Big Deal Prevost Car 08 Rally?

[Just Plain Jeff]

In the spirit of providing behind-the-scenes and events on the forefront. Here is what is going on.

We have been in touch with Prevost Car. The following is provided without any editorial commentary on my part (hopefully).

Prevost Car is now recognizing that POG, along with Bus n Bikers and other groups represent the spectrum of Prevost owners. They want to juice up new shell sales. They are discussing, with some converters, a Prevost Car-sponsored rally commemorating the 400th founding of Quebec, July 7-11 next summer at Quebec City. They have a committee established with a hired rally-master. Unlike previous rallies, Prevost would be in charge of the registration, fees, program and so on. There would be only one evening when individual clubs would have their own time together. The rest of the event would be controlled by Prevost.

Prevost is insistent that the rally fee for this event would be $1000-1500 per coach. At this juncture, there is no schedule on the boards, except that there would be a dinner at some point bringing all the clubs together.

Unlike some of the other groups, POG operates differently. There is no 'President' or organizational structure. So, decisions are made by each of you as to interest level, involvement level and so on.

It is quickly coming to the point where we have to begin to respond to their proposals in some fashion so it's time to post your ideas based on the information which I have just provided.

I'll check in from time to time and answer questions if I can as more information becomes available. As noted, I have my own thoughts about this but have decided to (for once) to keep my mouth shut and fingers from babbling on, since your thoughts may be far different than mine.

So here is your chance to comment freely about the intentions of such a rally in order for us to better communicate with the shell-builder.

Thanks so much.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Count me out.

I prefer to not spend my money for a sales pitch. I have attended the Liberty rallies (which are the same thing) to learn my coach and if necessary get some Liberty specific repairs, but they are way less than that in price, and they speak English.

[dale farley]

I agree with Jon. It sounds to me like Prevost Car is targeting the "Other" group that don't mine shelling out $1500 for the priviledge of saying they are proud they attended this expensive rally.

[MangoMike]

I gotta wax the bus that week.

Although at some time I would like to tour the factory and find the guy who scribed Pierre Lives on the tag axle.

mm

[Just Plain Jeff]

One of the 'other' groups has already said they didn't want to be a part of it.

Ahem.

[garyde]

Does $1500.00 include the plane tickets?

[truk4u]

We are the customers, shouldn't be any fee. I went to the Prevost dinner two years ago in Charlotte and the whole gala event was free! I would like to tour the facility though....

[Ray Davis]

It's a little unfortunate that POG is finally getting recognized as a valid Prevost "group" (for lack of a better term), and our first thought is to blow them off.

I agree that it's pricey, and I'm in no position to go (I have used every bit of my last two years vacations going to POG rallies!!), but something inside me says we need to perhaps pay some attention to this.

It seems that this may be a place where POG can start to be recognized somewhat.

I don't know what the right answer is, but totally blowing them off like this feels wrong.


Ray

[Jerry Winchester]

I guess I wouldn't mind a trip to Canada, eh and I don't mind flying the POG flag a little, but what does that price cover? It may be perfectly reasonable, but I would need some more information.

As for a sales issue, if we shun this type activity, then do we need to puke up the food we at our own rally that was bought by various vendors or suppliers?

I have to think we could arrange for some off the chart technical sessions with all the Prevost brain trust at our disposal, so I don't dismiss that so quickly either.

And I think that we can challenge the other Prevost numbnuts to a Mentos and Diet Coke extravaganza as to prove out technical superiority.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

It is not the money that irritates me as much as the fact that POG has been treated like an ugly stepchild.

By everybody.

It is almost like someone that wants to have a little better understanding of their coach isn't real Prevost material.

The pilots on this forum will understand that certain things like planes and Prevosts are the types of things that do require an understanding. Sure you can get in one, turn the key and drive away, but that is not the smartest thing to do. Until POG, and after the PP morphed into a group that compared balance sheets there was a void. All of a sudden we are good enough now that we are filling a void?

I think we will gain respect from Prevost, respect we have from some very good converters and suppliers, but I would rather see Prevost come to us. A factory tour is definitely a worthwhile experience for those that have not seen it.

[MangoMike]

I don't think Prevost gets it. They need to look outside the gilded box.

All they really have to do to win the hearts of MOST of the POGgers is to have us up for a little BBQ, a tour and a bunch of technical Howtos and we'd be like a bunch of loyal puppy dogs yappin' in the breeze about those good guys in Canada.

We don't need the big white tent treatment with the Ice Capades.

mm

[Ray Davis]

It is not the money that irritates me as much as the fact that POG has been treated like an ugly stepchild.

I realize I'm a bit naive here, but how have we been treated as a step child? If anything, we're such a new organization. I just checked, and the first POG posting here was 12/28/05. That's less than two years ago.

It's certainly possible that it's taken a couple of years for POG to gain enough credibility as an organization that's going to be around for awhile?

I've never met anyone from the PP's, so I can't say at all how they feel about our group. Everyone I've ever mentioned it too has been positive towards it, but that is pretty limited contact with Prevo owners outside our group.

Ray

[Darl-Wilson]

I agree with Jon and Jerry. To paraphrase an old saying, "Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance." I would like to see what is offered for our money before turning up my nose at the idea. Also, as a pilot and a bus owner I want to know about the mechanical side of my vehicle. If you have ever had an in-flight fire as a result of a mechanic making a mistake on the annual inspection of a single engine aircraft you would want to know everything that makes these damn things tick. That is one of the reasons I am a POG member; to pick the brains of the wonderful people in this group. (mostly Jon) Another reason is the sharing nature of the members, be it wine, margaritas, or great ideas. As for Prevost's plan, I think they need to solicit ideas for their rally rather than dictate what they want and what they expect from us and the other groups.

Another benefit to us might be learning about the other Prevost groups and how they operate. In summary, I believe we need to keep our minds open. Like a parachute, they operate better that way.

[garyde]

Hows about an advance team to check this out and report back. I think the $$ set everyone off . I sat down with two Prevost guys at dinner @ Beaudry in Tucson as well as at POG lll. They were informative and we had a good time.
We drive Prevosts , we buy Prevosts, we work on Prevosts, we obsess on our Prevosts, so whats wrong with going to a Prevost function?

[Jon Wehrenberg]

This is hearsay, but it is my understanding that Prevost cast their lot with the Prevost Proud. I have no knowledge of the Prouds nor how they function today, but I was a member when the rallies were like what Mango described. They were a bunch of folks that loved the Prevost for its superiority as a motorhome and Prevost treated us very well as sponsors of dinners, very good technical sessions, and they provided brand new coaches to transport us to various venues.

At the time Tom Harbison and Bill Campbell owned Prevost and they had conversions just like we did. They were one of us.

Then the Prouds experienced a rapid growth spurt and the newcomers outnumbered the originals and the shift in the focus was dramatic. It was all about whose coach was newer or bigger or had more glitz and it was a contest of BS artists. There was little interest in the technical sessions and they turned into sales pitches extolling the virtues of the newest shells. That's the history as Di and I saw it. Other people may have a different point of view.

Prevost hung with the Prouds and participated financially in the Proud events. When POG started it made no effort to participate, including doing something as simple as having someone assigned to the two forums to answer technical questions. I cannot imagine a better thing than to have Prevost and the converters actively participate in the forums. They could get a sense of the concerns and issues of their customers for the price of a membership. And I think we would benefit greatly with their participation. We've proven we can do a pretty good rally without them.

[dalej]

Just looking at it from my perspective, If I were Prevost I wouldn't want me. I'm a do it your selfer, it will be done right, kind of guy. I don't put much food on Prevosts table. I bought my coach used, joined POG so I could learn to do much of the upkeep myself. So why would Prevost want me?

In the Harley owners group, after you buy your first new bike, you get a one year free membership in HOG, then thats it, you pay to play after that.

I really think they are just looking at numbers and where there next meal is coming from.

[MangoMike]

Dale,

I WANT YOU!

Just kidding.

I think if Prevost is smart they will look at the big, long term picture. You and I will never buy a new Prevost. But like Mac owners, were Evangelist about the product. Our increasing knowledge about these great vehicles may well flow onto someone who could afford a new one and voila a new sale for Prevost.


It sort of the watch the pennies and the dollars will take care of themselves approach.

This group is gaining momentum like a train down a 6% grade and Prevost, if they're smart, should jump on board.

mm

[merle&louise]

Just looking at it from my perspective, If I were Prevost I wouldn't want me. I'm a do it your selfer, it will be done right, kind of guy. I don't put much food on Prevosts table. I bought my coach used, joined POG so I could learn to do much of the upkeep myself. So why would Prevost want me?

In the Harley owners group, after you buy your first new bike, you get a one year free membership in HOG, then thats it, you pay to play after that.

I really think they are just looking at numbers and where there next meal is coming from.

Dale,

Prevost should want you because if you don't buy the used Prevost - How is the seller going to buy a NEW one? The secondary market is tantamount to the new market!:D

[dalej]

I forgot say...

I wouldn't go to the Prevost rally for a get together in 08, not because I wouldn't want to see the factory, but I have a feeling that it would be a huge group of people that have millions of dollars and know it. Just the price of admission told me that. I like hanging with people that have millions of Lewbucks and don't know it. ;)

[Just Plain Jeff]

At this point, as originally noted, we don't have a lot of information about the rally. Apparently Prevost Car, however, is holding hard to several issues:

1. The rally would be registered, held and be the responsibility of PCC.

2. The admission fee will not be less than $1000.00US

3. No schedule of events has been determined at this point.

4. The idea is to in fact include POG as a major group in the event. (They came to us).

5. The original concept was to have every group have their own rally with a final Prevost dinner event on the last night. That has been flipped around; with PCC in charge of everything except one evening (as I understand it) left for the individual groups to do their own thing.

Trying to stay neutral in this...the dates are right after the Fourth of July weekend here in the U.S.

Please understand that this posting may have been premature, but since POG is all about finding out about things ahead of time if possible and being the 'insider group,' we have to deal with raw information as it becomes available, hence this thread.

Hope this helps.

[dalej]

Jeff, I as others will get invites from Prevost and Country Coach so what is the plan? I'm sure the converters would like all their coachs in with them.

We are not trying to seperate ourselfs from our converters are we.

[Jerry Winchester]

I guess I am back to the "we don't have enough information to decide" mode. Or at least I am in that mode. I agree with Dale that I am not a very profitable customer to Prevost and the secondary market only helps them in a limited manner. If I wanted to sell new coaches, I don't think I would target our group either, but there is some validity to us owning a lot of their stuff and being quazi ambassadors to their business.

Yep $1000 is a lot of cash. But what do we get? We don't know, so I can't say if that is a good deal or not. And I am really not concerned with who else will be there. I don't intend to get into a net worth pissing contest with some PP dude, so if my buddies are there, then so much the better. The only PP guy I know is MangoMike, so that doesn't help their cause, but I am open to new ideas.

As the POG, I don't see that we have a lot in common with the SOB guys and I am sure they view us with the same eye that some view the other Prevost groups. While we don't limit the group to only Prevost owners, I am not sure I would care to have a seminar at one of our rallys about how the flush-o-matic on the PlastiKrakster works or the inner workings of the propane fridge as they have no bearing on our coaches with the end result being I am sure they think we are quit the snobbish lot. So I would hope we could be a little objective, but it would appear the lines are forming up.

[hhoppe]

Gees! JDUB Truk actually was going to give a talk on exactly those same two subjects. He is still our friend and we should make some allowance toward plastic for that reason. You and the Mang have been pretty rough on him.

Dale: Regarding your reference to CC and the Prevost Rally. Liberty has sent all of us owners of Liberty's a pre-paid invitation to the event. Now that's class. If you other Liberty owners have not received yours contact Dave Wall at Liberty. dave.wall@libertycoach.com and don't hold your breath.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Harry's back and he is on top of his game. He just killed several birds with one stone, and at the end of the day there will still be some on this site that won't get it.

BTW Harry, I did what you said and I did get a response.:D

[rmboies]

Gees!Dale: Regarding your reference to CC and the Prevost Rally. Liberty has sent all of us owners of Liberty's a pre-paid invitation to the event. Now that's class. If you other Liberty owners have not received yours contact Dave Wall at Liberty. dave.wall@libertycoach.com and don't hold your breath.

Does this mean I need to email Nelson at Millennium??:D

Looking back, two years ago who would have thought that POG would be facing the dilemma of being recognized by Prevost Car and searching for an appropriate response to their impending invitation? Hard to believe we only had 11 couples or so at POGI !!

I have spoken several times with Steve Mitchell at Parliament and he has indicated to me that POG is definitely on the map where the convertors are concerned. Nice to hear that......

Debi and Bob-03/00

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Deb,

Do we really care if we are recognized by Prevost Car? I think it would be nice if they would step forward and offer us advice on service and maintenance, maybe offer POG members trade discounts on parts and service, and even participate on our forums, but look at what we have done in a short time, especially with respect to the knowledge we have gained.

I bet I am not far off when I say this group literally possesses the talent and ability to take a bus apart and put it back together. We have a lot of very smart folks here and I think the strength of POG is we share it with anybody that asks.

The best part is we all have a lot of new friends with common interests.

[MangoMike]

"Build it and they will come"...

[hhoppe]

Jdub not to worry, if the sun in Branson starts to melt the glue holding the dues's panels on, I will bring my Whitney punch and several dozen SS rivets to put it back together again. I think they use glue or some other plastic derivitive to hold them on. A guy has to be prepared for all eventiality's.
A little jealousy poping out here on my part. You have aquired a beautiful coach.

[rmboies]

Deb,
Do we really care if we are recognized by Prevost Car? .........The best part is we all have a lot of new friends with common interests.

Jon, I can't say that I particularly "care" but they have approached us and there will likely be a day when POG as a group will need to reply. Maybe we should wait and see if/what they may have to offer us? The opinion that Prevost has of me personally will never effect my life, that much I know for sure:p

I agree, new friends with common interests and a collective group of knowledge is priceless.

[Just Plain Jeff]

I don't want to get too far afield here, but the question has come up about the relationship between 'customers' (that would be y'all) and the converters v. Prevost.

Prevost considers anyone who owns one of their shells as a 'customer' yet it is the converters who are risking their capital and livelihood in buying a Prevost shell as a component and you can bet their point of view is that if you own an XYZ coach, that you are considered to be their customer.

This is a tricky area as some work, for any converter, has to be done by Prevost, yet Prevost is trying now to broaden their service into converted areas, such as awnings, appliances and so on.

Not all the converters have signed onto the Quebec 08 deal, as it is still in the formative stages, as I hoped I had mentioned clearly so far in this thread.

We won't know what the program is until it has been decided and I think we have some input on that. So far, a consistent theme has been a factory tour. Any other ideas? The more specific your commentary is, the better handle we have in getting back with them.

Please be mindful that the rally would be the days right after the Fourth of July as currently planned.

Thanks all. Let's keep the good thoughts coming in.

[garyde]

I see no down side to this, other than we are getting to be a larger group and people are acknowledging the fact. Here 's the thing, although I do not own a new Coach and many POG members do not, this does not preclude an individual who buys a new Prevost in joing POG. We are a welcoming bunch. So, who's to say POG will not be the dominant organization in the future. Prevost Corp. is not synonomous with Prevost Prouds.
Finally, I'm sure there are many fine people who belong to PP.

[Just Plain Jeff]

Good point here.

Over the years, we have had many conversations with Prevost Car about support of non-new conversions. It has been my contention that they ought to promote the brand while still pushing new shells.

Here's why: There have been many folks who have bought new and after a few years want to buy another new coach. When they find out the difference between the value of their current coach and a new one (considering the increases in shell costs + conversion), they find that they are having to pay out (shell out?) $700-900K for a new coach.

OUCH!

My thinking is that if Prevost could find a way to learn how to market the brand while pushing the existing new shell market, it would enhance the value of very useful preowned coaches and make it easier for existing coach owners to either trade up or not take the depreciation hits that so many take.

So you are exactly right, but Prevost doesn't seem to see the broader picture. Or, if they do, they can't seem to get it quite right from an American marketing point of view.

I might add that Prevost is a smaller company than many of us realize. It's a 1600 employee firm. Most of the manufacturing people are related to the people who used to work there in the past and is deeply embedded in the French-Canadian culture, so it is hard for the headquarters people to understand the American marketplace. The Quebec rally is an example. In all the posts here, we've talked about 'our bus' and no one seems to care much about the 400th Anniversary of the founding of Quebec. They think that's the big deal and we care about our coaches.

Can you see the differences in thinking?

Sorry for the long wandering dissertation Mike, but, well, y'know....

[hhoppe]

Regarding Prevost: Two years ago we attended a FMCA rally in Redmond OR. The rally had numerous converters there displaying their wares. Prevost was there with a new shell. When the Prevost crew found out we were there in our old prevost we were invited to a dinner they were sponsoring off site and we were given nice lanyards for our rally passes that said Prevost in large letters on them. We did not attend because we were with friends at the rally. Besides we did not bring a tux and evening gown to compete with the PP's at the dinner. Point is the Prevost people were genuinly happy to see us there and we received an invitation via mail this year from Prevost to attend their dinner at this years FMCA rally in Redmond. They are OK people.

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

JPJ, what exactly do you mean when you say you must reply to Prevost soon?

What are they looking for? A mailing list of all the POG members?:eek:

Some sort of commitment from the POG organization?

If they want a mailing list to send engraved invitations, well I guess you have the answer to that. NOT. There are over two hundred members and only 18 have chosen to have their contact information posted on this confidential site. If you give Prevo that information there is no end to who might get it or how it might be used.

I don't see what would be wrong with accepting an invitation on behalf of POG and posting it for any and all to decide to accept or not.

Of all the members very few have anything to say about anything period, let alone to try to decide on going as a group for a rally in a foreign country a year in advance and right around our own July,4 holiday.

What little comment you have received on this topic says something in itself.

[Jerry Winchester]

I hate to tell you Jim, but Prevost has my information. I have an account in their system and they list me as the owner (unfortunately) of two of coaches, so telling them that I am a POG member is okay with me. They can mail me an engraved invitation that smells like MangoMike at Latino Night and I will be happy to respond.

And I think we are looking at this the wrong way. I don't think anyone who has read more than one of my posts on this board doesn't think I am below having fun at the expense of others. And that being the case, let me think about this; French Canadians, PPs and other affiliated organizations are going to be in attendance?

IT'S THE FREAKING SUPER BOWL OF OPPORTUNIES TO JACK WITH THE UNANOINTED. Wake the hell up and see this for what it is; more fun that the law allows. Crap I might just retire after this one.

It's an opportunity made in heaven and I for one am ALL IN. Let the practical jokes begin. And I'm taking the masters with me, so Canada in 08 eh? MangoMike, the PlastiKrakster and JDUB are on it like stink on Lew.

Looks like we may need a seminar at Branson to weed out the bedwetters and handwringers......

[Jon Wehrenberg]

You're just trying to find someone to present the Viagra award to. You'll get some poor unsuspecting soul who doesn't know this is a group of people that put air in their own tires thinking you are completely serious.

I'm just concerned because if we end up going to war with Canada over your antics, half of Florida will have to close down this winter, and it will all be your fault. Eh?

[truk4u]

Count the plastic truckster in, Jdub trying to order taco's or ribs in French, priceless. I just stuck the big POG sticker on the front of the plasticmobile, so I'm ready.

Hopefully Jeep won't see any of this, the yellow thingy he drags around just won't cut it in Canada. Eh!

Jim, are you going to buy a bus or what? I need to get some of this heat off me, so if you don't buy something soon, you could be next in the barrel!:D

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

What's the hurry. It took Mango 9 months to find his baby.;)

[MangoMike]

Jim,

With a join date of March your only a few months away from Nirvana, so don't be offering Mango as an excuse past December.

Eh,
Mapquest says its 746 from DC to Prevost Central so it might be a deal. I've already started collecting the necessary 2 litre Diet Coke bottles with the plan of ringing the entire PP contingent (I can slither in and infiltrate since I'm a member) with the Mentos bombs timed for Happy Hour.

I'm pretty sure we can throw a Prevost wrapper around the truckster so he'll fit right in. And if that doesn't work will put one around his Plastic Fantastic SOB.

We're also tossing around some ideas that include low flying banner planes and massive amounts of magnetic LED's.

JDUB's right, this maybe the superbowl.
... and a good chance anyone from POG never gets invited back to the Motherland.

mm

[truk4u]

We might be surprised! Once the PP folks meet Mango, get their hat's, t-shirts and free jerk chicken invitations, I predict there will be some defectors coming on board POG.

Here's another suggestion: As the supreme POG/Stuff commanders, Lobster Boy and the Woodwacker should jump in the car and run up there to check out this rally thingy. Hey, it's only about 300 miles boys and what else do you have to do in Maine in the winter..:p

[Just Plain Jeff]

Nice idea resinmobileman. Done the trip many times.

There is a Big Deal Hotsy-Totsy Committee planning the Q08 deal, (BDHTCQ8) made up of Prevost Car, a converter, a rally master, etc. They keep notes and have agendas and all that stuff.

It seems that the only two things that they have agreed upon so far is the price range and the dates. Not all converters have come onboard yet, so y'all (trying to write like resinmobileman) are getting pretty fresh news here.

There are, of course, a lot of politics going on. Some other club that has been around for awhile has decided not to participate because they couldn't use their own stationery or collect the fees themselves.

My thinking about all of this is that it would be nifty to get a tour of the factory to see how the 80,000+ parts are bolted together. As to in-depth Q & Q and technical sessions, it doesn't really matter where their support is; they can come to our rallies? I've suggested a revolutionary idea to them and here it is, with my opinion added:

If you want to sell an idea to a geographically disbursed, but small groups of people, how about getting a bus, paint it up really nice, like with your company name on it and go to the various rallies and answer questions and show off your product on the public highways and at the rallies too? Y'know kinda like some bus manfacturers tell their customers?

The idea was shot down because it was, "too expensive."

Anyway, we're in the loop to hear the next step and have communicated same to BDHTCQ8. As soon as we hear back from them with some information, we'll post same right here.

[Will Garner]

Carole and I have been "on board" since the FMCA in Perry Ga this past March. In case any others did not get to go to the Prevost dinner you missed seeing thew first ever production Prevost, chassis #0001. It was a two mule drawn four wheel wagon with two leather covered bench seats! I thought it would be pretty neat to have some "rolling rallys" coming from different directions in the US of A. We could join up at designated points and all come together for a Canadian invasion of older Prevosts. I've Google mapped a route from Southern Pines NC and it measures out at 1,150 miles one way. My route went via I-73/74-US 220 to I-81 at Roanoke Va, to I-84 in Scranton Pa, to I-87 into Canada on their route AUT 15N, then Aut-30E, then Aut 20E, then Rte 173 S to Rte 277 and into Ste-Claire, QC, Canada. Somewhere along the routes we could all celebrate our Independence Day (some of us perhaps in Gettysburg PA on the 144th Anniversary of the battle, 3-4 July 1863) and then help the Quebecs celebrate their 400th birthday. How neat would that be? I doubt any of us will be around to help them celebrate their 500th birthday!

There are several possible layover spots on that route in/near Roanoke VA, Hagerstown MD, Scranton, PA, Albany NY, Saratoga Springs NY, Plattsburgh NY. I personally don't like motoring on I-95 anywhere and deliberately routed without using it (Carole and Kelly Jo had a really bad experience on it in May 2000. I came within inches of losing both of them). Anyway there are several other connecting Interstate routes that join up with or cross that route which could be used by POGgers coming from other states to meet up along the way. For example, Jon coming from Knoxville on I-40 can hook up with I-81 at Bristol and head north to a designated meet location. Someone from Ohio can use the PA Turnpike (I-76) and meet at a designated location near Carlisle PA. Same for I-80 near Hazelton PA; I-84 and I-87 near Newburgh NY; I-87 and I-90 in Albany; and so on. Anyone using I-95 can cross over to I-81 using I-270/I-70 out of DC to I-81 in Hagerstown MD. If someone wants to collaborate on the logistics I'll gladly work with them.

I think this may be a golden opportunity to show our strengths to Prevost, especially if we can work it out so that all of us arrive at Ste-Claire simultaneously!

Anybody have any shots back across the bow?

[lewpopp]

Looks like you have thought the route out pretty thouroughly. Now figure what the border people will do to a bunch of hotsh*ts in the fancy busses traveling trying to simultaneously arrive at the one destination.

I'll guarantee you that they will screw that group over with a fine toothed comb and hold up a large group of hotsh*ts just to be schmucks.

GUARANTEED !!!!

[phorner]

Hi to All. As one of the newest members, and not even yet owning a Prevost (however, I do expect that status to change within the next 30-60 days or so) I submit any comments with a bit of trepidation. Not sure I'm qualified to have a truly meaningful opinion.

However, that being said, I do believe that a healthy relationship between a manufacturer and end-user can benefit both parties substantially. It is my opinion, fo what it's worth, that Prevost Car should be treated with respect if we are to expect any in return and be thought of as a "legitimate" group to which they owe some loyality.

There is also much discussion as to the "other" group that may be in attendance at this event and whether POG members should "associate" with the likes. I, for one, prefer to form my own opinions based on how I am treated as an individual and not based on the perceptions of others.

I once owned a Safari ,which was a part of SMC, which also manufactured Beaver coaches. At our annual rally's, there were always comments made by the Safari group that the Beaver group was elitist and felt that they shouldn't have to "share" a rally with the lowly Safari owners. All Beaver owners were "rich" and "exculsive" yadda, yadda, yadda....

Anyway, I eventually purchased a Beaver coach and was treated very cooly by a lot of my Safari friends. Seemed I'd gone over to the dark side.

But, I decided to attend a couple of Beaver rally's to see what these folks were all about. Yep, some were just as we thought.... much too good to associate with those "Safari people". BUT the majority were really good people, just wanting to have a good time. They were'nt the demons after all.

Now that I've sucessfully bored you all with this tale, my opinion is that POG should thoughtfully consider it's future relationship with Prevost, prove to ALL on-lookers that we have some dignity and deserve some respect, and not merely blow off this event as if it means nothing to us, because, to a certain degree, it should. This discussion alone demonstrates that POG matters to Prevost. A good relationship with them can certainly be beneficial. By acknowledging their invitation, perhaps they can eventually be persuaded to contribute to the forum, or participate in a rally.

OK, now you can let me have it .......

[Just Plain Jeff]

This previous post demonstrates good adult wisdom, an open mind and an ability to think in a positive and creative fashion. For some of this, it is a new experience to hang out with people like this! Thanks for joining POG! (If we can help with that new coach, just let us know).

Over the years, my beautiful wife and I have attended a number of different types of rallies, held by different clubs and organizations. Other than the fact that I am basically anti-social, we have had mixed reactions to the rallies. We think back and remember so-and-so were fun, this event was pretty neat, and so on. And, we also can recall some of the others that for us were, "No way we are going back to that one."

So, you're right, it's best to reserve judgement and attend lots of different rallies, whether they are converter or manufacturer sponsored, or a bunch of people who decide to get together and make up their own outfit.

A wise man once told me that no matter where you are, if you look hard enough you can find at least one good person.

Best advice I ever got.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Mr. phorner....I am shocked that you would think this group could show some dignity and that we deserve respect.

It is the other group that has dignity and demands respect.

We are a bunch of misfits and gearheads that no one else will hang around with. To amuse ourselves there are some here that drop mints in coke bottles and dance around in the resultant spray in long johns.

We present each other with awards called Anal Awards and Viagra Awards.

We are an all inclusive group that lets anybody in (unlike some other groups that won't let you join unless you actually own a Prevost) no matter what they have or don't have. All they have to do is pony up $100 and they are in. How exclusive is that?

The other group has a bunch of nice folks in it and some are in this group, so there is already some mingling of the two groups.

Unlike the other group, when we get together some of this group gets down and dirty including engaging in serious discussions usually not held in public about personal matters that involve plumbing. I'm pretty sure if POG members go we won't be able to show any dignity, unless you would like to bring some. I haven't got any.

[Just Plain Jeff]

Aw geez, see what happens when they cancel the Lawrence Welk reruns for August?

Just about anything shows up on the internet.

OK. For Jon:

http://www.jillian.ca/LENNOW.JPG

What a guy has to do.

[MangoMike]

No dignity...

But we do have a good time.



1573


mm

[phorner]

Hey, I'm not saying that the basic philosophy should change a bit.... just that there could be a benefit to encourage a good relationship with Prevost.

I FIRMLY believe that a good time is of paramount importance at any rally.

Did I forget to mention that I have a 50 cal. cannon available? Kinda says you've ARRIVED at any event......

And my idea of formal attire is socks....

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Speaking of formal attire, If you haven't yet been warned let me be the first.....

If you wear a tie, its as good as gone.

I like the idea of a cannon. With a screwed up head like it sounds like you have you are going to do real well here.

PS: I don't think we have any issues with Prevost (except that they weren't too bright treating us like ugly stepchildren), it is just that they think we actually need them. It would be nice if they would help us with seminars and such.

[Just Plain Jeff]

Well it seems that Prevost does now want people to be happy in their facilities.

The old fiberglass chair they used to have in the waiting room has been upgraded:

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.prevostcar.com/DB/news/2006-09%2520Prevost%2520customer%2520lounge%2520012.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.prevostcar.com/cgi-bin/pages.cgi%3Fpage%3Dmedia%26newsid%3D1159885723&h=323&w=500&sz=43&hl=en&start=20&tbnid=WQRumaM43cdKYM:&tbnh=84&tbnw=130&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dprevost%26gbv%3D2%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3 Den

No Slide Out though.

[truk4u]

Your in like flin there Phorner, since your formal attire is socks, you and JPJ will bond well, his formal version is sandals with socks.:eek:

Now go get that bus so the abuse can start...:D

Respect - Wasn't that an Aretha Franklin song?:rolleyes:

[garyde]

Jon, was that dingy or dignity? And what's the difference. Anyway, I say lets all go out and buy Tux T-shirt and show up for the Prevost Ball!

[Just Plain Jeff]

We're back on the Quebec Rally 08:

UPDATE:

Thank you all for your comments. Here is what I have passed along:

We want to be open-minded, but the POG membership has some concerns:

1. It is difficult to make a commitment until we have more information about the rally itself. We'd like to see a schedule of the rally before making a commitment, either individually or as a group.

2. A price of $1500 for a rally is very high, unless there is something that is so compelling that it makes it worthwhile.

3. The rally, which is to coincide with the 400th Anniversary of the founding of Quebec, being back-to-back with the Fourth of July weekend, for US members, may create scheduling conflicts.

4. Are there other ways to provide Prevost information and fellowship instead of such a rally?

5. Some members do not wish to go to Canada for a rally.

BTW: There are some converters who are voicing exactly the same concerns to Prevost Car.

We have been told that the Committee will be addressing these concerns and 'they will get back to us.'

I'll take it as my assignment to post any tangible information as soon as we hear more.

Thanks again!

[Jon Wehrenberg]

We are all likely to use any excuse to go to a rally just so we get to use our coaches. That is what this is all about. Seeing how the coaches are made is a great experience. Paying $1500 for a few meals and a factory tour does not compute.

Paying $1500 to hear a 3 day sales pitch from the company that makes the shell that we are all likely convinced is the best shell is like preaching to the choir.

The whole thing doesn't make sense because of the question relating to what you get for the money as an attendee, and conversely, what is Prevost attempting to accomplish that has not already been done? Do they expect to write orders for new shells? are they going to introduce a four slide coach with and upstairs and downstairs?

[hhoppe]

Seeing how the coaches are made is a great experience.

There are some things in life you are better off not seeing. ie Watching babies being born and coaches being made. I have experianced two plant tours of the Monaco Plant in Coburg, OR. I personally would not want one of their plastic wonders under any circumstances. Ignorance is bliss on this subject. :D Put me down for not wanting to deal with the nasty Canadian Border Gestapo. No one is allowed to take my coach apart looking for something I told them is not there. That NAFTA BS is a one way operation.
Boy aren't I in a good mood this AM.

[dalej]

Harry, I'm have a hard time telling your and Lew's writings apart anymore! ;)

[rfoster]

HHH, I couldn't have said it better myself. Get A1 Jon to tell you about he and Di's experience with the Germans, - uh I mean Canadians.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

On our last (and I truly mean our LAST) trip to Canada) the Canadian customs folks decided to give us closer inspection. We were pulled into the inspection area and told to get out of the coach.

Two went in, and one worked the outside. I'll save the details but after 1 hour I went in to find out what was going on and the house was a shambles. They had pulled out drawers and emptied them, the LR furniture was pulled away from the walls, cabinets had been opened and stuff removed, etc. When I got in the coach one of the two was attempting to pry a panel off. It was a panel with touch latches and to open it all you had to do was push on it and it would spring open.

These wizards caught us...they had two bottles of wine on the table and because I did not declare them (they never asked if we had any alcohol, cigarettes, drugs, arms, etc. They just sent us to inspection) we were fined about $7.00 but on the back of the receipt was a huge message stamped on it that said if we ever were caught with contraband they would seize our conveyance.

It took us 45 minutes to get things back in place enough so we could travel again.

After I cancelled almost 1000 ton of steel orders, and my suppliers cried to whatever Canadian agency handles customs I got a big apoliogy from some official with the promise to remove my name and license plate from the computer system, but I never bought steel from Canada or went back. Don't need the BS.

[Toy Box]

Jon and friends... My experience crossing into Canada almost exactly mirrors yours some years ago in our 33' winnabago . We were kept waiting over two hours while the inspectors found zip... not that we had anything to hide anyway. It seems most of our neighbors ( read that other nations ) don't care for us, so we have decided to never and I mean never go or spend money in a foreign land. Besides, there is so much of our country that still needs to be seen and so many places in need of our fuel,food,and entertainment dollars. I really don't mind the price of a rally being 1000 or even 2000. We can spend that at a weekend race just watching. As you said, a good excuse to use the bus is any excuse. sorry, no international visits for us.

[Ray Davis]

Is the issue "where" you cross the border, or just "luck-of-the-draw"? Ken and Mike were among a group who went to Canada and back just last month, and I don't believe any of them had any issues at the border.

ray

[merle&louise]

I agree, see America first. This land is diverse and beautiful.

We drove to Calgary, Alberta in 1998 and had no problems crossing the border. They asked us a few questions and did not even come inside.:D
Canada was beautiful; Banff, Lake Louise, and the Calgary Stampede were something to see. I guess if I had a negative experience like you guys I wouldn't go back either.

We are planning a trip to Alaska next summer or maybe 2009; haven't decided if we will drive or fly. It is such a long way from south Louisiana (5000 miles one way). If we drive, we'll have to cross the border at some point so I guess we will make that decision when the time comes.

I am going to go to Quebec City to tour the Prevost Car facility next summer. I want to see how Prevosts are made (I'll pass on the Big Deal Rally 2008, too much money). I want to see the chassis/frame construction and how they do slides. So I guess I will have to endure the border officials at some point, hopefully it will go smoothly.

Au revoir!

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Ray, To answer your question from my perspective this was a random event.

We were located so close to the border that buying steel for example was no different than buying steel in Pittsburgh. I used to fly up routinely to meet with our suppliers or to meet with potential customers.

We drove into Canada in our car or bus often and a typical border crossing involved a few questions about where you were born or the nature of the visit.

I have no objection even to being singled out for a detailed search. What forever changed my opinion about a visit to our neighbor to the north was the surly attitude of the inspectors, their complete disregard for our property, and their apparent opinion that we were smuggling something even though we never got the usual questions, but instead were told to proceed to the inspection area.

It's bad enough we have to be inspected going into California in case I have a colony of fruit flies, or inspected in the middle of New Mexico in case I have a bus load of illegal aliens. I don't need the shabby treatment I got visiting a foreign country.

[hhoppe]

My friend traveling with 6 other RV's to Alaska had to stop at the Canadian border. He was singled out and it went like this. Do you have any guns with you. No. Do you own any guns. Yes. Where are they? at home. Where do you keep them at home? In a closet. Do yuo have any guns with you. no. They proceeded to tear his coach apart on a search. Found nothing. Then asked Have you ever been arrested? yes once for a long time ago for DUI. You will not be allowed to enter Canada without a letter from the Prime Minister allowing you to enter. My friend told the other RV's to go on their trip and he would go home. After a sound scolding they told him he could join the others on the trip. Which he did very reluctantly. Mexican authority's are not that brash. NAFTA is a bad joke on us. All this 5 years befor 9/11.

[phorner]

I gotta agree. We have no burning desire to cross borders at this point.

Too many great places we haven't spent enough time exploring right here in the good old USA.

If I wanted stress and hassles, I would have stayed working.... the pay was much better !!

[bluevost]

I have crossed the border into Canada 3 times, 2004, '06,'07 in my bus and I havn't had any problems at all, with the Canadian officials. Luck of the draw I guess. I did have an issue with one of the American guys back in 2004. Just returning from a 3 month trip to Alaska, and just after a "mad cow" incident in Canada, I had about 20 pounds of red meat confiscated and dumped in the trash can. Anything that wasn't in it's original wrapper from the super market. Of course I had vacume sealed all my meat before leaving home, so nothing was in the original wrappers. I agree with Jon, you don't mind being singled out and searched, as long as the guys show respect for you and your "stuff".

Still keeping an open mind for Quebec City in '08,

Ken

[lewpopp]

Well, well, well.. Mr Phorner (strange name, huh?) has the avitar of his new coach but hasn't posted any large pictures for the membership to see. If you don't, mr P, you will be in deep doo doo. Time to stop drinking the champagne and get to the important things.

[phorner]

Yeah, yeah, Lew, I've already been chastised.

Ya see, I wanted to see to it that SOMEONE SPECIAL got the first peek at the new home before I put them out there for public consumption.

So, once a certain individual, who shall remain nameless, has been privy to the FIRST PICTURES (and I can figure out how to post them), I'll be happy to oblige.

Hold yer horses.....

[rfoster]

Ray: Did I miss something in a previous post about a new Marathon coming to the Ray Davis Clan Soon? I think I saw a new signature, I did, I did. What is this ?? Mango, Jdub, and now Ray? Something is in the water? Marathon is on the move in POG:cool:

[rmboies]

Ray: Did I miss something in a previous post about a new Marathon coming to the Ray Davis Clan Soon? I think I saw a new signature, I did, I did. What is this ?? Mango, Jdub, and now Ray? Something is in the water? Marathon is on the move in POG:cool:

the heck with Canada, I noticed Ray's new sig line as well--wow Marathon is taking over, we feel lonely in our Millennium!! So Ray, spill, new bus or just teasing us??:D

[Ray Davis]

Well, it's coming soon. If all goes well I will be picking up a 2002 XL2 Marathon on October 8-9th. (just in time to miss POG4). Still have not seen the coach in person, but have looked at a thousand pictures. Am heading out to Dallas on October 8th, and have agreed with seller, that if all is as advertised, I will finish the paperwork there, and take delivery on the 9th.

Thanks to JPJ for hooking me up with Tommy Spirito on the financing. That worked wonderfully well.

My bus is for sale with Steve Bennett at California Coach. I'm "sorta" in the two bus club, but sorta not. The previous owner has graciously agreed to become lienholder on my current bus, and take the remainder of the purchase price when my bus sells!


Ray

[truk4u]

Ray you rascal, your really putting some pressure on the Truk!:o I hope it all works out for you, sounds like a great deal with the previous owner helping out.

You know becoming a member of the two bus club includes the occasional airstrike!:D

Congratulation, I'm really happy for you....

[JIM CHALOUPKA]

Congratulations Ray, and to think last winter you were not interested in a new bus. Thing sure can change fast.

I guess your now in the 1 1/2 bus club, from what you said. :D


Enjoy, it looks like a beauty. You have started something new here, catalog bus buying. Ha,Ha.;)

[rbeecher]

Ray,

Congratulations!

Glad to see you didn't let the Marathon recall scare you off! Were you able to get one of the early appointments to get the recall fixes done?

Can't wait to see the pictures.

I have to admit, we were originally a little scared off by the recall but after a lengthy conversation with Mango, plus countless emails to JDUB and Truk, we decided to go ahead anyway. I sure hope we made the right decision! We have serious reservations about selling our Vogue as it has turned out to be a heck of a bus but the XLII kept staring back at us everytime we looked at it.

I never thought we'd be a member of the OBC let alone the TBC. We used Tommy also as he is close and treated us very well. As a result, he has a new source for business in Marathon Coach so he has had a good couple of weeks. Our thanks to JPJ and this great site.

Don't forget the pictures!

Richard Beecher
2002 XLII Marathon

[Jon Wehrenberg]

OK, Truk. Now you should start feeling bad.

It seems like anyone that wants a bus can find one. In fact it appears so easy that even a Texan can find a new bus.

Are you and JIm and Gary all going to form the no bus club or are you going to get your butt in gear and start looking. Just a clue here....they aren't free and you will have to dig up some of that buried cash in your back yard.

[rfoster]

Richard: What's this? Another new Bus owner at POG with a Marathon. Pictures are required to remain in good standing. Otherwise a hazing may be in order.

All jokes aside- Congratulations on your new coach. I know you and the Ms are excited. Can't wait to see it.
You can't hide money.:cool:

[rbeecher]

Roger and Jon,

We looked at Parliament, Liberty, and Marathon XLIIs plus a bunch of XLs. I'm still having trouble getting the XL look out of my head, it is truely a classic. I would love to keep the Vogue but can't justify doing so.

This all started when an XLII Parliament was parked next to us one morning in Tampa while we were there for some service. Barbara says 'that's a nice looking bus, I like it'. Of course I said, 'well, let's ask them if we can see the inside' which turned out not to be our style. We had now started the process and there seemed to be no looking back. We learned a lot in our search and had some great help from the POG group.

Jon, don't be to hard on Truk, at least he has been busy helping the rest of us buy new busses. As for Jim and Gary, well, I can't htink of a better time to be looking at "Certified pre-owned busses" as there are now some good ones out there. Roger, ever thought about opening a pre-owned bus division at Parkway?

Not for lack of trying but we won't be in Branson due to our schedule. We'll get some pictures out soon.

Richard

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Richard,

I think Truk is slowly disappearing from the ranks of this august group. He is falling in love with his "plastic palace" and privately he is mentioning things like costs per square foot, and how he can't tell the difference when he is asleep.

Why can't he be like the rest of us and lose his coach through fires or other natural disasters. To lose his interest in a Prevost from smelling the formaldahyde in the walls of his "sticks and staples" is almost a crime.

[truk4u]

Damn, Truk is in Nashville with the plastic truckster for just a day or two of music and and A-1 puts an airstrike on him when the suns in his eyes!:eek: Now you boys just haven't RV'd until you smell the resin, balsa wood, glue and staples.

Just topped off today with 18 gallon of propane, see how far behind you weenies are, you were just yaking about how to use propane for fuel savings and the plastic truckster is already there!

OK, gotta go, someone at the door wanting a tour of the ResinMobile and some advice about adding corn silk to their fuel system.

[mikedee]

I have been away from the group for a couple weeks, we start almond processing in California during the last week of August and my 140 processors have keep me busy day and night keeping them going.

I read all the comments about the 08 rally and would like to attend. A $1,000.00 or more is a lot but I agree with Jerry, let's wait for the program.

1. If I were Prevost I would invite everybody I could think of and search my database for names and address. Invite owners as customers not as members of a group. Some owners are not members of any group. Invite them by mail, have their local Prevost service writer’s call to personally ask them to come, do all the marketing you can for the event.

2. Have things on the program for everyone, manufactures like me, technical, shopping for my wife, maybe golf, history, French class, what ever is great in Quebec.

3. Present every attendee with a coupon good for an oil change, fuel filter etc. service at a Prevost center value maybe $500.00. I would want everyone coming to the centers for service after they left the plant, great profit area for Prevost and good way to maintain client contact.

Ray,
You will love your new coach, good job.

We are going to Vegas the 21st for the truck race, still spots on motor home hill if anyone is looking for something to do.

[rbeecher]

Richard,

I think Truk is slowly disappearing from the ranks of this august group. He is falling in love with his "plastic palace" and privately he is mentioning things like costs per square foot, and how he can't tell the difference when he is asleep.

Why can't he be like the rest of us and lose his coach through fires or other natural disasters. To lose his interest in a Prevost from smelling the formaldahyde in the walls of his "sticks and staples" is almost a crime.

Jon, don't know if you are aware but you and Tom have a lot in common. He has a plastic and wood coach with probably a fair amount of horsepower to move it along, with, most likely, a good helping of torque. You have THE PLASTIC FANTASTIC which is glued together, has wood floors and lots of power and torque.

Sorry for the digression.

While Truk may be doing well with his therapy given he is attending various POG "help sessions" along with encouraging others to buy new busses, he is having difficulty. He has not admitted to having MPD which is most disturbing and is why I share your concerns for his well being. His deep depression is dealt with by staying in bed all day and sleeping so he does not have to deal with the real problem. I agree the fumes are surely causing further dillusions.

Since the two of you have so much in common and you must therefore understand each other, perhaps taking Truk out for some BUS SHOPPING would be just the thing.

Richard
2002 Marathon XLII
1996 Vogue 40 FOR SALE

[Just Plain Jeff]

Ahem.

Just heard from Prevost Car. Here's the update on Quebec 08:

They hope to have a working agenda of the event by the end of this month (that would be September in my calendar).

Will advise as information is received.