Coach floorplan and mechanical questions

[GDeen]

Hi, new to the forum - introduced myself in the newbie section...

In looking for a coach, I have kindof come down to a Prevost conversion or a Newell. My wife really liked the 1.5 bath layout in a Monaco we leased last year - let the kids and guests conduct potty warfare in their own toilet room while preserving the rear master for her majesty's secret service.

Question - are there many bath and a half Prevost conversions out there? Newell makes one which is one of the attractions to their product, but I have yet to see a Prevost like that.

Also, I have read through some of the turning radius discussions here - Am I being overly concerned about turning radius with the 45' bus? Attraction number two on the later model Newells is the steerable tag which gives a reported 37' radius. How important or unimportant do you find that generally?

Thanks for your help. BTW, I realize this is a Prevost forum and my questions about Newell are purely just for my own education. If that is not appropriate here just let me know and I shall cease. My gut tells me more durable and bullet proof is the Prevost, but the Newell has a couple of attractive features.
Thanks!

[Joe Cannarozzi]

There are some bath and 1/2 prevo out there but VERY FEW.

I can appreciate the importance of the right floorplan and I'm sure if anyone can help with this search your in the right place. I think I remember Marathon having a bath and 1/2 but is was a new one, check their web site.

We have a second head, up front right behind the driver, it originally was a VIP Charter, can't wait to loose it for an upgraded cockpit eventually. Although it would be very convienient for entertaining it's usually just Deb and I, we only have a 40 and it effectivly robs us uf 6ft of bus when camping not to mention isolating me from everything when underway.

IMHO a steerable tag is just another in a long list of clever but unessessary features, not to mention the additional cost and potential problems down the road.

If turning radius is important to you get a 45 with independent front suspention, It boasts a tighter turning radius and you can simply dump the air in the tag suspension to help further, and they all can do that.

Welcome to the group.

What should we call you?

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Joe is one of the good guys. You can believe what he says. Watch out for the guys from OSU (not Ohio, but the Indian territory)

[Jerry Winchester]

Jon, that was way harsh. Don't you have some Corvette issues to deal with or a tractor to grease?

And the only two bath and a half coaches I have seen are the Newell and Joe's, so that consistant with everyone else.

[GDeen]

Definitely have concerns over the steerable tag reliability deal. That also goes into the category of concerns over slides also. They sure seem nice for the added space as long as you accept the risk of failure or much more maintenance down the road. Guess it just boils down to what one "needs' the most in a coach. Same goes for the 1 1/2 baths - just boils down to what one puts on the final list of "have to haves."

[merle&louise]

GDeen,

My Newell has the rear bath + half bath option, and we love it. It also has 2 slides, and we love that option as well. If you are interested in a bus with slides, I would recommend one with electric rather than hydraulic slides. The reason is that if a hydraulic hose bursts - you have a big mess inside the coach. My coach has hydraulic slides and the only problem I have had is 2 solenoids needed changing after 8 years of use. I like my slides; they added room and livability. The down side to slides is when they do malfunction it can be costly. I know that changing a front slide gasket (at Newell) can cost $3500+ and a rear gasket can cost $1500 :eek:

Jon and others have posted that gaskets should be changed about every 5 years; so you can do the math. Slides can be expensive. I have been lucky, mine are working great and my front slide gasket is 9 years old. With my luck, it will crap out next time I use the coach!:eek:

The steering tag axle is nothing new, Vogue was using steering tag axles many years ago. I do not know anything about the reliability of steering tags on Newells presently; nor am I familiar with the reliability on the Vogues. I hope that I have helped you with my limited knowledge.

If you have any more questions, ask away:D

[GDeen]

Thanks Tuga. Good info. Are you generally happy with your Newell? Is the drivetrain, chassis, and structure as stout as a Prevost?

I see you are from Houma. My Dad's people were from Lake Charles and my Mother is a Yankee from Ruston. I was born in New Orleans, but we moved to Oklahoma when I was very young. Spent some time in Morgan City, Houma, and Lafayette when working offshore though.

Thanks for your help.

[merle&louise]

Gordon,

This is my 3rd Newell, so yes I am happy with this coach. I am really not qualified to answer your question about if a Newell is as "stout" as a Prevost. Let's let your research answer that question.

There is one thing about my Newell that I am not happy with; the AC. I have 2 basement ACs which have double compressors (14,000 BTU each) plus a great dash AC unit. In very hot temps (100+) the inside of the coach is cool not cold. I think that the OTR (over the road AC) in a Prevost is superior to Newells basement ACs. However, with the dash AC and the basement ACs running I have never been uncomfortable. Some people (like Jon) like the inside of the bus to be very cold; Newell won't give you that kind of cold without OTR AC, in my opinion.

Let me say that I have had in the past and to this minute have MPD. Mad Prevost Disease! I think that an XL II with stainless steel gleaming is the prettiest motorcoach on the road; I love them! They are stately looking and there is nothing out there to compare in the sheer beauty department.
I really get excited everytime I see one; just ask my wife!:D There is just something about a Prevost that says - No. 1.

I am looking forward to meeting you, perhaps at the POG V rally. We will not be able to attend POG IV in Branson because of a wedding that my wife's daughter is serving in during October.

[GDeen]

Thanks Tuga - A/C is a big deal to me. I like it cold!! That is a serious issue indeed.

Is this an XLII of the type you like? This is a nice looking 03 Country Coach over on Staley Coach's website. Love the paint and stainless. Very nice looking unit inside and out.

[Joe Cannarozzi]

Does C.C. use the Prevo OTR A/C? I'm not sure but I don't think so.

That gourgous bus you pictured does not have the louvered 3rd bay door where the condensor for the system usually resides.

Keep lookin;)

[merle&louise]

Thanks Tuga - A/C is a big deal to me. I like it cold!! That is a serious issue indeed.

Is this an XLII of the type you like? This is a nice looking 03 Country Coach over on Staley Coach's website. Love the paint and stainless. Very nice looking unit inside and out.

Gordon,

That's what POG is for; helping members learn more.

That CC looks beautiful; does it have any slides? OTR AC?

You might want to get together with some of the Country Coach guys and they can give you some more info. I'll try to list them from memory: Mike Simmons, DaleJ, Ken Zitter, Denny, JamesJ, Jim Keller, Mike Kerley, Ray Davis, Reelentless, Will Garner. If I have left anyone out, I apologize; my memory is not what it used to be.

I have spoken with Mike Simmons (Buster) and he has told me that he likes the simplicity of the systems on his CC. I have also heard some negatives about CC service; one CC owner had AC problems and CC told him to come by in 4 months for AC service (not good). So you will hear good and bad; ultimately, it is your decision. Just take your time and ask a lot of questions.:D

[garylstevens]

Now that is what I call a GEORGEOUS XLII.

It even has an electric 60" Drop Down TV Projection Screen in the Salon, WOW wish it was in my budget. :mad: and a make-up area sit down for Peg in the bedroom, for when we are attending Formal POG Affairs ? :confused:

Hey Joe, there is a picture on the Staley site, that shows what looks like a small radiator, could that be CC's version of OTR A/C? I have heard that some of the newer CC prevosts have OTR air?

Hey Tuga, this beauty has two slides, just look at the pictures, they say it all !!!! http://www.staleycoach.com/48727.htm



Gary S

[garylstevens]

Hey did anybody notice, that our names and #'s of posts has changed, since the revamp of the Prevost-Stuff web site? Or was it something I did ??? AGAIN :eek::confused:

Gary S

[garyde]

Thanks Tuga - A/C is a big deal to me. I like it cold!! That is a serious issue indeed.

Is this an XLII of the type you like? This is a nice looking 03 Country Coach over on Staley Coach's website. Love the paint and stainless. Very nice looking unit inside and out.

Country Coach has their own version of OTR but it is not Prevost Factory OTR. That is what you want. CC has very nice Graphics. My own experience is exterior graphics, and interior design will be the first items which draws you to a Coach.

[GDeen]

Thanks fellas - learning a lot here.

So Garyde - the Prevost OTR air is far above the others?

It is a good looking coach isn't it Gary S?

Tuga - as the man said, 2 slides. Nice looking interior to boot. Overall very nice but clearly lacking the Prevost OTR air.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

The advantage of OTR is its ability to bring the heat soaked coach down to a comfortable temperature in a relatively short period of time and then maintain that temperature regardless of the outside temperature.

It is strictly for use while traveling and does not assure comfortable temperatures while parked in a campground.

From personal experience I know Cruise Airs do not work well while traveling on hot highways, but they work very well when parked. I also know roof air units work well while traveling if enough can be run at the same time to overcome the outside temperatures.

If OTR is a requirement then the list of coaches is reduced to Liberty and a few rare ones from other converters.

[merle&louise]

GaryS and Gordon,

The XLII CC on Staleys website is nice, but it is out of my price range by about 300%. It sure would make a nice Xmas present tough.

Gordon, one thing about OTR air, I spoke to a fellow POG member at POG II in Santa Fe (Carl ?) and he had to replace the compressor on his bus. He told me that the compressor cost $2500 plus the labor to change it.:eek:

Some Marathons have a different type of cooling which does not use the Prevost OTR air but instead uses smaller automotive type AC compressors in the center and rear of the bus as well as in the dash. This seems to me as the best option; you have the redunduncy of 2 compressors without the high cost of potential replacement of one large one. I think that some of the '94 vintage of Marathons had this arrangement. If you search the posts of PetervS you can read how this arrangement works.

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Before casting stones at the replacement cost of the OTR compressor it should be noted that the compressor was built to be fully field serviceable.

A new or rebuilt replacement is in the price range Tuga cites, but in order of frequency the typical repair required is a replacement of the seal behind the clutch or the replacement of the internal reed valves.

The system can be shut down to isolate the compressor, and to replace the seal or the reed valves is a half day task at worst. Once repaired the compressor can be vacuumed to remove all moisture and a small replacement charge can be added to compensate for the small amount lost when the compressor was opened.

My point is that Prevost or a repair facility will be tickled to sell you a new compressor, but rarely will that be required. I know the current customer choice is a converter installed AC system for all sorts of reasons, but the cost to maintain the Prevost system is not one of them.

[Denny]

Gordon,
CC uses their own OTR air rather than Prevost because the Prevost ac is designed to cool a bus with 50 furnaces (people) in it rather than 2. It also takes a lot more horsepower to run which relates to less engine efficiencies.

Over the years CC has had some problems under the leadership of its past owner, National RV, but now that Bob Lee is involved once again with CC that may change.

As far as service, yes, a POGer did have a problem with the service dept. but that has to be looked at in the proper prospective. I live 2500 miles from Junction City so I am not concerned about a wait time for service. There are many authorized CC service centers much closer to me than the factory. Many truck service centers, Freightliner, Kenworth, Detroit Diesel, etc. are within 15 minutes of my home and they work on buses.

CC factory tech. support is also available. I have used is several times with great satisfaction.

As previously stated, many CC systems are a lot less complicated than other converters. Roof airs, for example, are used by CC. They are almost bullet proof. They cool and have a heat pump in them for limited heating purposes. If one fails, replace it for lot less $$$ than other complicated systems.

I have had my coach for nearly a year and am very satisfied with it.

Denny

[GDeen]

Thanks for all the info fellas....

So, last year in Utah when we were parked next to a Prevost / Featherlite bus and had to spend our outside time on the drivers side of our rv due to the hot air blowing out of the Prevost basement drivers side - is that cruiseair at work?? Does that type of arrangement take up lots of basement storage that is freed up by using roof air?

(By the way, now that I know what MPD is I believe I can trace the beginnings of my affliction to that very day - pulling our camper up next to that regal piece of work - one of my sons said "are you going to get one like this when you grow up dad?" I just walked circles around it checking it out.)

[Jon Wehrenberg]

Cruise Air units do discharge warm air under the coach. However, some converters use "packages" for their AC needs such as those that might be used for a home or apartment. They also discharge warm air under the coach.

Typically a Cruise Air equipped coach has 2 or three condenser units located behind the front bumper, and possibly two located midships in the center of the coach.

These spaces are of course useable, but they are of limited value because they are not conveniently located for user access. Roof air units make all this space available and do not discharge hot air beneath the coach. The downside to roof air is reported by some owners as increased interior noise levels.