside of the body. I don't care how small the risk. I do not want to take a chance of getting crushed.

Greg is right about ramps providing space so the bus cannot crush you, but that only applies if you never put yourself or any part of your body between the underside of the shell and any suspension member such as an axle, subframe, radius rod, etc.

[jimshoen]

Jon,
I would like set for my 1997 Marathon XLV.
Jim Shoen
775-843-8656

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Here is the tally for stands as near as I can determine and the shell type I think each person has.

Roger F XL Jim C XL?
Peter VS XL Brian E XL
Kim S XLII Jim K XL
Ted D XL Ray D XLII
Miles C XLII Hector XL
Greg XL George XL (2 sets)
Gary D XLII Jim S XL
Bob 05 XLII Rich B XLII
Denny XL Mango H3
Jim Shoen XL

For simplicity sake I think the XL sets should be 14" for the front and 13" for the rear. For the XLII sets 14" for the front and 12" for the rear.

I am sure of the XL dimensions, but there have been several posted for the XLII. Someone please verify. The dimensions should be 1/2 to 1" less than the distance between the support point and the floor. This allows the coach to be raised and the stands placed under the support and then lowered to the stand.

Mango... Please provide dimensions for the H3, front and rear.

As suggested by Peter the handle will be such that a rod or hook can be used to place them and it will be down low to prevent tipping. I will ask for gray powder coated finish, and if anybody absolutely prefers white or black post it or let me know and if they can be run separate then they will.

I will ask for shim plates with each set so the bus can be supported at a higher level or the space between the support point and the top of the stand can be equalized if desired to minimize or avoid any body twist.

Tom has offered to lend his expertise for transportation so it is likely we can have some delivered to Sevierville, some to Pahrump or some other central point. I will pay for them out of my pocket, so when all costs (shipping and otherwise) are known, and prior to start of production I will post them and ask for money.

[rickdesilva]

Jon
If its not too late figure me in for a set......XL ll

[Jon Wehrenberg]

I've added Rick D for an XLII, and Eric F for an XL

[bluevost]

Hi Jon,

Please add me to the list. Thanks for your effort.

Ken

[Jon Wehrenberg]

You are added Ken...XL stands.

[MangoMike]

Jon,

Ill get down to the bus barn today after work and get you some dimensions.


Thanks

Mike

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Final prices are confirmed.

The price per set of four stands, will be $112. Those prices do not include shipping. Truk has been asked to wave his magic wand and see what our freight will cost and as soon as he has that I would appreciate if he would post it or let me know.

The handles will be low as requested by Peter, the color for now is expected to be gray, and each set will consist of 14" for the front, and 12" or 13 inch for the rear depending on your type coach. Mango, post the dimensions for an H3, and a set specific to an H3 will also be created.

Each set will also include shim plates to either even out the space between the coach and the top of the supports so the body of the coach doesn't twist, or to keep the coach supported at the maximum height. The weight of the supports is around 18# each, 72# for a set.

If anybody wants to opt out, let me know, if anybody else wants a set let me know, and expect them to be available at Sevierville or Pahrump. Other locations will require some special arrangements. One anonymous member who is pissing me off because he is diving and flying almost every day in the Bahamas may arrange to get his by meeting me somewhere in between.

Maybe he will post here and introduce himself and tell us about his coach.

I will pay for these and would like to be paid in advance or upon delivery. If you choose the former our mailing address is on Dales Map via the quick links button above.

[dalej]

Jon, I think this all will work out good for the heights. I measured mine back on the other thread and posted 14 for the back and 12 for the front. If everyone wants to move them around they will have a choice. I think the 13 inch will work good too.

As for that member in the Caymen islands, we need to hear more out of him. I would like to see photos too!

[Jon Wehrenberg]

On Monday I will send the final counts and dimensions for production.

Just so everybody is clear and XL set will be 14" for front, and 13" for the rear stands.

The XLII sets will consist of 14" for the front and 12" for the rear.

Mango has the lone H3 and he is confirming his dimensions. If anybody wants any dimensions other than the ones above let me know.

Freight has been calculated at $250 to get them to me, and I will get them to Sevierville and Pahrump. If somebody cannot get to to either rally, or cannot arrange for a friend to pick them up at either rally lets see if special arrangements can be made.

The stated price of $112 per set still holds, with the cost of freight to the rallies at about $12.00 for a total of $124 at the rally. I think some folks may want to go to the factory in Jamestown NY, get a tour and pick up the stands so obviously no freight charges there, but with the price of fuel it makes picking the supports up at the rally pretty cheap. But then you miss the factory tour and meeting my daughter who is good enough to sell these at cost.

[Jerry Winchester]

Jon,

I'll take a set for the XL2. Thanks for taking on this project. Mike will make sure there is some extra jerked chicken for you at the rally.

JDUB

[Jon Wehrenberg]

You are in. Anybody else?

[gmcbuffalo]

Jon
I am still in, will just have to arrange pick up.
GregM

[nrhareiner]

Hello Jon,

Please make sure that mine are for XLII

Thank you

[Jon Wehrenberg]

For all....I will recap the order, including the type coach, where I think they will be picked up (Sevierville, Pahrump, or otherwise) and the dimensions. I am putting the list together now, and it will be what I release for production.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Roger F XL
Jim C XLII
Peter VS XL
Brian E XL
Kim S XLII
Jim K XL
Ted D XL
Ray D XLII
Miles C XLII
Hector XL
Greg XL
George XL (2 sets)
Gary D XLII
Jim S XL
Bob 05 XLII
Rich B XLII
Denny XL
Mango H3 special height 9.5” and 11.5”
Jim Shoen XL
JDUB XLII
Jim Blu XL

Please verify I have the right coach associated with your names. I will release this to production based on the list above. Distribution will be at the April and May rallies. $124 per set.

An XL set is 2 14" and 2 13" stands. An XLII set is 2 14" and 2 12" stands.
Color will likely be gray, but if black or white is desired let me know. No promises, but if we can get them on the line when those colors are running we will because they are common colors.

[truk4u]

Jon, you forgot me!

[rickdesilva]

Jon, you forgot me too.....could Rich B be Rick D?

[Jerry Winchester]

Krakman,

I don't think he forgot you. He just thought you had an inflatable doll that doubled as a safety device and this would be redundant. Eh?

Bite Me.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Roger F XL
Jim C XLII
Peter VS XL
Brian E XL
Kim S XLII
Jim K XL
Ted D XL
Ray D XLII
Miles C XLII
Hector XL
Greg XL
George XL (2 sets)
Gary D XLII
Jim S XL
Bob 05 XLII
Rich B XLII
Denny XL
Mango H3 special height 9.5” and 11.5”
Jim Shoen XL
JDUB XLII
Jim Blu XL
Rick D XLII
Truk XL

Added Rick and Truk. My error. Anyone else, or any questions about heights?

Anyone with an XL thinking of changing to an XLII I suggest changing the type from 2 14" and 2 13" to 2 14" and 2 12".

For those not contemplating a change, but who hit the lottery, it is easy to cut down the height and reweld, but not as easy as starting out with the shorter rears.

[bluevost]

Jon,

Don't see me on the list. Did I tell you lately how much I love Hummers!!

Thanks,

Ken

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Ken,

Here is the new list, and you are on it even if you still like Jeeps better than Hummers.

Roger F XL
Jim C XLII
Peter VS XL
Brian E XL
Kim S XLII
Jim K XL
Ted D XL
Ray D XLII
Miles C XLII
Hector XL
Greg XL
George XL (2 sets)
Gary D XLII
Jim S XL
Bob 05 XLII
Rich B XLII
Denny XL
Mango H3 special height 9.5” and 11.5”
Jim Shoen XL
JDUB XLII
Jim Blu XL
Rick D XLII
Truk XL
Ken Z XL

[ajhaig]

Jon,

Please add me to the list for a set.

1991 XL.

Thanks.

AJ

[Loc]

Jon,

I will pass for now. I am planning on using the Tom Sawyer approach to use Huck Winchesters' stands when needed.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

JDUB's will work. In fact if you work it right you may be able to let him borrow them on occasion.

[rickdesilva]

Jon
It must be the Italian in me but I want to be sure I send the correct amount of money. Is $124 the cost of 4 stands or is one set 2 for the front and another set 2 for the rear for a total of $248. Thanks

[Jon Wehrenberg]

There is no upper limit to what I will accept. However, the cost of a full set of stands consisting of two for the front and two for the rear for a total of four pieces, delivered to the Sevierville Rally or the Pahrump Rally will be $124.

If anybody finds they have too much money I will be very happy to take the excess off your hands.

[Jerry Winchester]

Jon,

That is a very reasonable price and I'll be headed over to the Fish Bowl (Loc's palatial office in the AIG exec suite) to wring the necessary cash from his fat Beagle hands, so he can use them whenever he wants.

The only reason he wants to use them is so he can install the Naked Lady mud flaps on his Millennium.

2055

[Troy Stone]

Jon,

A little late here but put me down for a set. I am going to need the shipped to my home address as due to some job changes I will not be making any rallys this year...

Unless your looking for somewhere to fly to.. email address below.

Thanks,

Troy Stone
troy_stone@ahm.honda.com

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Troy,

You are on the list. When they are done I will email you to see how to best get them to you.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

The supports / stands are finished and are in transit to Knoxville. I expect to have them by Thursday.

Anybody that is heading past Knoxville should feel free to let me know and I can set something up so we can get together. Otherwise I will distribute them to anyone who ordered them that is coming to Sevierville, and for those coming to Pahrump I intend to bring the remaining ones with me to that rally.

The price per set is $124, and as soon as I get the invoice for them I will pay it so if you feel sorry for me you can send a check. The address is on Dale's map which can be found under the quick links button above. Otherwise it will be COD at the rally.

I will post pictures of a set under my coach as soon as I get my hands on them.

[Petervs]

Hi Jon,
Hey, do you have a paypal account? We could just pay you instantly that way if you do.

Otherwise, I will be mailing you a check.

Peter

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Peter,

No Paypal account. If mailing a check is not convenient pay at the rally, or if Brian is picking yours up in Sevierville make him pay me for yours. He's got it.

[Gary & Peggy Stevens]

Jon, will you have any extra XLII Stands at the POG V Rally, or are they all spoken for? ;)

Just Checkin. :D

Gary S.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Gary,

I won't know until the rally. When I get the stands I will inventory them and if there are extras (doubtful) I will let you know.

XLII? Anything you want to share with us?

[Gary & Peggy Stevens]

Gary,

XLII? Anything you want to share with us?

Why NO, Jon, I don't have anything to share at the moment. :D Nice catch tho.

Gary S

[Ray Davis]

Yeah, right. Gary is gonna probably show up in TN in April with a bright and shiny XL2!! :rolleyes:

[Gary & Peggy Stevens]

Yeah, right. Gary is gonna probably show up in TN in April with a bright and shiny XL2!! :rolleyes:

Why Ray, what ever do you mean ? :confused: I don't even have a place to store such a big thing. :o

Gary S.

[dalej]

Gary.....we are friends, friends don't treat friends this way! Tell the truth even if the deal isn't done. :)

[Gary & Peggy Stevens]

Gary.....we are friends, friends don't treat friends this way! Tell the truth even if the deal isn't done. :)

Dale, I thought the saying was "Friends don't let Friends drive "PLASTIC"? :D Besides it is BAD Luck to spill the beans, before they are cooked. or something like that. :(

Stay tuned, more to follow in the up coming weeks. ;)

Gary S.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Weeks?????????

OK, Gary, listen up. If you are in the final stages of buying a coach, good for you. But don't be one of those dudes that goes through weeks of gyrations to close the deal, and in all that time does not spend days going through the coach to learn it and find any problems before you turn the key.

All we want to hear about is how happy you are, not questions about how to turn on the framistan.

[Gary & Peggy Stevens]

Weeks?????????

OK, Gary, listen up. If you are in the final stages of buying a coach, good for you. But don't be one of those dudes that goes through weeks of gyrations to close the deal, and in all that time does not spend days going through the coach to learn it and find any problems before you turn the key.

All we want to hear about is how happy you are, not questions about how to turn on the framistan.

Ok Jon, I'll bite " What is a framistan ?" :confused:

Besides since it has been over a year and a half that you guys have been putting up with me so far, and NOT being a bus owner, I figure what is a few more weeks? Also it is (-10 ) degrees where we need to go and that is too damn cold, even if the bus does have heated Granite floors,in the galley and bath. (whoops I slipped a little. :o )

And by the way Jon, Peg and I are not happy we are ECSTATIC.



Gary S

[Jon Wehrenberg]

When you do you pre-purchase inspection you will learn about the framistan.

Go look at when it is -10. If it ain't leaning at that temperature it ain't never going to lean.

[dalej]

Gary, we are happy for you but you had better give us something to chew on!

[Gary & Peggy Stevens]

Gary, we are happy for you but you had better give us something to chew on!

Would the picture of a possible storage facility suffice, Dale? :D I don't even have a picture of that yet, but I am working on it.

You guys can't be more anxious than me, CAN YOU ? :confused::)

Gary S.

[Ray Davis]

ok, did your signature just change to "found it" or am I dreaming?

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Notice how cleverly this group squeezed the truth out of Gary.

They ought to let us at the Taliban. We don't even need to use the water board.

[truk4u]

Gary,

Framistan is an upgraded Framulator. Don't feel bad, Peter hasen't even figured that one out yet.;)

[rmboies]

Gary,

Framistan is an upgraded Framulator. Don't feel bad, Peter hasen't even figured that one out yet.;)

Gary,

in order to find out what a Framistan is it is imperative that you have a SDR first.....everyone in POG knows that :D

[Gary & Peggy Stevens]

Gary,

in order to find out what a Framistan is it is imperative that you have a SDR first.....everyone in POG knows that :D

Not Everyone in POG KNOWS it ! Oh Boy, am I in Trouble or What ? :confused:

Not only do I NOT know what a framistan is, but I can't for the life of me figure out what SDR means.

Yes Ray I just changed my signature line, but NO More information than that for awhile, No matter how much pressure you guys put on me. :p

[Ray Davis]

So Gary, since you're like in the middle of the country, smack dab between Pahrump and Seiverville rallies. Which one are you going to make your debut? :D

[garyde]

Hi Gary. Way to go! Please post pictures. Now the fun begins.

[Gary & Peggy Stevens]

So Gary, since you're like in the middle of the country, smack dab between Pahrump and Seiverville rallies. Which one are you going to make your debut? :D

Since we still haven't gotten the BUS yet, I kind of hate to keep second guessing what we are going to do, BUT since you asked Ray, our plans are to attend the Seiverville Rally, thanks for asking. :)

Gary D, I will post pictures but after we actually take delivery. I have BEFORE pictures, ( you know the pictures of someone else's bus, BEFORE we own it ) but I will feel better about posting current pictures, when we get her home. Hoping for the first of March.

Gary S.

[Joe Cannarozzi]

Gary the grinning has already begun, we can sense it all the way up here:)

[truk4u]

Gary & Peggy,

OK, but does it have rivets?:p

[Ray Davis]

Tom,

Remember, he asked about XL2 stands!!!

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Here's the real deal....they look good and so far the bus hasn't collapsed any.

[dalej]

They look GREAT Jon, I only wished I could afford a set. ;)

[Jon Wehrenberg]

A set is only 125 miles worth of diesel fuel. Or a few nights of generator running in a truck stop.

[rfoster]

I was able to pickup my new Jack Stands from the A1 Jon's Casa De Grease Pit in Knoxville this past Friday and promptly slid them under the bus Friday Night. (See Photo- they are great)
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g31/parkwayautoofbristol/CIMG3532.jpg

But I checked on them tonight and they appear to have taken on the stainless finish - imagine that. Best Jack Stands I ever bought!!
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g31/parkwayautoofbristol/CIMG3536.jpg

Thanks for another great tool for the bus!:cool:

[gmcbuffalo]

Whoa
Those babies shine brigther than LED's. Bling DAD Bling
GregM

[jimshoen]

I see that Dale says 'front first'.
Can you clarify the correct procedure to install the stands and remove the stands.
When raising the bus is it best to dump tag axle, inflate front air bags, install front stands then do the rear?
When lowering the bus is it the reverse?

[JIM KELLER]

I see that Dale says 'front first'.
Can you clarify the correct procedure to install the stands and remove the stands.
When raising the bus is it best to dump tag axle, inflate front air bags, install front stands then do the rear?
When lowering the bus is it the reverse?

Hope we have a Jack Stand class in Tn. Correction, Bus Support Stand Class.

[dalej]

Rule of thumb...front in first going in, front out last going out.

The back is the easiest to raise since it has 6 air springs. You don't want to work against the weight of the bus when its on the back stands.

[m stuller]

Hey Jon: I too would love to get a set of six for my Liberty XL2. i am planning to do a oil change tomorrow and can get exact height however i am sure the same height others are useing for thier XL2 will work fine. More than happy to send a check and pre-pay, and if poissble i would like mine shipped to me:

Matthew Stuller
1213 Terrace Hwy
Broussard LA 70518

337-394-5432

Thanks much, these will be much nicer than blocking them with wood.


Matt Stuller

[Gary Carmichael]

Jon, Does mango"s measurements fit All H3, Can these jacks be used for keeping the coach up during long stays as in Fla in winter for 2=3 months. Say have coach in ride highth then slip jacks into place and let coach settle on them. When ready to move start coach go to ride highth pull out stands ? If so when ever another run is done I will take a set.

[Garynmike]

Are these still being offered?

[Gil_J]

You can find adjustable stands rated for 20+ tons at Northern Tools and similar places for about $150/pair or so. I have a set and they are heavy duty and not restricted to a single height.

[Garynmike]

Gil, are you referring to the Esco 20-ton screw jack stand #10802 for $209? A pair of these under the rear and the front would be safe to allow me to work on the airbags and shocks?

[Gil_J]

That style will work. Mine are like these:
https://www.zoro.com/sunex-tools-pin-type-jack-stands-22-tons-pk2-1522/i/G2313670/?gclid=CjwKCAjwp7baBRBIEiwAPtjwxCXi25RjR_AwtjzX9Lr AfpN_40EQgi_Anz3FceDv_jxyahQrxoXz3xoCqEIQAvD_BwE

[PrevostNewbie]

OK I am ready to look under the bus, I was wondering if these are the correct body points to put my support stands. I have 4 of the 22 ton red and blacks from Amazon.

Front:
http://forum.prevostownersgroup.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16910&stc=1
Rear:
http://forum.prevostownersgroup.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16911&stc=1

[PrevostNewbie]

Here is the dimension of the rear, i was concerned about raising the bus up above ride height, not sure if it worked or how high i could go. I could raise the front and both sides but not the drive direction.
http://forum.prevostownersgroup.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16914&stc=1

[Opabol]

Hi Jon, I just found this posting. Are these stands still available? I have a 1990 XL40

[Gil_J]

Any steel fabrication or welding shop should be able to make what you want for not much money. The jack points should be illustrated in the service manual.